Would it be very much trouble to have a beavertail fore end altered and "whittled" down by someone who knows what they're doing to a splinter end type fore end?

After being able to handle, shoot and play a few diff makes and calibers in DRs, I've found that I really like the splinter type fore end much better than the big bulky beavertail types. It just "feels" better in the hands and gives you a better feel of the barrels, at least to me it does.. And seeing how I have a Chapuis with the BT type end, I'd was curious to see if this alteration can be done, and if so, would any of you have someone that you would recomend for the job? What would/should something like this run?

Thanks guys.

Got to thinking if it would just be easier just to have one made.. That way, should I decide to sell the rifle someday, I would still have the original fore end to go with the gun..

Ideas?

Michael Merker can do it for you. I recommend him.

Contact him about the price.

http://michaelmerker.com/

quote:

Originally posted by mrlexma:
Michael Merker can do it for you. I recommend him.

Contact him about the price.

http://michaelmerker.com/

Ditto's, you need to contact Michael Merker

I know this may (make that will) fly in the face of all the neuvo, pseudo traditionalists but one might consider why a double rifle might have a beavertail forend.

If the rifle is a so-called safe queen or never to be shot more than one or two rounds at a sitting, then it just doesn't make a difference.

But if you have ever unloaded a half a box of ammo at a buffalo that wouldn't die and the skin on your fingers are going up in flames WITH a beavertail forend, it might make you think about splinters.

Yeah, splinters, that is what you'll have left over for fingers.

quote:

But if you have ever unloaded a half a box of ammo at a buffalo that wouldn't die and the skin on your fingers are going up in flames WITH a beavertail forend, it might make you think about splinters.

Twenty-five rounds is twelve rounds a barrel. I hardly think that any double gun, particularly a rifle, is going to get hot enough so as to make it too seriously hot to hold after twelve rounds down each barrel.

For sustained firing of double guns we use this here in Britain:



With regard to cutting down a beavertail to a splinter I'd be careful. Why? Because you need to be sure that when cut down the "match" where the cut down sides meet the barrel is good. In other words there isn't a gap because when the forend was cut that the barrel to wood fit was poor.

On a well inletted forend there should not be. Make sure first that yours won't have this gap.

quote:

Originally posted by enfieldspares:

quote:

But if you have ever unloaded a half a box of ammo at a buffalo that wouldn't die and the skin on your fingers are going up in flames WITH a beavertail forend, it might make you think about splinters.

Twenty-five rounds is twelve rounds a barrel. I hardly think that any double gun, particularly a rifle, is going to get hot enough so as to make it too seriously hot to hold after twelve rounds down each barrel.

Try it in Oct. Zim heat - you may change your mind - it starts to burn after 8th or so...

enfieldspares:
I beg to differ. Even my heavier doubles will heat up uncomfortably after 6 to 7 rounds a barrel if I'm doing drills. They have splinter fore-ends and, without a glove, neither splinter or beavertail will prevent hand contact with hot barrels which makes for an uncomfortable shooting experience.


Dutch

Scotty,

Dont know how that would look on a Chapuis-- Lon Paul could do the work. He has a great eye for wood--and how thing will look when done. I might see him today or tomorrow. I'll ask for you.

www.lonpaulcustomguns.com

Ed

If I had a hat I would eat it. Certainly never had that problem here in UK. As was said it may dpend on the ambient temperature.

quote:

Originally posted by enfieldspares:
If I had a hat I would eat it. Certainly never had that problem here in UK. As was said it may dpend on the ambient temperature.

You're smokin' somethin', just not sure what.

What exactly is the objection to full forearms on doubles? I can at least understand if it's mainly esthetics, although I don't necessarily agree.

Is it something to do with safety? I have been told that with the hard kickers a reason for the splinter is, you're supposed to hold the barrels because of the recoil forces. In other words, holding nothing but wood on a full forearm could result in a separation from the gun. I know how that sounds, but believe it or not it came from a gunmaker.

Personally I don't care for splinters at least on shotguns. I don't like the way they look or the barrel heat.

But, what Dutch44 said is true about hand contact even with the beavertail. I had one on a Browning SxS and during a heated dove shoot my hand got so scorched that I had to replace the whole gun for the rest of the hunt with a Win. Model 12 pump.

The barrel heat issue is one of the REALLY nice things about O/U shotguns. You hold just the wood and not the barrels and your hand on the forearm stays comfortable. No need for any sleeves.

Thanks for the replies, gents..

Ed, le me know what he has to say. Thanks bud.

Shack, I agree that it is mostly about the esthetics of the gun more than anything.. I just prefer the look of a splinter as opposed to the BT.

