Well, figured this was the place to ask a silly question:

I just picked up my Baikal .30-06 double from my local gunsmith. He did a trigger job, added two inches to the stock and installed a peep site for me. All good!
During the ensuing conversation he pulls out a vintage Greener 450NE double for me to have play with. He tells me he has had it since he was about 19 (he is 70 odd now) when he went to work for H&H and got it cheap. Unfortunately, (and this is where you will want to cry) in order to keep it, he milled out the barrels to a 20g shotgun

As we were talking about me going to Africa to hunt, we started talking about maybe resurrecting it into a proper double again. He knows he can do all the work, the regulating, etc. What he is not sure about is getting the barrels to replace the milled out ones.

So, can it be done? Is it worth it? If I could get it redone in 450/400 for a reasonable sum, I think it would really be something. His only criteria?? If we do it, I have to make sure I keep it long enough to pass to my son!

THoughts?!

If the rest of the rifle is in good shape, and he could do the work, it would certainly be worth it to invest in a new set of barrels, I would think. Or, to keep all the authenticity of the original, one could use the original barrels as sleeves for new inserts in a useful DR caliber.

If inserts will work, then that seems the most practical way.

A lot needs to be investigated before you have him do that..It would worry me that he has to ask such questions..

I think it can be done and the barrels are certainly available from most barrel makers. YOu will probably need monoblocks ribs etc.

A new set of barrels such as you are talking arount run about $8000 up from the double gun makers.

Have you considered putting liners in the bored out barrels? A friend (who is doing most of the work) and I are just completing a project very similar to what you describe.

I bought a British combination gun that looked like a typical jones underlever hammer double rifle. One barrel was .500 BPE and the other smooth bored but also chambered for .500 BPE. Bores were bad so we decided to reline it with hammer forged .50 cal liners. We've had work at re-regulating it as it crossed badly when test fired. This is nearly completed and I'll have a very nice rifle with new bores.

I suspect that our regulation issues were a result of the gun having originally been regulated for a round ball in the smooth barrel. Since the Greener you describe was rifled in both barrels, it may not require as much tinkering to get it shooting properly. Another friend relined a .450 BPE and got it to shoot well without the problems that I've experienced.

No idea if rifled liners are available there, but a good machinist could easily turn down barrel blanks. We turned the liners down 10 thousanths from the muzzles back to 8 inches from the breech end to create a step that effectively holds the liner in place when the rifle is closed. When the extractors are fitted we'll glue the liners in with loctite.

The pressures you'd get with a 450/400 would be greater than I'm getting with a .500 BPE using nitro for black loads, but I'm sure someone here can tell you if it would be a problem. Good luck!

I like the idea of inserts. Keeping the original barrels makes it still the same gun (unlike Washinton's axe; head has been replaced twice and the handle three times, but its still his axe!)

Where does one source said inserts in the US?? And, just because I'm not knowledable about such things, do they come rifled and chambered, or just rifled?? My man said he would chamber it to whatever I wanted. It was originally proofed for .450NE but I think I would prefere .450/400 (only based on what I have read here on AR!)

Ray, its me asking the silly questions. He was just going to call his old mates at H&H and order new barrels. I want to do it cheaper/easier and keep it more original.

I am by no means an expert on the subject of double rifle resurection or refurbishing or bbl lining.

However I have heard some scary stories concerning "lining" or "inserts".

One case was an old Rigby .450NE 3-1/4".

A PH in Africa had his grandpaw's old double rifle and wanted to use it, but the chambers were badly pitted and the bores were very worn.

He sent the rifle to a name gunsmith in London to have the rifle refurbished and the bbls sleeved/lined.

Long story short, he got it back, fired less than 12 times and the right barrel blew up!

I am not a gunsmith, so I will not try say what exactly caused the blow up.


But it seems to me like a very risky and unsafe undertaking to "line" or "sleeve" the bbls.

I would recomend having a completely new set of rifle barrels made and keeping the existing 20bore bbls for bird shooting.

Just my humble opinion.

Good luck whatever path you choose.

BC,
Might give Arthur Smith in Colchester a call and see if he can make up a pair of chopperlump barrels in the white for you and chamber them for whatever caliber you fix on.

Don't know if Arthur is still making barrels (he did for Purdey at one point). If you are interested send me a PM and I'll PM you his phone number. NOTE: You must/must get Arthur to commit to a date certain.

Barrels in the white can be mailed into the USA with no problem if that's where the rifle will eventually be made up.

Regards, Tim

Tim, PM sent!

Just Google "rifled barrel liners" and you should get some info. My gunsmith friend uses TJ's liners and has lined several dozen rifles. He likes them because they are hammer forged and extremely smooth inside. Nearly all his line jobs have been on lower pressure rimmed calibers. As I suggested, do some homework and find out if pressure is an issue. The liner makers should be able to tell you if it is safe.

A number of threads on this site describe making rifles from shotguns via cutting off the shotgun barrels and sleeving the monoblock with rifle barrels.

Full length sleeving does the same thing with the exception of preserving the original barrels, ribs, etc, as well as the original convergence that was built into the rifle. In this case you'd also be starting with a rifle action so that shouldn't be a safety concern.

Full length sleeving of shotguns is done in England by Teague. Usually done to high end guns in order to preserve originality. The guns are then nitro proofed as the barrels are essentially modern steel.

Nemo, I agree as to "what exactly caused the blow up". As a young guy I had an Uncle who nearly bled to death when his modern Winchester shotgun blew up and cut his neck very badly. The gun was blamed until someone found a few 20 ga shells mixed in with his 12 ga in his shell bag. You never know!

I'm not advocating doing this, just throwing it out as a possible solution that can be researched.

I would suggest calling richard show in pa. I dont have his number on hand but it has been posted in this forum in the last year