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I was wondering if 500NE shooters get the same POI with both the Woodleigh and NF solids? I think this barrels steel or bore does not like Moly coated bullets in that possibly the Moly does not stick evenly to the bore.I repeteadly get a very good group for the first 4 shots out of a clean bore and then it starts to spray them all over even at 25yds off the bench.I was thinking of using uncoated bullets instead and also giving NF a try.It could be that Moly is not the issue but at this point that is what I suspect.The next time at the range I will shoot over 4 rds with uncoated and see if this solves the problem.I tried Myle's early model Ruger 416 Rigby while in Africa last week and it was amazingly accurate.I shot 4 rds(Woodleigh softs) off the bench at 50yds with open sights and it would shoot within an inch-even in the low early morning light. | ||
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I don't know about moly coating but, my Searcy in 470 did not like Woodleigh's very much at all. It shot Triple shocks, cutting edge and hornady very well. | |||
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Good to know,thanks! | |||
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In most cases after 4 shots with the 500 N.E.s accuracy tends to deteriorate due to human error!  Accuracy normally has to do with the individual barrels, keep in mind that any "double" will only shoot as well as its WORST barrel. So shoot the worst barrel when testing them is a good start. Most, and I said "most" doubles shoot best with Woodleigh bullets, and that's a fact inasmuch as the Woodleigh was designed from the old Kynochs of yesterday which were used to regulate the older English guns..Most of todays doubles are regulated with Woodleighs unless they are custom guns on special order.. Playing with doubles, as opposed to bolt guns etc., and trying to make them shoot bullets other than what they were regulated with is a chore at best and usually an excise in futility, and it has no real significance for their intended use. But its a great way to pass the time of day, and I have played with them hours on end, even to the point of developing lead loads and turkey loads.. BTW, having shot a lot of Searcys and owning more than a few I have never owned one that didn't shoot Woodleighs best of all, not saying some of them won't but it is the exception to the rule IMO... Searcys used to be regulated with Woodleigh bullets and certain handloads and at high velocity I might add, but todays Searcys I understand are regulated with Hornady factory ammo..that being the case if you down load your Searcy it will very probably shoot Woodleighs best as the Hornady stuff is very mild. I also have been told that HOrnady uses Woodleigh bullets? Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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I found that Woodleigh RN solids, Woodleigh Hydros, CEB #13 and NF solids all shot to the same exact point from my Searcy 470 and my Genshow 465 H&H. 465H&H | |||
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My Searcy in 470 was regulated with both Hornady factory and Hornady DGX using 106gr of IMR4831 which is Butch's favorite load with the 470. I don't know what his favorite load is with the 500NE. My Verney Carron 500NE shoots great with 105gr of IMR4350 and about any 570gr bullet. With the CEB Raptors and solids (475gr Raptor and 510gr solid) it grouped the best with 107gr of RL15 and you don't need a filler. Sam Rose has a lot of load data for the 500NE. | |||
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Hornady uses Hornady DGS and DGX bullets, not Woodleigh! I've never found a Woodleigh bullet in any of my doubles to shoot better than monometals. They all shoot extremely well with whatever bullet I've loaded for it. I've easily worked up loads for my two 500NE (Merkel and VC) with Barnes TSX & Banded Solis, Northfork Flatnosed Solids, and CEB BB#13 Solids and Non-Con. CEBs for my 577NE VC. The only rifle I had trouble with was the Chapius 9.3x74R and that was ONLY with the scope attached, something the rifle was NOT regulated with. Without the scope, that rifle shoots just about anything you feed it from TSX, Banded Solids, CEB Solids and Raptors, etc. No, working up a load for a double with bullets other than what it was regulated with is NOT an exercise in futility. Far from it. Where do you get this stuff Ray? Good grief man!  | |||
