My Heym 88B Safari trigger pull weight. Are they supposed to be this heavy?

Front trigger

6.47 lbs


6.82 lbs


6.24 lbs

Rear Trigger

11.75 lbs


11.77 lbs


11.84 lbs

IMHO, No, they are mostly way too heavy.


I have my "hunting" or shooting doubles
(as opposed to collector items) are set for
I think Front 3 - 3.5 lbs and Rear 4 - 4.5lbs.

So 1 - 2 kg.


Edit - Note - I get this done by a competent gunsmith,
someone who knows WTF they are doing with DR's,
NOT just bolt guns so choose wisely
before you let someone play with the triggers.

I also thoroughly test the guns afterwards
to make sure as much as possible no accidents
are going to happen.

Luckily we are blessed with some exceedingly good gunsmiths here, as you are in JJ.

Finally, I chose 3 - 3.5lbs because my bolt guns are of a similar pull weight.

No creep is also very important.

.

Right on Nigel!! My Lucchini is with JJ right now and that's exactly what I have requested. BTW, they were set by the maker at 4 3/4# and 9#

Butch Searcy set the triggers on the 3 doubles he made for me right at 4.5 pounds, front and back. To me, it makes no sense to have the pull weights of the 2 triggers to be much different. But then again, I am a "back trigger first" double rifle shooter......... and I really do not want to go down that rathole again about which style is better, preferred or ordained by God himself (ok, that last comment was for MacD37 who has probably forgotten more about double rifles than I will ever know).

I had my Merkel adjusted to 4# front and 4.5# back trigger. My Searcy is 4.5# front and back.

Both of my Chapuis's came with a front trigger of about 5 pounds and the rear's were 8. One went back for adjustment and is now 4.5 in front and 5 in the back. One of these days I'll send the other one in to get adjusted.

Searcy is about 4.5 in front and 6 in the rear

Heym came with about 4 in front and 5 for the rear.

VC was about 6 for the front and 7 or 7.5 for the rear.

Wished they are came with 4 and 4.

Gents,

Apparently, my DR factory pull weights are ways to heavy then. I think 4-4.5 lbs front and 7-8 lbs are good combination.

My triggers are 3 lbs. and no creep.

Mike

1.9kg and 2.2kg are current specs on HEYM triggers.

Stan - as discussed, your rifle is quite a bit older. I have your serial number, and I'll see if we can find out what the trigger weights were when the rifle left the factory.

Chris, sounds about right. 1.9kg=4.2# ; 2.2kg=4.85#. In fairness, I never owned a Heym of any vintage that had an excessive trigger pull or creep.

Chris,

I ordered this DR from Shooting Center, Germany in November, 2011. The DR was ready for delivery in June 2012. I have just received the gun in July of this year. The delay was caused by my country import permit (political issue). Plus it was sent to Outschar in Austria for a custom stock.

Stan - is your rifle a sidelock?

We switched to 88000 serial numbers in about 2009 after making more revisions to the rifle.

Stamped on your barrels is a two-letter date code. This will tell when the rifle was made.

I'll check, but your s/n seems low compared to the order date.

Hi Chris,

This Heym is my first DR. It is a Boxlock. That was the first and the only time I ordered with Stefan at Shooting Center. I did order two Mauser M03 at the same time. Did he sell me an old rifle?

Stan

The triggers of my FN-Browning CCS25 O/U in 9,3x74R are exactly in line with yours : U = 1,9 kg & O = 2,2 kg.

quote:

Originally posted by Stan-Elephant Trail:
Hi Chris,

...Did he sell me an old rifle?

Stan

Stan - I can't say with any certainty at this point (nor am I implying such), but the two-letter date code from the proof house will clearly indicate when it was proved. You can determine that immediately. It will take me a few days to get the build card dug up from the basement.

Stan - I have pm'd you the info on your rifle.

