New to the site and glad I found it. Been dreaming of Africa and double rifles since about 1982. Retirement is approaching, the kids are out of the house and hpefully the bucket list can be put into motion. I'm now starting the journey of the technical aspects of the doubles, calibers,actions ect. Plan is to research, handle, inquire and hopefully shoot different makes and calibers and purchase in about 12-24 months. This will be for buffalo at the least, hopefully more. Any experience, recommendation, opinions, suggestions are welcomed and appreciated because as you see I'm quite ignorant, but as they say it's not just the destination but the journey.

Also, I would like to ask if anybody can advise on the book " Building DOUBLE RIFLES on Shotgun Actions"? I refer back to ignorant, I admit that, so please don't banish me to DR Siberia. Don't mis-understand, I'm not looking to build a DR out of a shotgun instead of buying a good DR, but was thinking that maybe could play with building one to tide me over and do something with this DR energy.

Seriously, appreciate any and all input and I enjoy the site.

I have a 450 NE built on a JP Sauer 12 Ga. that is a fun accurate rifle. It can be done!

There are a few gunsmiths that convert build double rifles on shotgun frames. Whether this is good or bad is often debated. Now with Sabatti building double rifles for $3,000 - $5,000 it is usually cheaper to just buy a new DR.

Take a look at the Sabatti large bores and do so now, as I believe prices will be rising on these in the future, They are a quality DR at half the price of other entry level DRs. If I was in your position, I'd be looking at a Sabatti in 450 NE. $5500 for one with ejectors. Cabela's has an exclusive on the Sabatti in the USA.

Run ,,Run Luke Robinson... Danger Danger. Double rifles are an addiction worse that crack cocaine . In reality if you are so far along that you are hanging out here with the other addicts you are probably to far gone to help now. Good luck.

my 2 cents worth is this. Merkle makes a darn good rifle for the money and they can be purchased, especially used, at reasonable prices. Remember if you are really going to hunt with it you are going to have to put it on a plane and at the mercy of the baggage gorilla's TSA baboons and other and assorted characters. A new mid-level rifle can be replaced relatively easily. A Holland and Holland made in 1908 that has African provenance that gets backed over on the tarmac by a baggage tractor driven by Abdul the baggage handler, or stolen is not going to be replaced very easily. If you have really good insurance and you have impeccable documentation and you are willing to fight to the death you may get your purchase price back but...... you will have a hard time replacing what is essentially a work of art sculpted by hand from another time and place. Another Merkle etc is a phone call away. Fire up the the old CNC machine and you are good to go in no time. Again just my opinion .

If I was living in the US or even visiting there in the near future, I'd buy a Sabati or a Merkel or a VC in 450 NE or a 450/400NE. If I had the money I'd get 2 or 3 rifles!

I did think of building one on a Sauer, Greener or similar cross bolt shotgun action but gave up on it as just too much work and risk.

Thanks to all for the input, I appreciate it.

els- I did run, come to find out I ran in one big circle.

On a seperate note- Is there any shoots, gatherings or clubs around the south-central U.S.?

Agreed!! If a guy wants a quality DR at an affordable price, the Sabatti is the only way to go. The Chapuis are nice, I have a 9,3x74R. But over .40 caliber and you easing up on eight grand.

Rich
DRSS

Some evil member posted the following link under a different topic.

http://www.ussginc.com/index.html


http://www.ussginc.com/pdfs/catalogpg7.pdf


Read at your own risk!

Sabatti 450NE at 5K is WAY more gun than a shotgun conversion for roughly the same price. Also consider resale value of a homebuilt gun.

That being said, there are a few "cottage" builders making some nice conversions in the 4K price range.

Good Luck! Shopping is half the fun.

Forget converting a shotgun to a double rifle, with the prices of good doubles these days get one thats made as a rifle to start with. Shotgun receivers are rarely heat treated enough to handle the pressures of a rifle cartridge. Not having handled a Sabatti I can't comment on them other than if I wasn't double poor I'd buy one. Yes it is an ADDITION! Chapuis, Siace, Merkel amd Verney Carrone all all nice guns for the money. With the Sabatti at $5500 or so in 450NE I think I'd have to try one. Sabatti will probably go up in price if it keeps getting good reviews. Siace's have almost doubled in price since I bought my first one 5 years ago.

quote:

I would like to ask if anybody can advise on the book " Building DOUBLE RIFLES on Shotgun Actions"?