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In my limited experience, I can't tell the difference as to accuracy. That may be due to I'm a poor shot or many of us expect pinpoint accuracy when shooting an open sighted large caliber and heavy kicking double rifle. I've shot Woodleigh, Barnes, old Barnes, original Kynoch, lead, NF, and Alaska Bullet Works and I can't tell one target from the other if the weight and diameter and velocity is the same. I favor Woodleigh as they just look right in a vintage double. Cheers, gents. Cal _______________________________ Cal Pappas, Willow, Alaska www.CalPappas.com www.CalPappas.blogspot.com 1994 Zimbabwe 1997 Zimbabwe 1998 Zimbabwe 1999 Zimbabwe 1999 Namibia, Botswana, Zambia--vacation 2000 Australia 2002 South Africa 2003 South Africa 2003 Zimbabwe 2005 South Africa 2005 Zimbabwe 2006 Tanzania 2006 Zimbabwe--vacation 2007 Zimbabwe--vacation 2008 Zimbabwe 2012 Australia 2013 South Africa 2013 Zimbabwe 2013 Australia 2016 Zimbabwe 2017 Zimbabwe 2018 South Africa 2018 Zimbabwe--vacation 2019 South Africa 2019 Botswana 2019 Zimbabwe vacation 2021 South Africa 2021 South Africa (2nd hunt a month later) ______________________________ | |||
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I have shot my 450 No2, 450/400 3 1/4, and my 9,3x74R over 50 rounds in a single day many times. I have never noticed any decline in accuracy. Think about it, that is only 25 rounds per barrel... DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
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I've never done any serious load development or target shooting with my double .500NE. I've happily and successfully used charges from 104.5 to 106.5 grains of my favourite breakfast cereal topping. Buffalo keep falling-over dead, so something must be going right. I shot a small water bottle the other day at twenty metres - smaller than a soft drink can - and blew it apart. That was off the shoulder, of course. | |||
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When I said that the rifle will spray after four shots I did not mean they need to be fired on the same day or session. | |||
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Mr. Williams is spot on in his post, working up a better load is really the great part of shooting a DR. I certainly have done it in several DR's with a lot of fun along the way. He also is spot on with Hornaday using only Hornaday bullets. No disrespect but most DR's today are regulated with Hornaday ammo. I would assume as they are cheaper than any others which we have found and readily available. I have found that many people seem to find poor penetration with Hornaday DGS ammo. I have never used them on a live situation but was with a frien that required 7 shots with Hornaday DGS to finish a buffalo. At the skinning Snead there was evidence of poor penetration as all of the shots entered in the killing area. I have worked up a very accurate load with both NF cupped and solids in my .470NE. I personally never have had great results with Woodleigh bullets in any of my rifles. This is only my experience and am not trying to rain on anyone's parade. I get solid 1 inch groups with NF bullets, cupped and solids at 100 and 150 yards with my .460 Weatherby Mag. It gives 2 inch or less at 200 yard. In addition we find the NF bullets make for much easier cleaning than other bullets.  | |||
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Used Hornady DGS on an ele bull in February. Side brain shot. One and done. Mike | |||
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I remain dubious of Ray's "experience" Duane! Ask him about the "Screw Worm" program he implemented in Zim. Ganyana could probably shed some light on that subject if you're interested!  He claims Hornady uses Woodleigh bullets in their DR ammo when it's widely known they use their own bullets ... DGS and DGX.  He claims getting a DR to shoot a bullet other than what it was regulated with is an "effort in futility"? I guess all of us who shoot Northfork, CEB, Barnes, etc. in handloads in our DRs which were originally regulated with Hornady (Not Woodleigh) have been practicing futility?  Duane, I'm sorry to have gotten cross ways with you about your buddy Ray, but he has repeatedly made inaccurate claims and statements here on AR that are just not credible. Just take a quick look at the current threads here on AR concerning DRs. There are a lot of guys here that are new to the weapon type and come to AR for straight answers on sorting out their new rifles. They deserve to get accurate information. To supply them with wrong advice and false statements will only further frustrate their efforts.  Glen, regarding your comments about lack of penetration on the Hornady DGS bullets; are you certain you mean the DGS and not the DGX? There are many, many instances of problems with the DGX on DG but I haven't heard of any problems with the DGS (solid). I can't imagine a DGS, fired from a traditional DG rifle caliber failing to fully penetrate the vitals of a buffalo. All of my experience with elephant has been with monometals, specifically the CEB, Barnes Banded Solid, and Northfork. But Mike Jines' report above is 100% consistent with the DGS bullet's performance from everything I've heard or read in that it's a good bullet. DGX ... not so much! | |||
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My Searcy was finished about a month ago, and it was regulated with Woodleighs ,which is all i am intending to use in it | |||
