John Taylor says that the early .500s were built to heavy, about 12 pounds, so most guys just opted to get the .577. He suggests 10.5 pounds. Butch builds them at 11-11.5 pounds. Merkel and Krieghoff I think run about 10.5 pounds. It seems to me 11.5 is about right. What do you think a .500 NE should weigh?

Any 500 NE under 16 lbs. is too light for it's caliber!

All of mine weigh in that 12 - 13 lb range.

Some feel like a lead weight, others feel light as a feather.

10.5 I reckon would kick a fair bit, even if it was well and correctly stocked.

I think if you carry it more than shoot it, 10.5 lbs is fine but expect a bit of a boot.

A 500 feels right when it weighs from 10.75 to 11 pounds for me. With the R-15 loads I use the recoil is quite manageable and my Heym weighed from the factory 10.5 pounds, a little light but I added 8 oz's to it so at 11 lbs it seems perfect.

Mine will weigh right out 11 lbs!

10.5 pounds, perfect.

For use with a lot of foot work, 10.5 to 11lbs would be my pick.

quote:

Originally posted by 500N:
All of mine weigh in that 12 - 13 lb range.

500N, the words 'all of mine' sound intriguing to me. If you don't mind how many of these critters do you have branded with 500 N.E.?

You know if you lived over here in the states at this time our president might interpret this situation as not sharing the wealth.

quote:

Originally posted by dirklawyer:
A 500 feels right when it weighs from 10.75 to 11 pounds for me. With the R-15 loads I use the recoil is quite manageable and my Heym weighed from the factory 10.5 pounds, a little light but I added 8 oz's to it so at 11 lbs it seems perfect.

Dirk:

Do you have to use a filler with the Reloder 15? Have you tried any of the slower powders like IMR or H4831?

Dirk, I was wondering, did you have or have you had a .470 and, if so, what made you step up to the .500?

I had my 470 weighed yesterday @ 10 lbs; 10 oz. Heym 88B safari classic; I had a mercury tube installed to get at this weight. Recoil was pretty stiff prior to the tube. It must have been below 10 lbs. before the tube was installed. It is manageable at 10lbs 10 oz. I suspect in a Heym you might want a 11 lbs gun for a 500.

EZ

quote:

Originally posted by dirklawyer:

quote:

Originally posted by 500N:
All of mine weigh in that 12 - 13 lb range.

500N, the words 'all of mine' sound intriguing to me. If you don't mind how many of these critters do you have branded with 500 N.E.?

You know if you lived over here in the states at this time our president might interpret this situation as not sharing the wealth.

As mcuh as your President seems to be doing some things right,
his thought's on Sharing the wealth are not one of them (as well as plenty of his other thoughts)

In answer to the first question, currently 3 but I had 5.

I would want my 500 Nitro to weigh 12 to 12 3/4 lbs. Well balanced of course.

I have shot several 500 Nitros that I felt were just too light.

The 500NE is my favorite chambering over .450 bore, and I like a 500NE well ballanced at 11.5 loaded!

Mac:

I am thinking about a .470 or a .500. Would you give up your .470 for a .500? I have shot them both and maybe the .500s that I have shot were to light but I thought there was a significant difference in recoil between the .470 and the .500 so I guess I was kinda leaning toward a .470.

Heck Dave you got a 500/416, and a 450 rigby, why get a 470.

Step up and get a 500! Oh I forgot you got a 500 jefferry too. You might need to step on up to a 577! Now thats a step!

LOLOLOL.... Ed, I know you are right. I NEED another gun like a hole in the head. It's just that after owning this .500/.416, I think I have double rifle fever

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
Dirk:
Do you have to use a filler with the Reloder 15? Have you tried any of the slower powders like IMR or H4831?

Dirk, I was wondering, did you have or have you had a .470 and, if so, what made you step up to the .500?

Using the slower burning powders in which the powder charge is much greater there is an objective felt recoil difference over the R-15. I use half of a Kynoch wad and 90 grains of R-15.

I use to have a 470N.E. and it weighed the same as my 500N.E., if I used 106 grains of IMR 4831 with the 470 load the recoil difference with my present 500 caliber it was not that much different to me. I know the numbers show different on a recoil calculator it might be that with the faster R-15 powder the recoil velocity or duration of recoil is such that is decreases felt recoil.

I'll never own another 470N.E. the 500 is in a class by itself and the 470 well it gets any job you want done on DG but so does the 450, 465, 475#2, 450#2, etc., etc. it's part of a great class DG caiibers but it's not a 500, the 500 is a step above with what I have found in the field, the critter's feel the difference.
Another reason for my choice of the 500, it gives me a caliber gap that I can fill with a lighter caliber DR in 9.3, 375 or 450/400.

It does help to mention that Ian Nynschens, John Hunter, Sten Cedegren (sp?), John Taylor spoke highly of the 500 and thought it was a great killer without killing the shooter.

Dave, I'd like to end with this note, when I was looking to move up to the 500 a lot of guys on AR about spooked me with the 500 recoil question 2+ years ago. If you ask everybody on AR about felt recoil of their pet 470 and shooting their friends 500 at some shoot (which most likely that bud's 500 did not fit them 100%)your going to get some horror stories. If you look at a recoil calculator they'll scare you. Likewise some years ago when all I had shot was a 30-06 and I was looking to buy a 338 some good ol boys around my home town told me that a 338 win. mag. was going to break my shoulder. Well, I loved my new 338 back then and found it to be a pee shooter and I love to shoot my 500 N.E. today, yes recoil is relative and you have to know you're recoil limit to shoot straight, I can shoot my 500 straight with the R-15, I tried using 110 grains of the slower powders and found it affected my accuracy thus I had crossed over my recoil tolerance level.

