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Grenadier and Shootaway, Define 'solid bullet'. Remember to read both sentences in my post that went: "If two bullets are identically constructed but one has an exposed lead nose and one is a solid, how can the solid be harder on the bore? Same speed, same weight, same dimensions, same material, same type of metal in contact with the barrel and so on." | |||
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In current usage, "solid" means a bullet made of a hard, homogeneous metal or alloy.
Barnes’ solids are "machined from homogenous copper/zinc alloy". Cutting Edge Bullets offer "solid" bullets machined from copper and from brass. Both types are homogeneous bullets. North Fork Solids are individually turned on a CNC lathe from a copper bar. The material is homogeneous. Remington's Copper Solid is a homogeneous copper bullet with a polymer tip and boat tail base. The Nosler Solids feature a flat-nose design and are a homogenous, lead-free alloy. Woodleigh VLD brass solids and Hydrostatically Stabilised bullets are homogeneous "solid brass bullets". Why don't you define what you are talking about in your description. Please explain how two completely different bullets, "one with an exposed lead nose" and one "a solid", apparently without an exposed lead nose, can possibly be identical. . | |||
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Gerard,IMO,jacketed solids have a very solid or hard type of lead and jacketed softs have a soft type of lead.If both of these were constructed the same,the solid would have flattened out if you pound it with a sledge hammer against a concrete floor. | |||
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Grenadier and Shootaway, According to your definition, this is not a solid:  but this is a solid: 
As far as my knowledge goes, the first photo is a solid bullet. It has a lead core and a copper clad steel jacket. The second photo is of a soft (expanding) bullet of mono (monometal, monometallic) construction. Turned from a homogenous piece of solid metal or cast from lead or lead alloy, makes a monometal bullet and a monometal bullet can be a soft or a solid. How would you define a mono (monometal, monometallic) bullet?
You need to read both sentences where I asked the question. The second sentence said: "Same speed, same weight, same dimensions, same material, same type of metal in contact with the barrel and so on." The barrel will not know what the shape of the nose is. The shaft is in contact with the rifling. So, if two bullets weigh the same, have the same speed and the same shaft construction, the rifle will not know whether it is shooting a soft or a solid. Examples of softs and solids that are identically constructed (from the rifle's point of view) are: GSC 450gr monometal FN (solid) and monometal HV (soft) NorthFork same weight and caliber FP (solid) and SP (soft). CEB VLD HPBT (solid) and FBH HP (soft) of equivalent weight and caliber. CEB Raptor is probably the best example of a solid not causing more wear on a barrel than a soft. The same bullet can be loaded as a soft or a solid. As srose mentioned, the Hornady DGS (solid) and Hornady DGX (soft). There are many more like these. So my original position remains valid: Shooting solids from a rifle will not cause more wear than shooting softs, if the construction is the same. Shooting differently constructed bullets will vary the wear on a bore. | |||
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  I knew someone was about to get "educated" when I saw that question posed! I think Grenadier has been reading too much Shootanyway, the IQ is dropping rapidly. | |||
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Even Barnes has seen fit to explain to us that the jacketed "solid" shown above is actually a "FMJ" I knew exactly what Gerard was talking about. You will note that I said, "In current usage". The usage has changed and many manufacturers have even trademarked their version of what they call their "solids". The use of "solid" to describe "full metal jacketed" or "full metal cased" is rapidly becoming antiquated. That is also why I asked Gerard to give us his definition. . | |||
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It is confusing when terminology changes. Solids and softs denote specific types of bullets and, although the method by which the bullets are made is changing, softs are still softs and solids are still solids. I cannot imagine talking about soft softs, solid softs, soft solids and solid solids. Much easier to call them softs and solids and mono or leadcore. We at GSC refer to softs, solids, monometal and lead core bullets ------------------------------------------------------------- NorthFork website: Bullet Design: All North Fork bullets start from a bar of solid copper and are individually turned on a CNC lathe. The soft points have a 100% bonded lead core front and a solid copper shank rear. The flat point solids are designed with a truncated cone flat point. Cup point solids bridge the gap between softs and solids. -------------------------------------------------------------- Nowhere on the CEB website do they refer to solid bullets when talking about expanding bullets. Likewise Hornady on the topic of the GMX bullets. Barnes refers to soilds as bullets that do not expand and to the TSX and TTSX as 'all copper'. Nosler refers to their non expanding bullets made from solid brass as solids. They refer to the E-Tip as made from solid gilding metal but as an expanding bullet. In fact, nowhere can I find any manufacturer who refers to solids as expanding bullets or as softs. Solids mean 'not intended to mushroom', no matter where you go. | |||
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A solid is a non expanding bullet used only for deep penetration.A soft is an expanding bullet used for immediate trauma. | |||
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After that last profundity and if I was involved in this discussion and if there is a god, somebody'd be climbing a water tower with a sniper rifle somewhere in Montreal... USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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I shot a Steinbuck in 07 using a 400gr Barnes Banded Solid in my 416 Rigby. I certainly wasn't concerned about deep penetration! There is a time when you should stop  | |||
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Recovered 500 grain Woodleigh solid and weldcore soft from a Cape Buffalo. I don't believe the buff cared that the solid was an FMJ or lathe turned copper.  Jim "Bwana Umfundi" NRA | |||
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I dropped a beautiful buff in Makuti with a 200yd spine shot using a Hornady solid.Then I shot my second buff,a superb 40 inch trophy using another Hornady solid through the lungs.I still daydream about those Makuti buff everyday.I would love to go back.I was using the older Hornady solids. | |||
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The weldcore will be my bullet of choice in Dande this summer.Tough on buffalo but soft on your bore. | |||
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+1  AMEN SSR | |||
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