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I checked with Jerry and you are correct it was the DGX which failed. Sorry and great you caught that. I am laid up with a knee replacement and made a stupid mistake, pain pills I fear. | |||
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No worries Glen. I had a pretty good idea what you meant. Take care of that knee and you'll have a great time in Makuti. | |||
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Never shot a Woodleigh in A double . I tried them in a Rifles, Inc. 300 Win Mag with horrible results . 5 inch groups . Accubonds shot less than half an inch. Too bad. I really wanted to use them. | |||
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A little detective work here would be nice. I would be interested in knowing why. Twist? diameter? Powder? It seems most anything should shoot out of a single barrel rifle. Accuracy will vary a bit, but .5 to 5 inches (x10)? There must be a reason. Just curious. Cal _______________________________ Cal Pappas, Willow, Alaska www.CalPappas.com www.CalPappas.blogspot.com 1994 Zimbabwe 1997 Zimbabwe 1998 Zimbabwe 1999 Zimbabwe 1999 Namibia, Botswana, Zambia--vacation 2000 Australia 2002 South Africa 2003 South Africa 2003 Zimbabwe 2005 South Africa 2005 Zimbabwe 2006 Tanzania 2006 Zimbabwe--vacation 2007 Zimbabwe--vacation 2008 Zimbabwe 2012 Australia 2013 South Africa 2013 Zimbabwe 2013 Australia 2016 Zimbabwe 2017 Zimbabwe 2018 South Africa 2018 Zimbabwe--vacation 2019 South Africa 2019 Botswana 2019 Zimbabwe vacation 2021 South Africa 2021 South Africa (2nd hunt a month later) ______________________________ | |||
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I don't know Cal. I had Safari Arms make me some. They had 4 different loads, 5 rounds each, all with the 200 grain Woodleighs. The idea was to see which one shot the best. In retrospect, I wrote the wrong thing. The BEST shot a 2.5 inch group. The WORST shot a 5 inch group.I have no idea of the powder. I could probably find out. Also,the Accubonds were 180 grains. Sorry, I was having a world class allergy attack yesterday. I was not thinking clearly. I will see if I can find the barrel twist. I have another 300 with a somewhat similar issue. It won't shoot 200 grain bullets very well. It shoots 180 grain very well. I wonder if this is the case here. I have Safari Arms making me some rounds with 200 grain Accubonds. | |||
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I've had no issues getting my handloads to regulate in my double and as good or better than what it was regulated with which was Hornady factory ammo, which as Todd pointed out DOES NOT come with Woodleighs and in fact, the North Forks showed better accuracy than the Woodleighs. USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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I have a 107 year old Boswell that shoots better with CEBs than Woodleighs or DGSs | |||
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I think I will go fire some uncoated NF solids on Thursday and see how they shoot. | |||
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How many rounds had you put through your double before the hunt? Mac | |||
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Most rifles whether it has one or two barrels are individuals. One barrel may like one brand of bullet while another will prefer a different brand. The only way to find out is to try them. Also, sometimes varying the powder charge can change which bullet shoots the most accurately in that barrel. 465H&H | |||
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I was out shooting today and solved the issue I had with bullets spraying after the 4th shot.As I suspected it was the Moly that was causing the issue.After cleaning I went to the range with a few NF rounds and a couple of Woodleigh soft all uncoated.Only two of the cases were reloads the rest new(I prefer reloaded and fireformed or once fired cases).The rifle shot more and more accurate as I fired it starting to shoot all of them in the bullseye.I am sure if I had more rounds they would keep on hitting bullseye.I used a boresnake afterwards and put the rifle away for another range session.I will shoot as is next time without removing the copper fouling and I am sure the bullets will shoot bullseye at 50yds.I am happy I solved this issue as I was wondering.I also tightened the main screw that holds the action to the stock and used loctite.I knew I had the best rifle in the world.I also oiled the action parts. [URL=  ]50yds off the bench(you could see the Woodleigh soft holes with the lead markings on the rim of the holes[/URL] | |||
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You shot that at 10 yards? No way! Stop lying! | |||
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Hilarious and on target!! | |||
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Remember I am a very experienced shooter!  | |||
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