The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Double Rifles Sabatti or MerkelGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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Or a matched set of Sabattis? :-0 | |||
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It won't make any difference. You are dealing with double rifle snobbishness, and that is why I founded the "NHUYHHADRSC" (non head up your high horse ass double rifle shooters club) for those of us who value performance more than pinky lifted tea drinking........  | |||
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Owned a Sabatti, never owned a Merkel, but have seen and read enough I wouldn't own either on a dare.. USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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Respectfully totally disagree Jorge. I have owned several Merkels. Very good "value". That being said, I would never own a Model 141 with the "do it at home regulation". I've heard and seen too many horror stories. Model 140 with fixed regulation is a nice gun for the money. Just my $.02 Deo Vindice, Don Sons of Confederate Veterans Black Horse Camp #780 | |||
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Totally agree DD. JP Sauer Drilling 12x12x9.3x72 David Murray Scottish Hammer 12 Bore Alex Henry 500/450 Double Rifle Steyr Classic Mannlicher Fullstock 6.5x55 Steyr Classic Mannlicher Fullstock .30-06 Walther PPQ H2 9mm Walther PPS M2 Cogswell & Harrison Hammer 12 Bore Damascus And Too Many More | |||
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Nothing wrong with the Merkel DRs...one of the more accurate makes out there. | |||
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I am actually going to set aside teasing and be serious for a moment. I have a Sabatti in 450NE. It is an older one without ground muzzles that I got a good deal on at Cabelas. It would have worked out of the box, but I didn't like that groups from all ammo and all but the slowest handloads crossed at 50 yds. Also, the POI was VERY high, like a foot at yds. While a taller front sight helped, it still needed to come down 8" or so. So I found a load I liked that each barrel grouped well, loaded up 60 rounds and sent the Sabatti to Aaron Little who regulated it and fit the stock to me. The rifle now is great: strong, reliable, accurate, works with a wide range of loads, and it fits me. I think I paid Aaron $1400 for the regulation, reblue, and stock work. After doing a lot more reading than writing on this forum, it seems to me that ALL brands of doubles rifles have issues. Part of that is the difficulty of regulating the barrels, some is shooter error, and a bunch is that because doubles are very often used for dangerous game, owners are very fussy about the proper functioning. I think big bore bolt shooters are the same way. Now some companies provide good warranty service, others not so much, and it seems the budget grade doubles like Sabatti are more in the "not so much" category than they are in the "good service" category. The long and short of this is each particular rifle needs to be sorted out on its own, and each particular rifle stands on its own. If you start with a $4250 Sabatti like I did, you wind up with a good rifle for under $6k. If you started with a new Sabatti for $6000, and have to have it fixed, you could be into it for $7500. If you start with an $8000 Merkel and have to pay to have it fixed, you are in for $9500. All that said, I think someone starting with a budget grade double should be prepared to spend $1500 to get it in shape. Whether or not a $7000 Merkel fits the budget grade category I'll leave to others to decide. Heym, VC, and Searcy seem to fall into the mid grade category and the manufacturers seem very good about making sure those rifles work right. However, I think these rifles new run $15-$20k and up. If I was going to spend $15-20k on a DR I would expect it to work right out of the box and the manufacturer to immediately and cheerfully fix any issues I found. I do NOT expect that out of a budget grade double and that is why I had no issue spending $1400 to have my Sabatti reworked to my specifications. If you don't mind a rifle project--as is the case with almost all of my rifles--bolt, lever, and semi-auto; then buy a budget grade double and be ready to rework it. If you do not have the time, ability, or inkling to do that, then spend the money and get one you won't have to mess with. That might be a new mid-grade or a used one with a known history. That is how I see it and that is as objective as I can be on this topic. Your mileage may vary.......... | |||
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The flaw in your logic here is that with a new Merkel, should anything be wrong with it, Merkel will repair it correctly under warranty. They wouldn't break out the dremel or make you pay to repair your new gun. Sabatti is likely to do both ... make you pay for them to take a drill to your muzzles! No thanks! The Merkel 500NE I owned was 100% right out of the box. Never had a single issue with it and it took numerous DG animals. I took that gun into the thick stuff after mean and nasties several times. I always had confidence in it ... 100%! | |||
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There is no flaw in my logic. New Merkels are what now, $9k? If Merkel can fix it to your satisfaction then great. Sabatti is supposed to be doing that now as well and they are in the $6k range. However, there as many things the factory will not do so you still may be stuck spending $$ to have a Merkel or Sabatti reworked to your own specs. IIRC, Merkels have a reputation for doubling, which clearly puts the brand in the questionable category. Sabatti resolved their issues, but has Merkel? Yes, your Merkel may have worked great out of the box but there are plenty of Sabatti owners who have had the same luck with their Sabattis. This brings us back to my main point, which is each rifle stands on its own. As far as brands, a mid-grade double like Heym, VC, or Seacy gives you the best chance of having it reliable and built like you want it out if the box. You get what you pay for........ | |||
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That's quite alright, DD. I just go with what I've seen and read, and with over thirteen documented doublings of Merkels it sure gives me pause. and there is of course aesthetics. I find Merkels unappealing, much like the notched receivers on the Heyms I do not care for, nor the cocking levers on Krieghoffs, but unlike the Merkels, those two brands have a pretty good record, at lest from what I can gather. Cheers, J USN (ret) DRSS Verney-Carron 450NE Cogswell & Harrison 375 Fl NE Sabatti Big Five 375 FL Magnum NE DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
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I'm quite happy with my Merkel 470 for the past 6 years. I was able to find three really nice loads to shoot to regulation (500gr woodleigh softs, 500gr tsx's, 500gr woodleigh softs over trail boss). I have not experienced a double with this rifle as I've seen jorge point out numerous times. I'm not saying it will never happen, an I'm thankful he's pointed it out so if mine ever does I know I'm not alone on it. For now I'll just keep shooting and be happy in my investment. Cape buff on the menu for it next sept.... | |||
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