OK...took the new Searcy to the range today along with one of the boxes of new Hornady ammo that came with it....and no, the ammo or gun didn't come straight from Butch...but are NEW.
I have owned, or currently own a Demas, K-gun, Heym and Merkel and my question is this: It seems that the Searcy triggers have quite a bit of creep and aren't as "crisp" as the other doubles mentioned. The rear (left barrel) trigger, in particular, has A LOT of creep.
Any one else notice or have this experience? Now I'm not expecting triggers like my big bore bolt guns, but I'm just curious as to others' experiences with their Searcys or Searcys they have shot.
I love the double (a new Classic) but would like to have the triggers "crisper"...doable?

Thanks, gents.

By the way....I know Butch regulates his guns a bit hotter...and the Hornady's chrono'd right at 2100 (low-2078; high-2112) fps...these shot LOW to poa at 55 yards by about 2-3". I'm hoping the regulation load will bring the poi up...but this does seem contradictory to normal double theory...faster prints lower....or am I thinking back-asswards again?

Gary
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quote:

Originally posted by GarBy:
I'm hoping the regulation load will bring the poi up...but this does seem contradictory to normal double theory...faster prints lower....or am I thinking back-asswards again?

That's what I have been told is what "normally" happens with a double, but it's not so with my Krieghoff. Slower loads are lower and POI rises as the velocity rises.

Only one way to find out.

Garby,

When I bought my first double rifle, the triggers were heavy and had some gritty creap, the rear in particular.

I sent the rifle to JJ Peroduea and specified clean crisp triggers and gave him the weights I wanted each to be. The rifle came back with clean crisp triggers at the weights I specified. The front rivals any trigger pull at the same weight and the rear is very good but with the tiniest bit of creep.

So improvements can be made!

JPK

Ted....exactly....but I bought the rifle and 200 rounds of Hornady ammo togehter, so I had to shoot some to get the brass...no need to buy any! Butch told me the regulation load is 106.5 gr of IMR 4831...good for about 2225 or so from its 26" barrels. I experienced the EXACT same thing from a K-gun in 500/416. We'll see what happens with this one.

JPK....yes, JJ is THE man and has worked on virtually every double I've owned in some form or another. I've been able to live with the other triggers on the doubles I've owned, but these aren't quite there. I think I'm going to get the regulation load set up and then send it off. Might also call Butch and chat with him....he told me he'd stand behind the gun 100% for me....and you can't possibly ask for more than that!

Thanks.

Gary
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Gary, the one Searcy double I owned had the same trigger issues (creepy triggers) and had to have them worked on. I've owned Heyms, Merkels, Chapuis, and Searcy doubles the Searcy double was the only one that I needed trigger work on, they are fixable.

Dirk

The triggers on my PH are crisp - no creep. I suggest you contact Butch and have him fix the problem.
MJC

Hmmmmm, I have to disagree. If you increase the velocity/powder charge the POI will come "up" not down in most rifles. Unless told, Butch will normally reg his rifles hotter than most English rifles as his rifles are much stronger.

I believe all his rifles are absolute tack drivers, at least every one I ever shot was super accurate in the 1.5" range or less. My 450-400-3" will shot 4 into and inch cluster and my 470 would shoot 1/2 inch almost every time at 50 and 75 yards.

If you use the regulation load that Butch uses then it will almost certainly come to zero. You can also shoot the rear trigger first if you like and POI will not change.

I am glad Butch is now making more 450-3.25s as that is the ultimate double rifle caliber IMO...

Ray....in the book "Shooting the British Double", Wright quite clearly states and shows how increasing the velocity brings the poi down....BUT...I agree with you that I have experienced just the opposite. Butch indeed does load his rifles hotter and told me so. This particular rifle was regulated with a 480 gr bullet and 96.5 (not 106.5 as I previously posted...SORRY) gr of IMR4831 for a velocity in these 26" barrels of about 2225-2250 fps. The Hornady rounds were right at 2100 fps....so...yes, 125-150 fps will make a diff....also the left and right were printing about 4-5" apart....this, too will clean up at a higher velocity.

Dirk...thanks...your experience is exactly as mine. I love the rifle, but the triggers do need some work....I'm going to call Butch.

Thanks to all.

Gary
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The school of thought on POI vs Velocity, faster bullets leave the barrel earlier in the primary recoil effect than slower bullets, the secondary recoil does not play on POI since the bullet has exited the barrel. weight of bullet plays a part since primary recoil will be less for what it is worth
differnt guns may have a different poi with the same load since many varialbles come into play, weight stock design and so on.

Also the way a person handle the gun plus the shooters weight has an effect on POI
Due to stock designs and or weight of the gun the barrel raise less or more so it is a tuning process

Primary recoil is felt during acceleration of the bullet (mass) inside the barrel, secondary is the blast effect which occurs when the bullet exits the barrel

Both are correct statements, the confusion comes from the regulation standpoint..If you increase the powder charge the bullet normally stikes high and it will also close the group if the group is too wide..but you can't put that in stone, but it usually works that way..What happens in these conversations we get sighting in to POI mixed up with getting a regulating load that shoot together...Never compare facts of what happens with a double rifle to what happens with a bolt rifle, its two different worlds...

But one thing is for sure..First you get both barrels shooting together. you do this by shooting groups with both barrels and then the barrel that shoots the worst is your goal for a group size...

When you get them shooting together in that goal size, then all you have to do is raise the sight or lower the sights and knock them one way or the other with a large sledge hammer!

Just to throw my $.02 in. If you have an issue with a Searcy rifle call Butch. Searcy has really good service on his rifles. If it's broke he'll fix it.

Unless of course it is in a foreign country and you are unwilling to get the rifle to him. But that is another story.

Surestrike...please don't take my comments as a criticism of the rifle...it's beautiful, handles great and comes to the shoulder fantastic even though it wasn't made to me. I just feel the triggers could use some tweaking and indeed, will be getting with Butch to have him take a look at it. I'm positive he'll take care of any issues I may have as he stated so to me....I just hate to part with it until I throw some more lead downrange. Once the triggers are tweaked, I'm sure it will become a go-to double that I'll have for some time....especially since I love those 26" barrels (BALANCE!!) and the 450 NE round.

Thanks...I'll pass on the info once I send it off and get it back.

Gary
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Gary,
Great you like your new double but what in the world are you doing at the range after spending, what 40-45 days in Zambia?
Steve

Shhhhhhhhh.....Steve, don't give away all my secrets. We have a very large project that is under construction that is only 20 minutes or so away from my range....and Tuesdays are site meeting days...what a coincidence.
Works real well.

Gary
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Shhhhhhhh, me too, Right now I'm off to go shoot that buffalo with my .50BMG. Will send some pics. My office is nowhere close to the buff, told the wife sales meeting with a BIG briefcase.

Send me a back-strap!!! Good luck buddy.

Let me know how it goes.

Gary
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the regulation load in a Searcy 450 NE is 96.5 grains IMR 4831. The 106 is for a 470 I assume. My Searcy 450 has no creep in either trigger and is great to shoot. Only shoot it off hand and it shoots accurately. I leave for Namibia for elephant next summer and will send the gun to Butch prior to the hunt for him to go over it completely. He's great on service.

Drift...you are correct on the 96 gr of 4831...notice I corrected my mistake in my other post. I am going to load up some regulation loads and fire it a bit...not ready to part with it back to Butch yet.

Gary
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