What do you think guys, at double rifle ranges, 50 meters or so, is there really much difference between the flanged .375 and the 9.3X74R?

Are you talking velocity, killing power ????

If you compare 270gn vs 286gn and 300 vs 320gn, nope, the animals all fall over dead.


BTW - For me, DR ranges extend way beyond 50 yards, especially on 2nd and 3rd follow up shots if required but they don't extend beyond where trajectory becomes a factor.

.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
What do you think guys, at double rifle ranges, 50 meters or so, is there really much difference between the flanged .375 and the 9.3X74R?

Inasmuch that you'll have hell's own time finding .375 flanged ammo, yes.
Otherwise, no.

- Lars/Finland

Nearly identical, .366 vs .375, 15grs diff in factory load. 375 can go to 350grs, the 9.3 can go up to 320gr, and this is where the 375Fl can unseat the 9.3R. The 9.3 can be had in a very handy rifle. Not all 375 DRs are handy, most too big, but all have to handle a case bigger than the 9.3.

375 Flanged Kynoch load for 300gr bullet out of a 28" test barrel. Figure loss of 25fps per inch lost. 24" barrel would produce 2325 fps.
http://www.new-kynoch.apt-sites.com/375%20flanged.htm

9.3x74R Norma load for 285gr bullet. The PH line is tested in 24" bbls. I no longer have an email I received from Norma, prior to the PH line coming out, stating 24" test barrels. All Norma ammo I've shot over the years seemed full house, if not hot, loads. For me it confirms they haven't tested with over long barrels.
http://www.norma.cc/sortimentj...&Kalibernamn=9,3x74R

The 375 Flanged is well up to the task. The 9.3x74R is practically identical.

Listen Dave,

If you go over to the "Small Bore" forum, people are STILL arguing over which is better on deer: .243Win vs. 6mm Rem

Of course a 9.3 is better than a .375. 9 is bigger than 3 so ...

Of course .375 is better than .366, it's bigger, isn't it ...

Didn't some old guy argue that the .270 Win was the perfect caliber for all things walking the USA while another old guy argued that "Big and Slow was the only way to go"?

All in good fun and variety makes it even funner ...

quote:

Originally posted by CCMDoc:
All in good fun and variety makes it even funner ...

But the most important thing is, it allows you to own 2 similar double rifles,
one in each caliber so that you can compare yourself LOL

Need never comes into it, just wants


.

quote:

Originally posted by 500N:

quote:

Originally posted by CCMDoc:
All in good fun and variety makes it even funner ...

But the most important thing is, it allows you to own 2 similar double rifles,
one in each caliber so that you can compare yourself LOL

Need never comes into it, just wants


.

Now you're talkin!

I want the .375 Holland & Holland Flanged.

I dunno, I just don't like that comma between the 9 and the 3.

quote:

Originally posted by PSmith:
I want the .375 Flanged.

I dunno, I just don't like that comma between the 9 and the 3.

I like 375 mostly because I can say Holland & Holland afterwards

general, yes you are so right, I have amended my previous post to reflect that most important part of the name.

One of the great things about the 9.3 is the great price these rifles can be purchased at. Most 375's are in the price range of a 470 and the brass is a pain to find. For the small amount of loss in performance compared to price, you can buy a whole lot of ammo or even put some money down on a plains game safari.

Assuming it regulates, or close enough, you can goose the velocities of the 300 gr. 9.3 bullet up to 2500 to 2550 like the 375 H&H.

Of course it's better....I OWN a 375 Fl Mag....that's why!!!

Gary
DRSS
NRA Lifer
DSC

If I had to choose, it would be the 9.3X74R. More available ammo.

If you reload..no. In factory ammo thogh I have yet to see any bullets for the 9,3x74 that are suitable for dangerous game (no woodleigh or Barnes solids, no Swift A frame or TSX or?)

In .375FL you can buy (at a price) suitable factory ammo.

I own a 9,3x62 which I am very satisfied with...I Have used the caliber almost exclusively on buffalo culls and general parks control hunting as well as PH work for 25 years. Two years ago I traded a 500/416 for a .375 FL...Swift A frame's, Norma Oryx and Woodleigh Solids...and I am very happy with it.

