I found this a while back while searching Google for more info. It is a good thing my buffalo can't read or they might be alive today.

http://www.gunandgame.com/foru...out-killer-kick.html


"Safari-level power?" According to the Nosler manual, the 9.3x74R throws a 270 grain pill at a rollicking 2329 fps, max. The .35 Whelan throws a 250 at 2386, for about the same energy. ( My ballistics program shows the two cartridges to be almost identical in performance.) So unless your safari is against deer or elk, the 9.3 probably won't do the job. ( I own a .35 Whelan AI, and I would not use it on anything mean.) If you want "safari-level power" in a No.1, try a .458 Win Mag or Lott. Ruger also chambers other elephant-class cartridges.

Seriously, the 9.3x74, with ballistics like a .35 Whelan, is probably adequate for a large bear. While I have no intention of hunting a large bear, if I did I would go for something more than "adequate."

It ain't no elephant rifle. It ain't even no .338 Win Mag. Sure, the bullet is bigger. And I do maintain bigger bullets are better for bigger animals. But you don't get big game (in the African sense) performance without big game energy and recoil. There is no magic medium cartridge. The 9.3x74 is not even legal for dangerous game where caliber restrictions exist.

I have had a number of European clients bring the 9.3x74 on safari for Buffalo.
IMHO, it is not adequate for Buff. Entry level power for Buffalo should be a 375 H&H, with a 416 being very much superior to the 375.

It's all in the bullet and where you put it!
Peter.

One of the first things I learned about forums on the internet was that responses require no expertise or experience on a subject.
As a reader, I owe it to myself to read posts and opinions over a period of time to determine whether someone is a power button pusher or truly knows what they are talking about.
We are lucky to have this site and some of its participants who have significant experience that they are willing to share.
I suspect they might express a different opinion on the 9.3. We are also lucky that the game we hunt can't read ballistic tables and cartridge hype.
My 9.3's are very effective at punching holes in paper but in my hands have never stopped even a charging chipmunk, yet.
Bfly

Kind of funny….

I own several 9.3 caliber rifles and have yet to do any dangerous game hunting with them. I expect this will change on my next trip across the pond. I may even take one bear hunting next time I go. I can’t comment on their ability to kill effectively however several of this forum members have used them with great success. I believe the caliber offers a lot more than the ballistics charts indicate.

One of the most impressive advocates I have seen to date came from Ganyana who I believe prefers the 9.3x62 for hunting dangerous game. Pretty good source IMO.

it is always nice to see when people will discuss something for which they have no knowlegdebase at all, and if they post enough they become experts in their own minds.

One point i really like is this guy keep posting the 9,3 load as a 270 grns load.

To bad that viking preacher didnt post his question on AR or Nitroexpress where he could actually get an informed response.

best

peter

The 9.3 X 74R as well as the other 9.3 carrtriges out there will kill any game you can hunt on this planet. If the shot is placed right it will do its job. The one factor is the bullet, it must hold together and do its job. When it comes to dangerous game the question is not if it can kill it, but if it can stop it. If you have not done your job and placed the shot to be a killing shot you may have to worry about something that is very pissed off and wants to hurt you. You have a 1500 lbs buffalo coming at you, you not only have to worry about killing it, BUT STOPING IT.

quote:

Originally posted by peterdk:
it is always nice to see when people will discuss something for which they have no knowlegdebase at all, and if they post enough they become experts in their own minds.

One point i really like is this guy keep posting the 9,3 load as a 270 grns load.

To bad that viking preacher didnt post his question on AR or Nitroexpress where he could actually get an informed response.

best

peter

Maybe because a lot of people can't be bothered arguing over a point that has been proved before.

I would call it "adequate", it will do the job, it's not perfect but
it will kill.

Two comments
1. Don't worry about recoil if the game you hunt may decide to hunt you as well.
2. as per shot placement the 7X57 is a proven killer in the hands of both brave and skilled shooters. If you don't have both of those qualities on your resume you need not apply

I agree with Steve Yamagishi's post above. I also believe experienced hunters all pretty much "know" for themselves what constitutes both "killing" and "stopping" chamberings in their own hands....and the two may not be at all the same thing.

Much depends on the terrain, the "type" of rifle, the animals hunted, the disposition and marksmanship of the user, and the consequences of failure.

For myself, I would not count on the 7x57 as a "stopping" cartridge for ANY of the commonly designated "dangerous" game. It is a splendid killer...I've used it on moose and other large animals. But I wouldn't choose it as a "stopper" even on dangerous game as lightly built as the leopard.

