I have decided to take the plunge on my first double rifle. I have narrowed it down to a 450/400 or 450 3 1/4, but I'm leaning heavily toward the 450/400. I think I would use a 450/400 more. My 10 year old son and I took our first trip to Africa (Namibia) last month, and we had a blast. I think it would be fun to take a scoped double on our future plains game hunts. I also plan to do a buff hunt alone, without my little guy. This has me thinking 450/400 for my first double.

I began the process thinking a 450/400 at about 9 pounds before scope would be a nice compromise between weight and recoil. I've only been looking for a couple months but so far,.....the SxS 450/400's I have found are weighing between 10 lbs 2 oz and 11 lbs 4 oz without scope.

Am I off base thinking a 450/400 should weigh 9 pounds?? Would the recoil be excessive? If I buy an 11 pound rifle, I'd rather step it up to a 450 3 1/4.

How much should a 450/400 double weigh?

Mine weighs a little under 9.5 lb and recoil isn't to bad.I would think a 9 pounder would be about right after adding the scope.Just make sure the rifle fits you.


Fred

9 1/2 Lbs. was the standard for later 450/400s.

465H&H

9 1/2-10 lbs

If I remember correctly my 450/400 3 1/4" weighs 10 lbs 2 oz.

I scoped it with a S&B 1.1to4, with illuminated flashdot reticle.

I have not weighed it with the scope on it.

Does not seem too heavy to me.

A scoped 450/400 is a most excellent hunting rifle.

Now that Hornady is making 450/400 3" ammo, it is probably a better choice, but If you want a British double and found a good 3 1/4" I would not pass it up.

Let me add that if I was buying a new made double rifle today it would be a Heym 450/400 3" with a scope in Claw mounts.

26" bbls with splinter forend.

8 lbs., but it ain't ever going to happen!

Blue Devil:

The 450/400 is a very fine cartridge indeed but I think that you have pointed out the "problem" (if you can call it that) with this particular round. Most 450/400s weigh upwards of ten pounds and then, most owners want to put a scope on them. That pushes the weight to +/ eleven pounds. That's awfully heavy for a 400 grain bullet at +/- 2100 fps. My feeling was if I was going to carry that much weight, I wanted more cartridge so I choose a .500/.416 instead. My K-gun in that caliber weighs in around 10.5 pounds without a scope and I think that is about perfect. Since I don't care for scopes on doubles, I also have a .416 Rigby that with a scope will weigh about ten pounds.

9lbs for a 450/400; 10lbs for a 450 3 1/4"

If your ordering a new rifle. I looking used, settle for 9 1/2lbs for the 450/400, and that will take a lot of looking. But no reason to hump a 10lb or 10 plus lb rifle and shoot 400grs of bullet.

I suspact that the more buff and elephant hunting you do, the lighter you will want your rifle in any given cartridge. Also, I'll bet that if you get into elephant hunting and hunt more than a few, you'll end up with a 450 (or 500.)

JPK

quote:

Originally posted by JPK:
9lbs for a 450/400; 10lbs for a 450 3 1/4"

If your ordering a new rifle. I looking used, settle for 9 1/2lbs for the 450/400, and that will take a lot of looking. But no reason to hump a 10lb or 10 plus lb rifle and shoot 400grs of bullet.

I suspact that the more buff and elephant hunting you do, the lighter you will want your rifle in any given cartridge. Also, I'll bet that if you get into elephant hunting and hunt more than a few, you'll end up with a 450 (or 500.)

JPK

When I was shopping for my 450/400 cal. vintage U.K. built double, {which

I did for about a year and a half, and I was open to either length, 3" or

3 1/4"} I was happy to find one for sale that was 10 lb. 4 oz. or lighter.

But when I found one it was 19 thousand or more dollars. I could not spend

that much, and I really wanted one at or under 10 pounds, and again I wanted

vintage U.K. built. The rifle I ultimately bought and now own is 10 pounds

7 ounces, 28" barrels. You're gonna need money into the twenties I'll bet to

get a 10 pounder, {or lighter} unless you come upon a guy that just wants to

sell fast or the rifle is quite needy of repair, IF you want an old U.K. rifle.

If you are NOT pulled by the history and all that comes with an old U.K. rifle

see www.kebcollc.com - www.heymusa.com and www.eurogunimports.com

in no particular order, and also I think Merkel and Krieghoff both offer 450/400

caliber at this time.

My new FAMARS will be 9-9.5lbs with 25in barrels. I think thats about right.

Ed

THAT IS ABOUT RIGHT! In more ways than weight!

JPK

Ed B....what, no wood pix again???

We will have to see the finished product!

Ed

My Heym .450/.400 3" weighs 10lb 2oz with its 26' barrels. That's a bit heavier and muzzle heavy than I'd like but it's a pussy to shoot and seems to kick less than my heavy 338 Win. It handles well, though: I shot a running deer with it the other day and I can shoot the same group as the factory test off sticks at 50 yards. If anything, the gentle recoil makes me feel as though I'm cheating somehow.

Cheers
- Paul

That should be 26-inch barrels

Dave, you make a good point...I don't know why the 500-416 isn't more popular than it is. It's really the only offering in a double rifle that approaches the benchmark "400gr @ 2,400fps" that has made the 416 Rigby, 416 Rem, etc so popular for any large African game. Maybe it's a matter of tradition, or lack of same. Someone (other than a PH) picking a double as their primary DGR is probably into it for the tradition and history of African hunting as anything else.

I think the 450/400 set the benchmark at 400 grains and 2000-2050 real world fps a century ago, and it killed them plenty dead enough. More velocity is better, but only as long as the package weighs the same and is just as easy to shoot. At 10.5-11 lbs, I'd want something bigger too.

One day at a DRSS shoot I was able to fire a coue of 450/400 British guns, a 500/416 Krieghoff, my 450 No2, and a couple of modern 470's.

The 450/400's had the least recoil.

The 500/416 and 470's kicked the same to me, and more than my 450 No2, which being British is a little heavier than the modern 500/416 and the 470's.

My 3 1/4" 1909 Greener is a bit under 9#. It has considerably less felt recoil than my 3" Green and Sons weighing about 10.5#. Stock design.

quote:

Originally posted by WY:
My 3 1/4" 1909 Greener is a bit under 9#.

Nitro? If so then ohhh, ahhh, I'm envious.

JPK

Be envious all you want.

I have an 8# 12.8 oz. Ad Jansen best quality BLE. Still too damned light.

Just trying to stir the little bastards up.

JPK,

Yep, N E 3 1/4" with nice bright bores.

I don't think anyone should get hung up over a few ounces. Most of the time you are at the range with the rifle anyhow.

What does seem important to me is how easily it carries. If it balances well on the shoulder and perhaps if it has a well padded sling that will be more appreciated than half a pound of weight.

texasbluedevil

I replied to your PM, but my Krieghoff that I have for sale weighs 10.6lbs