Many 9,3 doubles are built on shotgun or lighter rifle actions...and I wouldn't load em up - Most are designed to give you a loooong life at factory pressures and action life decreases rapidly as you push up the pressures. In something like a K gun..yes you can probaly load the two to identical performance- but there is no need. The 9,3 with suitable bullets will get the job done.

In the '70's, I took my Krieghoff DR in .375 H&H on three safaris and accounted for lion, leopard, eland, greater kudu, and lesser kudu with it. Would the 9.3X74R have done the job as well? I am satisfied that it would have.

Would I have preferred a rifle in .375 H&H Flanged? The fact is, I am now having a Krieghoff DR fitted with a set of 9.3X74R barrels.

Downside of the .375 H&H Flanged: no factory loads, expensive, hard to find brass.

If I had a DR in .375 Flanged, would I use it? You bet, but that's a different question!

The 9.3's are totally unsuitable but get propped up by deceived believers.

The downside of the 9,3x74 (besides the coma) is that it is not legal in some countries for DG (that is, if anyone in Africa gives a flip).

Federal now loads 9.3x74R. All 286gr stated at 2360fps, Barnes TSX & Banded Solid, Swift A-Frame. In Europe RWS loads good bullets for DG.

At least 5,000 more at time of purchace--thats the only dif. I see!

Ed

I really want a .375 Flanged Magnum in a double rifle. But sanity dictates that a 9.3 makes a WHOLE lot more sense for my purposes which will primarily be as back up rifle to my .470 and a plains game and hog thumper.

If you had 250 rounds of 375 Fl. Mag. Horneber brass, would that obliterate the the differencee in the two calibers? The ballistic advantage goes to the 375.

quote:

Originally posted by lb404:
If you had 250 rounds of 375 Fl. Mag. Horneber brass, would that obliterate the the differencee in the two calibers? The ballistic advantage goes to the 375.

On paper maybe.

In the field, bugger all.

And you still have the problem of getting readily available brass.

I have both and reload for both and would take 375 Fl for nostalgia reasons and 9.3 for lightness and ease reasons.

The 375 Flanged NE is less power than the 9.3X74R!

Now if you're talking about the 375 Magnum Flanged NE then that's a different story.

Which caliber are you talking about?

quote:

Originally posted by 500N:

quote:

Originally posted by lb404:
If you had 250 rounds of 375 Fl. Mag. Horneber brass, would that obliterate the the differencee in the two calibers? The ballistic advantage goes to the 375.

On paper maybe.

In the field, bugger all.

And you still have the problem of getting readily available brass.

I have both and reload for both and would take 375 Fl for nostalgia reasons and 9.3 for lightness and ease reasons.

+1!!

You know, for everything on this planet, short of thick-skinned dangerous game, the 9.3x74R, loaded with the 286 grain Nosler Partition, is more than enough. If you are going to tackle dangerous game, there are several makers of fine solids in .366" calibre.

Hornady brass for the 9.3 works out to about $1 each, compared to $5 or $6 for Bertram in .375 H&H flanged NE.

An RCBS 2-die set in 9.3 is about $60 and is an in-stock item. The same for the .375 is near $300 and is a special order item requiring a 3 to 4 month wait...if you're lucky.

Also, as Don pointed out, the 9.3 makes up into a lighter, trimmer gun than the .375. These are the reasons that, when I decided about a month ago, to build a sixth double rifle to fill the void between my .303 British and my .450 #2NE, I chose to go with the 9.3.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Brooks:
The 375 Flanged NE is less power than the 9.3X74R!

Now if you're talking about the 375 Magnum Flanged NE then that's a different story.

Which caliber are you talking about?

