I have looked and reread the other post about reloading for a 470NE. I have a simple question, please do not add anything that makes it more confusing.
I live in Central Texas 20F to 95F. R15 does not do well going from these temp extremes. I want to use IMR 4831 without a filler using:
400 gr Hornady XTP's
500 gr Woodleigh's
What is a SAFE starting load and MAX load for these 2 rounds?

quote:

What is a SAFE starting load and MAX load for these 2 rounds?

On the 500gr 470, A2 indicates:

Max Avg. = 39,187psi

102.0gr | IMR 4831 | 2045 fps | 30,200psi
109.5gr | IMR 4831 | 2145 fps | 37,000psi

Back off of the lowest load accordingly, and work up your particular lot of powder, bullets, brass, primers, etc... to velocity on the chronograph.

Different bullets, different rifles, different lots of the same powder all contribute to different recipes for a "max" load.

This is why you really need to use a chronograph.

Rine,

I use 102 grs Imr 4831 in my 28" barrel Evans. It regules well at 2050 fps.

I live in Dallas and haven't noticed any issues with temp with 4831. I also had the gun in the Zambezi valley at the end of October which makes Texas feel like the North Pole. There were no problems there either.

I'd start at 100grs with 500gr bullets and work up from there. Remember, there will be substantial differences in lots of powder. Buy an 8lb keg so once you get the load figured out you have plenty of powder. 4831 didn't work well for me with lighter bullets. I had a lot of unburned powder left in the barrel.

Listen to New Guy. I bought a Merkel from him a while back and he sent me all the information about reloading for Doubles and I have had no problems using his recommendations.

I used H4831SC with great sucess with Woodleighs and AA5744 with lead bullets for easy shooting practice loads.

Mike

IMR4831 will have worse temperature variation than RL-15. BTW RL-15 is about average and not bad.

You would be better off with H4831 or H4831SC which ever fits best to fill the case with your bullet and which ever you prefer, either will do at same charge weight, and either has to be weighed precisely for a DR. SC meters better but you still have to dribble grains either way. This will be a slightly greater charge weight with the H-variety than with the IMR-variety of 4831. 108 to 110 grains of H4831 usually gets it with most rifles, cases, and 500-grain bullet types.

Thanks. Thats what I thought but since I started 10% less the barrels where 8 inches apart at 50 yards so I panicked. I have a chrono so no worries there.

quote:

Originally posted by new_guy:

quote:

What is a SAFE starting load and MAX load for these 2 rounds?

On the 500gr 470, A2 indicates:

Max Avg. = 39,187psi

102.0gr | IMR 4831 | 2045 fps | 30,200psi
109.5gr | IMR 4831 | 2145 fps | 37,000psi

Back off of the lowest load accordingly, and work up your particular lot of powder, bullets, brass, primers, etc... to velocity on the chronograph.

Different bullets, different rifles, different lots of the same powder all contribute to different recipes for a "max" load.

This is why you really need to use a chronograph.

You did not say what brand of rifle or barrel length you are loading for but my 24" barreled Searcy was regulated for 106 grains of IMR-4831 with Woodleigh 500 grain bullets. That load in my rifle went 2,105 fps. and the bullets landed 2" apart. I then loaded 110 grains of H-4831 with the same bullet and they went 2,148 and landed in the same hole. If you have an older English rifle it will most likely regulated at some where around 2,050 fps. I would start with 102 grains of IMR-4831 or 105 grains of H-4831 and work up to regulation. If it isn't cross firing and you want the bullets to land closer add powder, 1 grain at a time or reduce powder if they are cross firing. I agree with RIP that H-4831 is the way to go as it is much more temperature insensitive than other powders.

465H&H

The H4831sc is the least temperature sensitive out of the lot of powders discussed here.

For working up a load, I have seen recommendations to back off 10% and work up. My own opinion is that's a bit extreme. For my purposes, 5% off of a published max load provides more than enough cushion.

As for a max load, each powder, lot and rifle for that matter are different. If the shots start to cross, you have gone beyond the max load for the regulation of the rifle. If the cases show pressure signs (primer craters, etc) you are well beyond the max load.

Rhine

With the 400gr Hornady bullet I would start woith 75gr of IMR 3031, and work up.

In several 470's with a 350gr Hawk bullet 80grains regulated and hit with the sights.

YOU MUST USE FILLER WITH IMR 3031. 5 grains of dacron is the normal amount.

I use 81 gr of IMR 3031, 5 grains of poly, with 350 Hornadys in my 450 No2.

I have had no problems with this load from below 32*F to over 100*F.

quote:

Originally posted by new_guy:

Different bullets, different rifles, different lots of the same powder all contribute to different recipes for a "max" load.

This is why you really need to use a chronograph.

Bingo.

I loaded up RL-15 and a Kynoch wad to get the velocities I wanted. My Krieghoff shoots 500 grain bullets to pretty much the same place regardless of bullet brand or velocity. I figure it's the sign of a well-regulated, stiff barrel double!