Thanks Dirk

My 500 from Butch with the extra long stock I need for my 6'3" frame weights 12.4lbs over the scales.It is well balanced,good to carry and beautiful to shoot-comes back on target well.It kicks so mildly from the stand I cannot think of wanting anything lighter-you can allways get the second tracker or the game scout to cary it for you if the years or the whisky have taken their toll.

Dirk,

Do you chrono your loads? I am curious what velocity you are getting with the 90 grains of RL15 loads. I am shooting 96-99 grains of RL15 (depending on the lot), 570 Woodleighs, 1/2 Kynoch wad and F215M and getting right at 2070 2090 fps. I get something in that velocity range regardless of whether it is in the Merkel, Krieghoff or Searcy. A 90 grain load seems like it would be shooting under 2000 fps. Then again, the lots vary on RL15 so you may have the mother of all fast lots.

Dirk:

I think Mike might be correct here. If you convert the cordite load using RL15 (80 X 1.19) you get 95.2 grains. If you use IMR 4831 (80 X 1.333) you get 106.6 grains to get 2150 fps.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Dirk,

Do you chrono your loads? I am curious what velocity you are getting with the 90 grains of RL15 loads. I am shooting 96-99 grains of RL15 (depending on the lot), 570 Woodleighs, 1/2 Kynoch wad and F215M and getting right at 2070 2090 fps. I get something in that velocity range regardless of whether it is in the Merkel, Krieghoff or Searcy. A 90 grain load seems like it would be shooting under 2000 fps. Then again, the lots vary on RL15 so you may have the mother of all fast lots.

Mike, as I shared some time ago I do have the mother of all fast lots of R-15. I use an Oehler chrono screens on four ft, chrono is dead on. How I know this is to be true is that when I was getting such high velocities with my loads in 375H&H and 416rem mag I sent the chrono back to Oehler they said the chrono was OK. With my Heym 500 I use 90 grains of my freak R-15 with 1/2 Kynoch wad, F215GM primer and a 540 grain GS solid or a 570 grain Woodie soft and I get 2090fps. I do have a new lot of R-15 so I'll let you know what I'm getting with it next week. Mike it could also be that the chambers/throat could be such in your Merkel that it developes less chamber pressure than my Heym which could be part of the load/velocity discrepancy.

I suspect it is the lot variation with RL15. I have three .500 NE's (Merkel, Searcy and Krieghoff) and the velocities are consistent between the three. I love RL15, but I sure wish it was more consistent lot-to-lot.

Bottom line, this highlights the need to have a chrono if you are shooting a double. If you were loading my loads (+9 grains) with your lot, sheesh, who knows what might happen.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by MJines:
I have three .500 NE's (Merkel, Searcy and Krieghoff),

Dang Mike thats a double habit! Which do you like best?

Ed

I have done most of my hunting with the Merkel although I have developed a real affinity for the Krieghoff. The Searcy has not been used that much -- be me. The Searcy belonged to Dan McCarthy (500Grains) and he used it to take a number (five +) of elephant. This year I plan to take the Krieghoff with me.

I have handled that searcy, it was very nice. Yep Dan wacked a ton of stuff with that gun.

I cant wait to get my FAMARS in. I may see it before the end of the year. I hope so.

Ed

I really need to find a home for one of the .500's but I love the caliber.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
I suspect it is the lot variation with RL15. I have three .500 NE's (Merkel, Searcy and Krieghoff) and the velocities are consistent between the three. I love RL15, but I sure wish it was more consistent lot-to-lot.

Bottom line, this highlights the need to have a chrono if you are shooting a double. If you were loading my loads (+9 grains) with your lot, sheesh, who knows what might happen.

Holy crap! A nine grain variation in Reloder 15 loads.

Seems like a lot (no pun intended) to me too. I can say that to get the same velocity with my latest lot of RL15 I had to increase the charge by 3 grains, from 96 to 99 grains. That is a 3% difference roughly, but a 10% difference is huge. I think Dirk cuts his RL15 with plastic explosive -- gives it that turbo charged effect.

Guys, do you think there is any possibility it could be a difference in scales. I have to confess that I have never checked my RCBS scale with scale weights. We all just assume that they are correct. However, when I use Reloder 15, velocity is usually below the publiched data and I have to work up but I have not noticed these signigicant changes in velocity for lot to lot. Maybe Dirk's scale reads on the light side.

I posted a question about lot to lot variations with Reloder 15 in the reloading section. Let's see if anyone else has noticed this as well.

You learn something new every day. I usually chronograph a load initially but don't "re-chronograph" over and over again with each new lot of powder.

Nine grains. That's huge! If that is the case, I am going to use up my Reloder 15 and go in another direction.

I am somewhat anal on the weighing. I have an RCBS Chargemaster so I use that to throw the powder, then I weigh every fifth round on an RCBS balance scale. So the odds of my measurements being off is pretty low.

Alright guys cat's out of the bag, I special ordered my Heym 500N.E. with 30 inch barrels and I told them I prefer the bullet in the cartrage to be touching the rifling. You think this might be part of the higher velocity issue?

I use an RCBS chargemaster also, the problem, it's not really a problem is that I have ran out of the R-15 (that behaves like Bullseye) and have to get back to the range to work up some loads. I will video the fun with the rifle and chrono especially if I am still getting ridiculous velocity per 90 grain loads.

Mike and Dirk:

I started a thread in the Reloading section inquiring if anyone had noticed any lot-to-lot differences with Reloder 15. Some interesting responses. You might want to take a look at it.