Gents:
Any Howdah shooters out there?
This is my Lang; imported from Switzerland a year ago. Original mould casts 500-grain bullet. I ordered brass and a new mould from Martyn at X-ring Services.

Reloading is fun. 3 drams of FFg (82 grains) is brutal to shoot but 60 grains is fine. I also am developing some smokeless loads with Blue Dot, 2400, and Unique.

Any others out there in AR land doing the same?
Cheers,
Cal

I don't currently own one but I have built a few.
This one is an over/under 16 Bore in the Durs-Egg style.

Just excellent gentlemen! Cal, we'll need some Youtubage of your howdah on the line.

Hey Cal,

A little history lesson would be helpful.
What were these made for?????? Bar fights or
charging tigers from the backs of elephants in
India. I find them fascinating and would like to
know more..... How many makers --- most popular
calibers --- where used other than India. Your
experience and research much appreciated.

Thanks & good shooting

Tetonka
DRSS

A friend, now dead, had one of these:



I used to load him .455 "Manstopper" bullets as they preformed well in its oval bore barrels.

quote:

Originally posted by tetonka:
Hey Cal,

A little history lesson would be helpful.
What were these made for?????? Bar fights or
charging tigers from the backs of elephants in
India. I find them fascinating and would like to
know more..... How many makers --- most popular
calibers --- where used other than India. Your
experience and research much appreciated.

Thanks & good shooting

Tetonka
DRSS

Tetonka:
My pleasure.
The safaris in India differed from those in Africa in many ways. Foremost was the hunters, both English and the India Royalty, rode on the backs of elephants. The platform and basket they rode in was a howdah. So, if the hutner's shots failed and the tiger was climbing up the elephant to get to the hunters, thier last line of defense was a large caliber double barrel pistol, called a howdah pistol. Most were two barrels but some were four barrels. Caliber was a short .450 bpe or .500 bpe and the short .577. These were usually 1.5 and up to 2 inches. For my Lang, and probably most howdahs were for the military .577 Snider. Many double rifles were chambered for the Snider so the hunter only carry one type of ammo (like the Colt single action revolver and the Winchester model 1873, both chambered for the .44-40).

The number of howdah pistols will forever be unknown as so many maker's records have been lost or destroyed in fires or WWII. So, too, will be the makers of howdahs. It is safe to state most of the makers made at least one, or more, howdahs.

A gent in the northwest US is planning a book on the howdah pistols. I eagerly await its publication.

While an invention for India, I'm sure many were used in Africa and south east Asia. Probably too powerful for bar fights and not comfortable to carry all day in a holster whilst on a horse. You will see a howdah in the Ghost and the Darkness, carried by Michael Douglas.

To compare, here is my SAA Colt and the howdah with ammo.
Cheers,
Cal

PS. Forgot to mention, howdahs in double barrel were also made in 20-16-12 bore.

http://museummenagerie.blogspo...ns-tiger-attack.html

I seem to recall an article about a 12 bore Howdah pistol as well in an early 70´s G&A magazine..by Howard French..??

Pondoro:
Yes, the 1972 annual issue.
Cal

Thanks for the history, very interesting.
Great pictures too. Howda vs. Colt

We had a sheriff in Texas many years ago (McMullan County) that carried a similar weapon. 12 guage, 12 in. double bbl.
and a cut down stock, no holster, always carried in
one hand. Never any bar fights with him around.
Sign at the County Line read "You are now entering
the Free State of McMullan"

Spares, thanks for that most fascinating link.

I have a pair of 28 bore pina-fire Howdah pistols from India cased in the percussion style by Charles Loughlin of Cheltenham. According to Bailey and Nie 1858-70. I would like to make contact with who ever is doing the book on Howdah pistols.

Cheers,
Laurie

Cal,
I have a beautiful Howdah pistol that looks much like your Lang except it is not cased/. I have 13 or so rounds of ammo too.
Mine is a B Woodward and Sons .577 Snider.
It is a browned Damascus side by side double bbl. with percussion hammers. Jones underlever with extractors. Blue back action locks engraved and color case hardened. Double triggers. Checkered forearm and grip with color casehardened grip cap. Bbls. with proof marks stamped under and the bore number of 25 stamped there too. This is a super clean pistol in beautiful shape. Chambers and bore are in excellent shape. B. Woodward and Sons marked atop rib and on both locks. Bbls. measure 7" in length.
I have never shot it but would like to.
Better tomorrows!

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:
" ... Any Howdah shooters out there? ..... Any others out there in AR land doing the same? ..."

Hello Cal,

I wasn't sure if this fits your post, but this is the "Double Rifles Forum" so here goes.

Here is one of my double rifles that's a "Howdah Rifle". Its a rare Westley Richards with 16" Factory Barrels. It shipped to M. Saleh & Co. in Bombay, India.

M. Saleh & Co. is still in operation today by Saleh's Great Grandson. I telephoned him and he indicated that this rifle was special ordered by his Great Grand Father in 1927. He wanted a compact Double Rifle for Tiger hunting from the close quarters of the Howdah.

Its in 375-2.5" Nitro Express caliber with an overall length, from Muzzle to Butt, of just under 33 inches". That's 1-1/2" shorter than a 94 Winchester Trapper.

Note the Tiger engraved on the trigger guard.

That is too cool. Wish I had it to go with my pistol.
Better tomorrows!

A great rifle in 375. Have you developed a load for the gun? Packy

Wickedly Cool

Buck:
Cool rifle. I love short barrels. If you like historical rifles someday we should chat about one I have.
Harry:
Brass and a mould are available from X-ring Services. If you are interested in smokeless loads, let me know and I'll send you some data.
So far Unique is working the best. Blue Dot is the worst as it does not seem to ignite with LRM primers. 2400 is OK but I will probably stick to Unique.
Cal

quote:

Originally posted by packrattusnongratus:
A great rifle in 375. Have you developed a load for the gun? Packy

Hello packrattusnongratus,

Thanks for the reply

Yes, I have a load that print under 1-1/2" at 50 yds - 1800fps with a 300g bullet.

quote:

Originally posted by Harry:
That is too cool. Wish I had it to go with my pistol.
Better tomorrows!

Hello Harry,

Thanks for the reply

quote:

Originally posted by Zephyr:
Wickedly Cool

Hello Zephyr,

Thanks for the reply

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:
Buck:
Cool rifle. I love short barrels. If you like historical rifles someday we should chat about one I have.

Cal

Hello Cal,

Thanks for your reply.

You know I love guns with stories to tell.

Cal, have you tried Trail Boss or XMP5744? I used the latter with data from Accurate Arms to load for an old cut-down Snider three-bander I owned 15 or 20 years ago.
Some wonderful arms being described here!

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
Cal, have you tried Trail Boss or XMP5744? I used the latter with data from Accurate Arms to load for an old cut-down Snider three-bander I owned 15 or 20 years ago.
Some wonderful arms being described here!

Thanks, Bill. I guess I'll put TB on my to do list. If I recall correctly, 5744 is about the same as 4198. If so, it may be too slow for 6-inh barrels. But, it may be worth a try.
Cheers,
Cal

Cal, When you have time in between dodging earthquakes I would appreciate the load data you mention for the Howdah pistol.
Better tomorrows,
Mims aka Harry

quote:

Originally posted by Harry:
Cal, When you have time in between dodging earthquakes I would appreciate the load data you mention for the Howdah pistol.
Better tomorrows,
Mims aka Harry

PM sent.
Cal