If you are a cool, experienced cucumber, so much so that you "like to fade to the left as the wounded buff passes so as to reach the neck with the second barrel," then a 9,3 X74 might be enough with the best bullets.
For guys like me, who have shot a few deer and African plains game animals (with a 9,3X62) and never faced anything that wanted to kill me and could, it would not be enough gun for me to ethically start a fight with a dangerous game animal. I'd love to have the field experience some day for the 9,3X74 to be enough gun for Cape buffalo, but doubt that will happen unless a rich uncle I never knew leaves me a fortune.
The 74 is tempting because it is the only almost-DGR caliber chambered in decent double rifles available under $5,000 that I know of.
If someone could figure out how to build a double in .450-400 for under $5k, life would be much simpler for those of us on a tight budget.
In the interim, I am putting my faith (or rather, my daydreams) in a "bolt-trash" CZ550 in .416 Rigby.

RAC

I see you mention the 338 Win Mag, not my favourite calibre but one i had in my hand
at the time of 2 charges, one from a very angry Cow Buffalo and one from a very irate Scrub bull.

Both intent on killing me, the Scrubber stopped dead at 15 feet, the cow turned after being hit
in the neck.

The result if I had had a 9.3 x 74R in my hands
- exactly the same, no if's or but's about it.


Now as to "adequate", yes it is if bullet placement is right, is it the calibre I prefer to have and use, No, but you use what you have in your hands and "stand and deliver" (that is unless you are a brown stain type of guy that runs).

By all means If anything bigger then a north american Elk came charging at me I would feel a little under gunned using a 7X57 Although in the hands of a very bold Mr Bell it did perform some serious damage to a number of animals in Africa.

Although I don't possess the intestinal fortitude to make a stand on any dangerous game other then the two legged predators with a 275 Rigby (7X57)
Personally I would not use anything less then a 416 Rigby, 458 Lott, or a 450/400 NE on cape buffalo or elephant. Nothing less then 375 H&H for lion with an expanding bullet.
There is a big difference between Stopping and Killing. And if you don't stop the animal in time you may be the killee and the animal the killer
Keep in mind I have zero experience with African big game and most likely will never make it over there in my lifetime Other then being drafted into the peace corps or something or maybe that rich uncle.
A safari is just a wee bit out of my price range Along with the proper rifle to do it with.

As far as why won't someone build a SXS in 450/400 that is in a decent price range.
Well I feel it's more of they could but don't. It really doesn't cost any more to build a rifle in 9.3X74R or in a 450/400 NE Until it comes time to regulate, then it's the ammo that sets them apart
700 NE $100 each shot or $2000 for a box of twenty. You now you own a RIFLE when a box of ammunition costs more then an average rifle

quote:

Originally posted by kcstott:

There is a big difference between Stopping and Killing. And if you don't stop the animal in time you may be the killee and the animal the killer.

A 500, 600 or 700 Nitro isn't going to stop an animal if the bullet
is in the wrong place and MAYBE if you are only slightly off it might
still have a shock effect.

However a 338 or 9.3 in the right place WITH the the right bullet WILL stop
a charging buffalo, albeit with slightly less authority than the bigger guns.

If you aren't prepared for the possibility of being stomped on, then don't go
hunting DG.

May I suggest golf might be a better pastime



And as for affordable 450/400's, it doesn't mater what country you are in,
when they were $6 - 8000, no one liked the 450/400 and no one bought them,
now they are $18,000, everyone wants one. That's why those who grabbed them
when the opportunity was there have benefited.

Sick of hearing about it, bite the bullet, buy one and live with it, prices
generally only go up. Today's price in 2 years will be cheap. those who always
seem to wait for a bargain always seem to be the ones complaining about the price.

quote:

Originally posted by 500N:


If you aren't prepared for the possibility of being stomped on, then don't go
hunting DG.

May I suggest golf might be a better pastime

I'd go if I could afford it I just damn sure would do it with the correct cartridge, rifle and bullet type along with a good amount of practice before hand.
My comment of not having the guts to hunt DG applies to using the 7X57 As Bell did.
No way am I that confident in the bullet or that crazy which ever the case may be. Granted he did an excellent job I don't care to try to repeat his exploits
And no way would I ever be caught on a golf course.
I can think of better things to do with my time then chase a little friggin ball around

Gee's I wish I'd known my 9.3X74 was'nt enough before I went to Zim in June. My 320g Woodleigh soft that retained 314 grains and lodged against the off shoulder and my 320 solid that entered the left rear ham, went through over 5 feet of cape buff and exited ahead of the rt ft shoulder as my buff quartered away for my second shot were obviously not enough gun and bullet for the job. Two buff in two days with the exact same results.
270 Speers are the wrong bullet for dangerous or tough game. You need a good 286 to 320g bullet for the tough stuff. There's not a buff alive that's bulletproof against a 9.3 with a good bullet.