Available at:
bundukipublishing.com

Ellis is a bit modest, he is the author.

I cannot recommend this book highly enough. Whether you contemplate ever building one, or having one built for you; the information contained in this book is priceless. He guides you, step by step, with lots of photos and diagrams; from action choice to finished product. Most of us have absolutely NO CLUE re what is involved in a DR construction. Buy this book and read it carefully. Then you will know.

Rich
DRSS

Thanks for the kind words Rich.

I have handled the Sabbattis and shot one of the low end guns in 45/70 and am very impressed - especially for the money. The one we shot will shoot about 2.5" groups at 50 yards with the regulation 305 grain bullet. We had one that we shot quite a bit at the "Elephant Hunt" a week ago. I feel they are very comparable to the Chapius, Merkels, etc. that in the $10K range. That said, I have not disassembled one (they appear to be a standard A&D action from the outside), so I don't know about the internal finish. The triggers are a bit rough and tough, so I suspect that some internal clean-up would be in order. They are not perfect guns, and there are things that I would do to them that affect my personal esthetic, but they are at LEAST 3 times the gun that you get for $1000 in the Bakails, and I personally felt those were an "Okay" deal.

I know some of the folks at Cabela's that are involved with the Sabbattis, and I know that Cabela's requested a "distruction" test. They used a .500NE, and after something like 500 rounds with no noticeable change to the gun, they stopped the test - they had spent as much on ammo as the gun was selling for!

Good luck on you double rifle quest. Once bitten, there is no return.

quote:

Originally posted by Ellis:

quote:

I would like to ask if anybody can advise on the book " Building DOUBLE RIFLES on Shotgun Actions"?

Available at:
bundukipublishing.com

I have the book.....and am now building a monoblock for a guy from 24-hour...

The book is good....there's more to it than one wants to know about!

Here's the monoblock after finish reaming the chambers....this one is a .30-30

The only reason to 'convert' a shotgun is if your main every day gun is a shotgun and you have a set of rifle barrels made up for the same gun...quite common on the Browning Citori actions....470 or .450 No2 Barrels I have seen are all ferlach built. The guys who have used them have been top clay or wing shooters and wanted a suitable double for dangerous game with the same (single) trigger and safety they were most used to...Makes sence to me. A set of Ferlach barrels will set you back 3K euro or there abouts. I gather they are also available for a berretta silver Pigeon, but have seen one of those.

When I got my double I had to order a set of 28g shotgun barrels to go with it so I could shoot trap and sporting and get 100% used to the cocking system (I have a Krieghof) and balance etc. Improved my gun handling but ruined my trap scores

Ganyana,

I respectfully disagree on that.

Before there was Baikal, a Searcy at seven-grand was about as low as you got for a .400+ caliber double.
The introduction of the Sabatti really upset the apple cart. I had a very nice 450-400 in my grubby mitts a couple weeks ago. $5000 and very much worth every penny.

There are a half a dozen or so builders here in the US advertising conversions on the Huglu/CZs.
They do mostly low pressure rounds, so I consider them safe.
Remember, that is how Butch Searcy started. I owned one of his Red Label 20 GA DR's in 45-70 (ran a 45-90 reamer in it and it still regulated) many, many years ago.

Hey, we haven't had a "friendly feud" in three or four months. Got anything worth hammering each other over?

regards,

Rich

I just completed a conversion, with the help, and guidence of Ellis (abuve). It was a 12ga Simpson, converted to a 450#2. It's regulated to under 2" with a500gr bullet at 2200fps.
I think there is alot to be said for all the blood, swet, abd tears that go into building your uwn gun. I've shot some of the Sabati's Chapoui's etc. and they were great. I wouldn,t trade for any of them. Just me.

els

It was Will Robinson...

Luke [Skywalker] was the one that uses the Force...

USSG=EAA.....I absolutely wouldnt give them a dime if those guns were H&H.

Ellis, Nice to see you here. I wanna talk to you about my insomnia....I have your book constantly out.
If 1911s wern't bad enough, Its YOUR fault that I get distracted and sidetracked...lol

Well done.

Rich,

I am trying to goad Ellis, but cant do it grinning.....