I have no interest towards anyone on this thread. That being said I would like to share this. When I worked for a double rifle mfg We tried two Lyman digital trigger pull gauges. Neither read the same as our spring scale. They both read consistently heavy. We figured out that the issue was that they did not stop reading when the trigger broke. If the trigger broke at 4lbs the scale read 5 lbs plus.... I confirmed this with my scale ($100.00 spring scale) and double checked it against a certified weight. It was correct and yet both Lyman's read the weight correctly as well. Yet neither would read the same as the spring scale on a double. They all read the same on a bolt rifle trigger. As I have mentioned we were using them only on double rifles. Because of this we stopped using a digital scale. I am willing to bet that that scale is not correctly reading the trigger pulls.

I believe that the reason that the digital scales have trouble with doubles has to do with their sensitivity and the fact that this is a double. The sear springs do not release when the sear nose disengages from the sear notch in the hammer. Because of this the scale continues reading until you stop pulling. I do not know if this is still the case with digital scales but I do not use one on a double and do not recommend them to anyone for use on a double.

h2oboy

I am glad you posted that.

I will go even further, the ONLY way to really tell what the weight of your trigger is to use a "device" specifically made for measuring trigger weight that uses free handing weights...

No springs, no electronics...

Also you need to learn how to "pick up" the gun with the weights handing on the trigger.

I also think it is much better to have the triggers on a large bore rifle, including a double,too heavy,rather than even a little too light.

Thank you for your info. I just bought this Lyman gauge last week specifically to measured this DR. Both triggers are way too heavy compared to other bolt rifles I have still.

As per my requested, Chirs has traced back the production date of my DR form serial number.

"Rifle # 82584 was delivered to Frankonia in April 2002.

In January of 2013 a second set of barrels in 375 H&H were ordered and fitted to it by HEYM."

I sent an email to Stefan Bader at Shooting Center in Germany where I have bought this DR from and here is his replied.

"You should be grateful that you get a Heym double made during that years.
During this time Heym was at its peak concerning production qualitiy and craftsmanship.
If you will order that rifle today and compare it what you have you will be very disappointed.
Check the action, the tighness and the top lever and greener bolt.

Your rifle was handmade by nobody less than Bernd Helbig himself.
Ask him.
He personally checked your rifle before it left to you.
His comment: Wow, if I had the money I would buy it.

Your complain is unfounded.

If you don't trust me ask Helbig yourself.
b.helbig@heym-waffenfabrik.de

To the history of your gun.
Yes, it was delivered from Heym to Frankonia.
It was stored all the years in the warehouse in the original case and packing.
During inventory a decision was made to sell this rifle now.
And, I got a call from a sales man from Frankonia where he offered this rifle to my."

Any comments, gents?

If you were not informed it was a rebarelled rifle and led to falsely believe it was new, you should demand your money back. If you really want the rifle you should at least ask for some of what you paid for it back. Also the information about better production quality by Heym then than now seems fabricated and suspect...

Norsk

The rifle was new, it was just sent back to Heym for a SECOND set of barrels.

sorry missed that... But trigger is way too heavy imo.

DR in thîs price range have all a few short cuts. Mostly the triggers are not refined, so either you got the one which was just from beginning ok or otherwise you get what just came out of the machinery.

Heym told me they can not go safly below 1,6kg so usually they stay just below 2kg. What is ok for a 470 but not perfect for a 9,3 with scope.

The worst you can get is front lighter then rear (double weight on the rear one), the second is then very difficult to place the shot.

The trigger pulls should be the same. But usually you get that only in the very very expensive rifles.

A rifle they had been delivered to Frankonia in 2002 was not staying there for 10years. That rifle was for sure sold to Bader shortly after 2002 and stayrd in his stock and not at Frankonia's (Frankona is is the largest wholeseller in Germany. Their stock is truned over much faster then all 10years. The marketing and delivery for Heym, Frankonia made for a few year but never from 2002 on.