Only shot two animals with my 9,3 and they were both Alaskan moose that I estimate about 1,200-1,400 pounds each. Moose are known for being dead and not knowing it but judging how the 9,3 with its 286 grain Woodleighs handled the moose it would not be my first choice for a buffalo even though I have never shot one (buff). The Woodleighs performed ok, but certaintly not stellar. The two I recovered were pretty mangled up but still mostly in one piece.

Now I realize I lack the experience many of you have but if going after something bigger than a moose I would want at least something equal with a 375 H&H packing 300 grainers. This is based on the moose (and a large griz) killed with my 375's displayed more signs of being hit hard and they died much faster. Some never having taken a step even without severing the spinal column.
Would use my 9,3 in a pinch but think there are much better choices out there.

quote:

Originally posted by Snowwolfe:
......Would use my 9,3 in a pinch but think there are much better choices out there.

This kind of sounds like a guy trying to rationlize the purchase of a Searcy 450

Not at all. Love my Chapuis and doubt I will ever sell it.
But I heard more than one author state the 375H&H should be the min for buff and was just trying to convey that in my opinion the 9,3x74R is not in the same league as far as killing power as the 375's when compared to moose size animals.

I'll be the first to admit I have no use for a 450 Nitro other than I want one
And at some point I want a 500 Nitro as well

Have been fortunate enough to have killed a few Cape Buffalo with my 9.3x62's.
The way I look at it, the main concern is bumping into an angry Elephant whilst in the thick stuff.

quote:

Originally posted by SWD:
Gee's I wish I'd known my 9.3X74 was'nt enough before I went to Zim in June. My 320g Woodleigh soft that retained 314 grains and lodged against the off shoulder and my 320 solid that entered the left rear ham, went through over 5 feet of cape buff and exited ahead of the rt ft shoulder as my buff quartered away for my second shot were obviously not enough gun and bullet for the job. Two buff in two days with the exact same results.
270 Speers are the wrong bullet for dangerous or tough game. You need a good 286 to 320g bullet for the tough stuff. There's not a buff alive that's bulletproof against a 9.3 with a good bullet.

SWD, is your 9.3 rifle a Chapuis? I used the Woodleigh 286 grain on both of my buffalo and the bullets included solids did not penetrate on broadside shots. What powder did you use and were they easy to regulate? I may have already asked you this before but my memory is short.
http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1881051811

I have killed several cape buff....

The only one I killed with one shot was my biggest in body and horn, one 9,3x74R Woodleigh 286gr Soft did the deed.

Like wise, I killed an elephant at under 5 yards with one 286gr Woodleigh Solid...

I prefer a 9,3x74R double to ANY bolt 375H&H.

I have to agree that the 9.3X74R, and the 9.3X62 are minimum for cape buffalo Hippo, and elephant, however I'm not opposed to hunting those animals with a 9.3 double rifle. As Tony says I'd prefere a 9.3X74R double rifle over a bolt action 375 H&H, for them.

For North America, the 9.3X74R double rifle is up to handleing anything we have to offer, and is my favorite hunting rifle, for the NA game. That rifle is also my choice for a light rifle as back-up for my big rifle for Africa as well. If anything happens to my big double rifle, the little 9.3 will save the day!

I'll chime in, in agreement with Mac and Tony. My 9.3x74R has felled several with nary a hitch. Anybody arguing a 9.3 isn't enough probably has a muzzle break on thier 243. Seriously, I also have a .500NE, .416 Rigby, and a few .375 H&H's. I am confident the in 9.3 doing the job. I never recover bullets which tells me penetration isn't a problem.

RAC, I shoot a Merkel 141, my partner shoots a Chapuis. Both in 9.3x74 an we both used 320 Woodleigh soft and solids. I use H4350 and he uses IMR4064. My loads go 2114 fps and his go 2260fps.
My buff was 1/4 away. I hit him in the L/R ham and the solid exited ahead of the rt/ft shoulder. 5+ feet of penetration with an exit. My buddies buff was broadside for the second shot, he hit him a little high and spined him and exited. The performance of the 320 Woodleighs was outstanding. The performance we saw was certainly alot more than "not adequate" in fact I can't imagine a 375 working any better than what we experienced with our 9.3s. Both the softs and solids kicked the crap out the buff we shot. In our opinion the 320 grain bullet brings a new level of performance to the 9.3.

RAC, I just read your hunt report. Give the 320s a try and you won't recover any more solids out of your buff. Sounds like you had a great time! We hunted Kazuma and Pandamasui about 2 hours from Vic Falls. We had a great time too!
The only problem with the 320s is the recoil goes up considerably from the 286. Our PH loved my little Merkel and wanted to shoot it. He and the assistant PH kept calling our 9.3s pea shooters and pellet guns. After 2 shots he commented it was "rather cheeky" and kept rubbing his shoulder and looking inside his shirt for a bruise. After seeing it perform on buff and shooting it himself he had some new found respect for it!

Agree

The 320gn bullets certainly add to the 9.3x74R