After reading a thread on a big bore using Ramshot powder I did a little investigation.
After running the Big Game" powder through my QuickLOAD program, I found that when using 66.6 grains of "Big Game" in 450/400 3 inch with a 400 grain Woodleigh Federal 215 Primer it will give me same velocity as 63 grains of RL-15. Pressure curve about identical with less peak pressure from the Ramshot "Big Game". I emailed Ramshot to confirm my findings and they agreed that "Big Game" would work in my 450/400 3 inch.

Both loads require a Dacron or foam plug filler as both powders are position sensitive and do not fill the large Nitro Express case.

I don't know if it is worth the change over. I do not know if Ramshot "Big Game" will give the velocity consistency I get from RL-15. Just some food for thought.

If anyone would care to share their experience with this powder, it would be greatly appreciated

quote:

Reply

Please be careful with that stuff.The only rifle I blew up in 30 years of reloading was with Ramshot Tac. I was working up loads at the range. I set my redding powder measure to throw a set charge, I checked 2 and started loading 10 rounds. I shot the 10th round first. I locked up the bolt big time and damage was severe and I had to replace the bolt, and blue print the action again. The 9 th round had 12 more grs of powder than intended, the 4th round had 6 more grs than intended. The #'s on the measure were right but it was throwing charges that keep getting heavier. My gunsmith told me he has seen more rifles blown up with ball powder than anything else.
He caters to the bench-rest and shilo crowd.


I just got some rl 17 that is supposed to between rl15 and rl19 in speed. about like 4350.

I am thinking of trying it. I e-mailed them Sunday and have not gotten a answer yet.

I want to work up some H4895 loads in my 470.
That is the powder that hodgen recommend for reduced load of 70% of max. That should suggest that it should work well in a large case,but I would still use a filler.
JD

Rusty:

I sort of "discovered" Ramshot powder during the recent powder crunch. I found that with Big Game and Hunter, I could load a broad spectrum of cartridges and Big Game is the powder of choice in my 9.3X62. My experience with spherical powders is that there are perhaps not as consistent as stick powders. Sometimes they work really well. For example, with some long Barnes bullets a spherical powder is better if case capacity is a concern because you can get better load density. It may work just the other way if you are loading one of the Nitro Express cartridges. On nice thing about Ramshot is that if you e-mail Johan Loubser at Western powder, he will usually get back to you at the end of that day with an answer to your loading question. I am looking at a .470 and I was wondering if I could use Ramshot Hunter to load it. This is what he sent me:

Dave,
Yes HUNTER® will be the better option.
We suggest the following
Caliber:      .470 NE – Nitro Express.
Barrel length:      24”
Note:                      Use WLRM or FED 210 primers
Powder:           Ramshot - HUNTER.
Bullet weight: 480 grains.
Start load: 99.5 grains (1975 – 2075 ft/p/sec)
Maximum load: 107.0 grains (2100 – 2200 Ft/p/sec).

Bullet weight:  500 grains. Barnes - TSX
Start load: 88.0 grains (1875 – 1975 ft/p/sec)
Maximum load: 95.0 grains (2050 – 2150 Ft/p/sec). LD = ca 91%
NOTES:

Hunter has worked in my .450 Dakota. The only problem is that it seems to get more consistent as I increase the charge and I don't want to increase the charge because of the recoil so I may try something else.

I am not sure I understand JDs post above. In my big bores, I weigh every charge so there is no danger of inconsistent charges and so far, both Big Game and Hunter has metered very consistently.

Rusty, I guess I feel if Reloder 15 is working for you, I would stick with it rather than switch to a spherical powder. I use Hunter and Big Game cause it was available and convenient for shooting at the range. However, in most cases, I have gotten more consistent velocities with stick powder and have had great luck with the powder from Alliant.

I called Western on using Ramshot powder in my 470 NE and was told ball powder isn't good in a large capacity case. Gave me an Accurate powder load instead - which I didn't try. Be interested in hearing what your are told.

I've had good luck with all the Ramshot powders on other calibers though. I weigh the powder for each round. Have gotten very consistent velocities and good accuracy (those two things related??? )

Dave the problem is I don't understand either. I don't know how I gained 10 + extra grs of powder in 10 throws. The # on the dial were right.

On a previous range session I had settled on a
load. I recorded the # in my log. I dumped power ran five loads through, I weighed 2,they were right on. I often load several hundred rounds at a time for competition, I load for accuracy and not top fps or max loads. I don't weigh each load.

My gunsmith told me he has seen such problems with ball powders before and have seen many guns damaged by ball powders.
The bench rest crowd tends to load hot and like ball powders because they meter well.

JD

With any powder measure, I keep throwing charges (at least 10 but sometimes as many as 30) until I get 10 in a row that are consistent. I have found that it takes a few cycles for the powder to settle around the baffle and to fully fill the charge hole in the measure. Ball powder is very sensitive to minute changes in charge weight, but I have used win 748 exclusively in 223 and never had any problems, but I check every tenth round for powder drop accuracy.

My reloading has changed with the electronic powder dispenser and scale combo, on all my light reloading chores I can weigh every charge and do so as quickly as using a powder drop.

John

Thanks for your input guys!

Here is the response I got from Western Powders.

quote:

Rusty,

Thank you for your interest in Western Powders, Inc., "Ramshot" line of smokeless powders.

Unfortunately position sensitivity is a fact of life for almost all powders with a few exceptions and spherical powders are even more prone to that fact. Using a Dacron or Puff-Lon filler is a must. All that being said, Ramshot powders would work very well in you 450/400 3" firearm. As you have already determined, Ramshot "Big Game" would be in the same range as Reloader 15. Case fill would be approximately the same. I also see in another e-mail that you were looking at Ramshot "Magnum". Ramshot magnum would give you the same velocities with about a 90% case fill although perceived recoil and muzzle blast would be totally different. With Ramshot "Magnum" no filler would be necessary.

As a general rule, with spherical powders we like to see a minimum of an 85% case fill in order to reduce position sensitivity. The closer to a 100% case fill you get the less the effect.

I hope this answers your questions.

Best regards,
Keith Anderson
Western Powders Ballistic Lab

I dispense all my load via electronic Lymand 1200 DPS. I check every load on a balance beam scale. I'm not about to send one of my barrels to heaven with a heavy charge!

Looking at the "Magnum" I am concerned with the about of "unburned" powder according to QuickLOAD. To tell ya the truth, I' not real excited yet!

Thanks again for your inputs!

Rusty:

Have you given any thought to using a slower stick powder like IMR4831 instead of Reloder 15 so you didn't have to fool with the filler? My .500/.416 "regulation" load uses H1000 and it seems to work really well. I am sure you get a bit more recoil but I think that is a small price to pay to not have to use a filler. I wouldn't think there would be that much difference in recoil using IMR 4831 instead or Reloder 15 in your 450/400. I used to have a .404 Jeffery that shot very well with 83 grains of IMR 4831. That load was running about 2150 fps and was very consistent. I started at 79 grains and worked my way up. Just a thought.

Dave, I have thought about IMR4831. My problem with my old vintage double is pressure curves. RL-15, according to Ross Seyfried (Handloader Magazine Dec. 1999/Jan. 2000), is close to Cordite's pressure curve. Usually, older double barrels will go to heaven just past or at the end of the forearm. I personally think this is due to using a slower burning powder with a higher pressure curve. Just my opine.

I've used H4831 SC and IMR 4831 in my 404 Jeffery. Those work great. I still load RL-15 with filler in the 404 because I think the felt recoil is less with RL-15. Once again, just me.

Rusty:

PM sent.

Dave