375 Flanged Magnum Nitro Express.

the nuts and bolts of the deal is this, whatever you find in the way of available rifles is what you can find in the caliber you want or afford to spend money on. There is a ballistic advantage between the 375 Fl. Magnum and either the 360 #2 and 9.3x74. If you load up any round for double rifles beyond factory regulation levels, you will probably change its pattern of regulation as well as its useful service life. The ability to find cases and quality reloading dies(if and only if you reload) is the only difference in the cost of components. If you buy 200 rounds of brass, I am told by Caswell, that will usually last a lifetime of shooting. if you think you will shoot your double rifle more than that, buy more cases at the outset. Being able to buy cheap ammunition isn't the only consideration or we would be using the more readily available cases like 45-70, 40-65 etc. that are often used for cowboy action shooting. I still think there are more makers of .375 bullets than .366 bullets. and that is the actual component that touches the game animal! On Champlins web site are useful comparisons/ rifle weight per caliber. H&H 375 flanged magnum(10.0), Lang 360#2(9/13), Purdy 369 N.E.(9/1).all sidelocks. Not a lot of difference overall. Many of the makers of continental s/s in 9.3x74 say the ideal weight for that caliber is about 8.5 lbs. Some of the o/u 9.3 will weigh in at 7.5-8 lbs again not a tremendous difference. My point is that balance as well as fit/finish will make a bigger difference than an actual pound of weight will. Just my observation of owning a coupe of double rifles over the years as well as speaking with George numerous of hours in person as well as on the phone. In theory the 9.3x74 may be adequate but the 375 Fl. MG. is better in my assessment.

If a quality DR builder would offer a 375 Flanged at the same price and weight as a 9.3x74R....then I'd own one.

But I can't understand paying twice as much and carrying 2+ more lbs for basically the same performance..

Buy what you "WANT"....

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
What do you think guys, at double rifle ranges, 50 meters or so, is there really much difference between the flanged .375 and the 9.3X74R?

Out to 50m there is nothing in it. From 50 to 150m the 9,3 wins hands down!
Seriously, a medium DR is way more capable than 50m

quote:

Originally posted by JabaliHunter:

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
What do you think guys, at double rifle ranges, 50 meters or so, is there really much difference between the flanged .375 and the 9.3X74R?

Out to 50m there is nothing in it. From 50 to 150m the 9,3 wins hands down!
Seriously, a medium DR is way more capable than 50m

A medium DR is only a rifle with 2 barrels so if a 9.3 x 62 can shoot game out to 250 - 300 metres, a 9.3 x 74R is only limited by the accuracy of the gun (DR) and the ability of the nut behind the butt.

I would take a running shot on a pig at 150 yards with a 9.3 or 375 Fl DR if the shot presented itself.

quote:

I would take a running shot on a pig at 150 yards with a 9.3 or 375 Fl DR if the shot presented itself.

Funny you should mention that. Took a good buddy with me to Germany for a driven hunt. He grew up in Montana and cut his teeth on elk and mule deer. He was given a nice little Sauer 90 in 9.3x62...zeroed at 170Meters and felt comfortable after a few practice shots at the range. We had a great first day, both killing a hog and a fallow deer so we were stationed the next morning where we supposedly wouldn't see too much action (we weren't paying guests!!). About 11 in the morning a group of about 15 hogs came down this dried creek bed right in front of me and I killed two of the smaller sows (remember not to shot the leading sow if you're ever invited!). This group veered off and ran out through a field in front of my buddies stand and he rolled two in a heap at about 140meters with his 9.3....a real piece of slick shooting..both animals hit in the bread basket and DRT. He also killed a nice boar that evening at last light at about 170 meters with the same gun...same result.

Jon, I am really curious about something. What happened to the pigs after you collected them? Did someone eat them? I saw a report on the news the other night that there was an advisory in Germany that wild pigs should not be eaten. Apparently, even all these years after Chernobyl, the pigs eat the mushrooms and such in Germany and absorb quite a bit of radioactivity. I am not kidding.

500N - me too!

Dave - I think that only applies to certain specific areas that are closely monitored. In those zones, hunters are compensated or provided with meat from other areas in exchange.

My vote is for the 375 Flanged Magnum, hands down...its legal in Africa and I want a proper English double in my rack!!...and it is cool to say H&H, punctuating your comments on your double!!
There is plenty of good ammo around if you look!!
That said, if you drift to the "other side"...VC,Chapuis, Merkel, Heym and Kreighoff all build them too!!...who knows a Sabatti might be out there in the future...then maybe Hornady or Federal will start loading them??
I am SO SORRY I sold my William Evans 375 Flanged Mag in a weak moment!!