These things are so rare I have never seen one in flesh. Has anyone here ever seen one, or used one? What do you think of them in terms of quality and fit and finish? Have they made any lemons at any time?
Any information or comments is highly appreciated.

Not a double, but I had an early magazine rifle built on a Sauer action in 9.3x64 Brenneke. They have certainly pushed the envelope in quality since then. Many consider them the finest firearms building company in the world.

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Not a double, but I had an early magazine rifle built on a Sauer action in 9.3x64 Brenneke. They have certainly pushed the envelope in quality since then. Many consider them the finest firearms building company in the world.

Thanks Biebs. How was that early one you had in terms of quality? Do you find it to be the absolute best, or was it still not at that level?

I've only had one H&H, and a couple Westley Richards and such...all older rifles, but it was certainly at least on par with them. I don't think you'll find ANYONE complaining about quality with a Hartmann & Weiss.

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
I've only had one H&H, and a couple Westley Richards and such...all older rifles, but it was certainly at least on par with them. I don't think you'll find ANYONE complaining about quality with a Hartmann & Weiss.

Thank you very much for sharing your experience. Good to know even the early rifles of that company were of that quality

So Biebs, explain to the viewers of AR:

Why, after owning Holland and WR older rifles, and a H&W, why did you drop these makers in favor of Blaser?

Just winderin'.
Cal

Cal, those were more collector rifles. The Blaser is a multi-caliber, take-down, ultra-accurate hunting machine that has served me well.

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Cal, those were more collector rifles. The Blaser is a multi-caliber, take-down, ultra-accurate hunting machine that has served me well.

+1

Biebs you need blaser quality accuracy for your shooting skills

Mike

I saw a double 470 in a shop in Vienna. For what it is worth I was very impressed.

They are among the most expensive rifles in the world. Maybe not as well known outside of continental Europe, but I would put up a Hartman and Weiss against anyone.

I had a Hagn Singleshot in 7mm Rem Mag built by H&W. The quality was fantastic. I regret selling it but I had other projets at the time. I have not heard of a bad quality H&W. Bolt actions are more common. Now the two Gentlemen are in their mid 70s. If one happens to be in Hamburg visit of the shop is higly recommended.

quote:

Originally posted by jaegerfrank:
I had a Hagn Singleshot in 7mm Rem Mag built by H&W. The quality was fantastic. I regret selling it but I had other projets at the time. I have not heard of a bad quality H&W. Bolt actions are more common. Now the two Gentlemen are in their mid 70s. If one happens to be in Hamburg visit of the shop is higly recommended.

Did they ever talk about their plans for the company when they retire? Do they have sons or daughters who are into the business?

No, I know of nobody taking over. No son or daughter as far as I know.

quote:

Originally posted by jaegerfrank:
No, I know of nobody taking over. No son or daughter as far as I know.

Thanks a lot for your information. I hope then that when they retire they just close the company. Better than selling it to someone who might tarnish the good name built over 50 years!

Another Paso Robles Rigby in the making? :-)

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Another Paso Robles Rigby in the making? :-)

You are reading my mind. This is exactly the example I was thinking about. Hope H&W company won't have the same fate.

From what I gather they have one apprentice in the shop, not sure what that future holds though. Anyone that possesses the skills to make firearms that fine doesn't want to do it under someone else's name forever.

quote:

Originally posted by Aaron Little:
From what I gather they have one apprentice in the shop, not sure what that future holds though. Anyone that possesses the skills to make firearms that fine doesn't want to do it under someone else's name forever.

You mean they have one trainee in addition to other gunmakers? Or do you mean there is just one gunmaker in the shop?

quote:

Originally posted by Aaron Little:
From what I gather they have one apprentice in the shop, not sure what that future holds though. Anyone that possesses the skills to make firearms that fine doesn't want to do it under someone else's name forever.

Martini and Hagn of course there are others.

Even a Savage Axis guy with a dremel has got to have his own shop. That's how we got Aaron away from the blacksmith.

Over the years H&W had very good gunsmiths, most of them have opened their own shops. I guess it is not trivial to take over such an enterprise which is so heavily linked to the two personalities. This is different then e.g. WR or H&H.

...this is correct Jäger.

I was three times in there store, interviewd and photographed them.
They had great skills, great ideas and - of course - great workers.
...and a big collection of doubles... :-) of all makers and their own models.

quote:

Originally posted by Bockhunter:
...this is correct Jäger.

I was three times in there store, interviewd and photographed them.
They had great skills, great ideas and - of course - great workers.
...and a big collection of doubles... :-) of all makers and their own models.

Sent you a PM

Hartmann and Weiss are "the best gunmakers in the world"; this view was from the MD of Westley-Richards. Similar views are heard from H&H, Purdey and Boss.

They are hugely respected in the custom gunmaking world; obvious when you see the many fellow custom gunsmiths who swarm around them at the gun shows.

Mr Hartmann concentrates on building rifles (bolt, single-shot and doubles) and Mr Weiss on the shotguns. They are two of the nicest people whom you can meet.

It's a small team; they are assisted by experienced apprentices, with outsourcing (under strict tolerances) of stock making, engraving and colour case-hardening.

Their workshop is a converted detached house in a leafy part of Hamburg; they have an underground 100m range for testing. A 'mecca' for their many followers.

I do hope that when they both finally decide to retire, that they will close their workshop permanently; that way their amazing legacy will live untarnished forever.

http://www.hartmannandweiss.com/en/history.html