I, too, have read that proper technique with a double is to grasp the barrels. I wear a leather glove on my left hand for two reasons. The barrels heat up seriously in a practice session, and the barrel mounted swivel stud hurts like a bitch in recoil with my 470.
I don't see how igniting north of 100 gr of powder isn't going to get pretty hot pretty fast.
I also wear a light goatskin glove on my left hand when I hunt with this rifle. Besides protecting my wimpy hand, I like to think that keeping at least some of my sweat and body oils off the gun may lessen wear and corrosion.
This hasn't much to do with your origional question. Sorry.

I too wear gloves, a brand that I found in Griffin and Howe.

Scotty,

Lon will do it give me a call on my cell tomorrow and I'll put you in touch.

Ed

This past summer, I was doing a little practice with my 470 and it has a slender beavertail. Probably shot just 10-12 rounds (5-6 in each barrel) The (paired) shots were not one after the other but there was some time in between them and the barrels were to hot to hold. I was glad I had that slender beavertail.
The ambient temp was in the high 90's.
Interesting observation is that a 458 WM I have did not heat the barrels like the 470 with like weight bullets and similar velocities.
I assumed it was due to the fact I was burning 30-40 more grains of powder (Hornady factory ammo which I was led to believe uses 4831) to achieve the same results in the 470.

Several months ago Lon Paul reshaped my beavertail on my Francotte. He did a great job so I did the same on my Marcel Thys that has two sets of barrels. Really looks a lot nicer.

what is the typical charge on this? Including the re-checkering?

I'm curious too........I have a double shotgun that has an (in my opinion) overly large beavertail and would like to get it modified into a splinter.

Matt

quote:

Originally posted by enfieldspares:
Twenty-five rounds is twelve rounds a barrel. I hardly think that any double gun, particularly a rifle, is going to get hot enough so as to make it too seriously hot to hold after twelve rounds down each barrel.

I doubt you would want to hold my double for twelve consective pairs.

The fore-end on a double rifle is not there to use as a handle, but to protect the fore-end hanger, ejectors and the fore-end latch that holds the rifle together, nothing more.

The proper way to hold the double rifle is with your forehand at the muzzle end of the fore-end wood, with the fingers wrapped around the barrels. This is why the fore-end wood is splinter shaped, with just enough wood to protect the workings underneath. The beaver tail fore-end wood does not allow one to hold the barrels of the double rifle properly, and holding only the wood places too much strain on the fore-end hanger, and it’s attendant parts.

The Beavertail fore-end wood is an American design with about the same value as the Monte Carlo roll-over cheek piece which is also an American abortion.

The beavertail fore-end is guady feature for shotguns, where shots are fired like 30 or 40 shot strings when in competition, or shooting driven birds. Even there the beavertail fore-end is not a properly made fore-end but is not as bad on the shotgun where the recoil is usually much lighter than with a NE double rifle. The use of the slip-on heat barrier is used for the driven bird shoots, and competition so that the barrels can still be the anchor point for the fore-end without burning the shooter's hand.

Even in the most dire of circumstances a double rifle is rarely fired more than four shots in a string, and six at most, starting with cool barrels. That is not enough to get the barrels hot enough to need any hand protection. Anyone who shoots a double rifle enough to make the barrels too hot to touch, is doing damage to his rifle.

IMO, the Beavertail is a very unattractive fixture, besides being a useless fixture on even a shotgun, and certainly not needed on a double rifle!

However, since this is a free country, and the cost, and design of anyone’s double rifle, other than mine, is their business. The beavertail fore-end on someone else’s double is entirely up to the person who pays his money for it. Even though a beavertail is detrimental to the long term workings of the double rifle, if that is what the buyer wants, it is his money. The beavertail fore-end wood can always be modified to a more proper splinter fore-end later, luckily!

SO! If the beavertail fore-end floats your canoe than get one and paddle on down the river! All mine will be splinter!

I was waiting for your reply to this, Mac!! Thank you for your input on the matter.

With that said, what would one expect something like this to cost the gun owner to convert his fore end from a BT to S by a reputable and recommended outfit like the one's mentioned above?

Thanks for all the input, gents.

quote:

Originally posted by Scottyboy:
I was waiting for your reply to this, Mac!! Thank you for your input on the matter.

With that said, what would one expect something like this to cost the gun owner to convert his fore end from a BT to S by a reputable and recommended outfit like the one's mentioned above?
Thanks for all the input, gents.

Done properly it will not be a blue-light special, but worth the effort and reasonable cost. I can't say what they would charge, as I do my own stock work, and checkering.

I is not only an ill concieved feature, but a useless one as well. It is a personal thing, but to me there is nothing I can think of on a firearm the is uglier than a bevertail fore-end!

Well, dont know what it would cost, but I will say if you get it done. Get it done by somebody that knows how, or you will be paying for a bad job and then a restock by someone good.

Here is a recent restock Lon did on a Westely Richards 577. Can't really tell by the pic, but it looked great.


By coachsells, shot with i1037 at 2010-01-22

Ed