Best is to go to them (Heym) handel the rifle over and say what you want they shell change/adjust etc. To go over dealers is very time consuming and after they sold the product they have no interest anymore for performing any service.

My 470 was also from Bader, but you get what falls from the production band. My triggers was ok but they installed a automatic safety (which I have not ordered) which I get then finally myself out.

Bader had an own 470 which he had very long on his HP, so probably that was the gun above.

I believe you are totally corrected, bunoushcu. Bader has been using this rifle before as now the coating (bluing) in breech area is fading off too fast,I have shot this Heym about sixty rounds only. Plus other various other problems I have told Chris about this Heym. Another issue is I ordered Heym 88B Safari, but I think he had given me a factory 88B with in house engravining to make it looks like 88BS Safari.

Stefan Bader at Shooting Center in Germany has surely cheated me on this Heym. Is there any place in Germany I can file a complaint or report to?

Sounds very like his gun which had been blued using that fast blue chemical for amateur use. That came off very easy again. My Merkel 160AE was from him and that was totally new production blue (code number indicates it was just come from the factory) and everything still 100% after now over 400rounds, so there should no blueing be off after just a few boxes.

To make a complain does not really make sense when you are from the USA. The laywer will cost at the end more then the rifle. You can go to DEVA and get the rifle reviewed (they make then a letter - review - which you would need to go to court, with that paper you can go to Bader and ask for the difference, usually the dealer pays then because when that review is clear, he would have not very good chances at the court and additional costs, so in most cases they look then for an agreement)

After go to Heym directly, get the things fixed, most probably they not even charge anything when the fault looks like just it exists out of the factory. Costly it will only become when it is wear or a gunsmith who has no experiance with DR have fucked up the rifle. When one side is 5kg+ it very looks like there has been some unexperianced repair involved. They would never deliver a rifle with 3kg front trigger and 5+kg rear one.

quote:

Originally posted by Stan-Elephant Trail:
As per my requested, Chirs has traced back the production date of my DR form serial number.

"Rifle # 82584 was delivered to Frankonia in April 2002.

In January of 2013 a second set of barrels in 375 H&H were ordered and fitted to it by HEYM."

I sent an email to Stefan Bader at Shooting Center in Germany where I have bought this DR from and here is his replied.

"You should be grateful that you get a Heym double made during that years.
During this time Heym was at its peak concerning production qualitiy and craftsmanship.
If you will order that rifle today and compare it what you have you will be very disappointed.
Check the action, the tighness and the top lever and greener bolt.

Your rifle was handmade by nobody less than Bernd Helbig himself.
Ask him.
He personally checked your rifle before it left to you.
His comment: Wow, if I had the money I would buy it.

Your complain is unfounded.

If you don't trust me ask Helbig yourself.
b.helbig@heym-waffenfabrik.de

To the history of your gun.
Yes, it was delivered from Heym to Frankonia.
It was stored all the years in the warehouse in the original case and packing.
During inventory a decision was made to sell this rifle now.
And, I got a call from a sales man from Frankonia where he offered this rifle to my."

Any comments, gents?

Maybe it is a cultural thing, but I think the way your dealer addressed your legitimate concerns and questions makes him something of an arrogant jackass.

I don't expect to get any thing back from Bader at all. I just want other people to beware of how he does business. He had sold his used gun to me as a brand new gun and gave me a wrong model. I am very certain that he is capable to do many worse things more than this.

Stan

How does the rifle shoot with each barrel?

Do the triggers actually feel too heavy for a big bore rifle?

I have not done accuracy shooting test yet as this is my first DR. At the moment, I am trying to get a feel and get used to it. My plan is to sight in a red dot in a couple of week as I will take this gun to Zim in October, with Mauser M03 in .416 Rem and 500 MDM as back up.

To me, front trigger is a bit to too heavy while rear trigger is way too heavy. After Zim safari, I will send the custom stock back to Outschar for some improvement and correction along with the action. I will have Outschar works on the trigger then.