The bottom line is YOU should use the rifle you have the most confidence in.

When I go into a Dope house I want a FULL AUTO.

When I hunt DG I want a Double Rifle.

quote:

With all due respect, this is a load of crap.

Uh, Will, what part is the load of crap?

JW

Here I try to start an argument with an inflammatory comment, and you go diplomatic on me. Yeesh!!

One could write a whole book on the double versus the bolt-action. Oh wait, I am, but anyway ....

My hero, John Taylor, complained about magazine rifles and the ruination of hunting because of their destructive effect on game, because of their fire power.

Then John Boy turns around and uses two double rifles, firing one, while one of his boys is reloading the other.

Except for a few slight oversights of Puerto Rican style reasoning, John Boy is still my hero.

I think that pretty much sums it up. But for those still doubtful, there is an endless list of scenarios when a bolt-action or double would be better. But there is no way a double is the best for all situations.

Just as in the example above of three elephants charging together, there is not a soul in the world that could handle that with a double. There are a lot of unmarked graves in the Africa of old I'm sure to attest to that.

Okay, here we go in the present day:

The hunter has to wait for the three charging elephants to get within about ten yards to justify shooting a non-licensed animal. Then ....

Oh forget it. Any justification of a double rifle in this case is just too absurd to waste ethernet on.

Then there are often comments made about not needing more than two or three rounds in a magazine too. But we'll save that for another day.

Ditto Will again.

I own and shoot double rifles, but I am faster with a bolt action. I intend to hunt elephant with my double (already have with a BA), but the fact that my example is very rare doesn't change the fact that it happened. Rareness is not a very persuasive argument when your life is on the line.

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
Ditto Will again.

I own and shoot double rifles, but I am faster with a bolt action. I intend to hunt elephant with my double (already have with a BA), but the fact that my example is very rare doesn't change the fact that it happened. Rareness is not a very persuasive argument when your life is on the line.

Rareness of an action when your life is on the line is exactly the persuasive argument for a double. You should be prepared to handle the most likely situation. My point was that the occasions that a fast second shot is called for is more common than one in which you have multiple elephants charging. I assume you meant that your faster with a bolt rifle after the second shot. You can't beat the double rifles speed of the second shot with a bolt. If you can't, you need to get more practice in with a double.

465H&H

465 H&H,

We basically agree (on the first two shots), nothing faster than a DR for the first two shots, but personally I know I will never be as fast on the 3rd and 4th shots with my DR(no matter how much I practice) as with my bolt rifle. That is reality. However, I will hunt Elephant with my double, but I have the confidence of knowing that a 3 ele charge is rare, plus I will be standing next to a competent PH. In my example, my PH did not have the benefit of a backup (I don't know why).

Sounds like to me that we need to have a little competition at the next DRSS shoot....I'll put up the prize money to the winner...

....

Need suggestions for the format "Bolt gun vs. DR"....We'll title it "The need for speed" event!!

Anybody game?!

JW

You gonna supply the elephants too?

Now that is gonna be an expensive experiment.

Can I watch?

quote:

Originally posted by Jeff Wemmer:
Sounds like to me that we need to have a little competition at the next DRSS shoot....I'll put up the prize money to the winner...

....

Need suggestions for the format "Bolt gun vs. DR"....We'll title it "The need for speed" event!!

Anybody game?!

JW

Can I shoot my No. 1?

I have a two day Highpower match that weekend I may have to skip.

quote:

You gonna supply the elephants too?

Now that is gonna be an expensive experiment.

Can I watch?

Fresh out of Eles to shoot at...But, I'll bet Monte can come-up with an excellent challenge venue that less any REAL Eles will give us an idea as to which is faster on 4 consecutive shots...

....Bring the #1....What the heck, we can include single shots in the event.

Will; oh-no old boy, you're gonna shoot as well under the moniker "Pondoro"!!!


JW

quote:

Originally posted by Will:
But for those still doubtful, there is an endless list of scenarios when a bolt-action or double would be better. But there is no way a double is the best for all situations.

Or vice versa!

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
465 H&H,

We basically agree (on the first two shots), nothing faster than a DR for the first two shots, but personally I know I will never be as fast on the 3rd and 4th shots with my DR(no matter how much I practice) as with my bolt rifle. That is reality. However, I will hunt Elephant with my double, but I have the confidence of knowing that a 3 ele charge is rare, plus I will be standing next to a competent PH. In my example, my PH did not have the benefit of a backup (I don't know why).

Begno's post above is a sign of clear thinking,IMO! The passage in bold above is very good thinking, and RARE is an understatement. I have never heard of a real charge by three elephant similtainiously. There are many instances of three ele charging,but not at the same time. That is usually a pair of young Askris charging you after you have put the herd bull down! Not quite the same thing! I'm not saying this didn't happen to the PH, but I will predict he will hunt the rest of his life without it happening again.

Of course you have to understand I'm not an elephant hunter. So make of that fact what you will. Still I know quite a lot about elephant behavier, but haven't personally hunted them!

However, I am a double rifle hunter, and most of the down grading of the use of doubles in relation to Bolt rifles is from people who have never even fired a double rifle, much less shot one enough to become proficient with one. I assure you a guy that knows how to use a double rifle will amaze you at his speed of getting off four shots, that hit the kill zone on target. Any contest between a bolt, and a double, of equally profecient shooters of each type, do not count unless all shots hit the kill zone on the target, no matter how fast they come from either, they do little if they miss the mark!
.............................................................

quote:

....Bring the #1....What the heck, we can include single shots in the event.

Will; oh-no old boy, you're gonna shoot as well under the moniker "Pondoro"!!!


JW

If anybody shoots under the moniker Pondoro, the rules should require they wear a loin cloth.

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
465 H&H,

We basically agree (on the first two shots), nothing faster than a DR for the first two shots, but personally I know I will never be as fast on the 3rd and 4th shots with my DR(no matter how much I practice) as with my bolt rifle. That is reality. However, I will hunt Elephant with my double, but I have the confidence of knowing that a 3 ele charge is rare, plus I will be standing next to a competent PH. In my example, my PH did not have the benefit of a backup (I don't know why).

Begno's post above is a sign of clear thinking,IMO! The passage in bold above is very good thinking, and RARE is an understatement. I have never heard of a real charge by three elephant similtainiously. There are many instances of three ele charging,but not at the same time. That is usually a pair of young Askris charging you after you have put the herd bull down! Not quite the same thing! I'm not saying this didn't happen to the PH, but I will predict he will hunt the rest of his life without it happening again.

Of course you have to understand I'm not an elephant hunter. So make of that fact what you will. Still I know quite a lot about elephant behavier, but haven't personally hunted them!

However, I am a double rifle hunter, and most of the down grading of the use of doubles in relation to Bolt rifles is from people who have never even fired a double rifle, much less shot one enough to become proficient with one. I assure you a guy that knows how to use a double rifle will amaze you at his speed of getting off four shots, that hit the kill zone on target. Any contest between a bolt, and a double, of equally profecient shooters of each type, do not count unless all shots hit the kill zone on the target, no matter how fast they come from either, they do little if they miss the mark!
.............................................................

Mac,

All one has to do is look at the videos from the Heym USA web site. Bolt trash wins again!

Oh yeah, make sure that shooting contest has guys running backwards, and falling down on their faces, etc. Might as well have some realism to it!

Will...That's it! I'm having a 4-barrel, 4 trigger .600 made up!

Now, top that!

I'll report test-firing results once my nose stops bleeding and I can untie my fingers!!!