On another thread Ken Buch expressed an interest in a possible group buy. The key to a group buy is to have enough "standardization" to allow the manufacturer to actually be able to offer attractive pricing over a fully bespoke rifle. Of course, the number of rifles committed makes a difference in the pricing too. It is a long putt to pull off, but hell might as well try.

With that in mind, I thought we might test the waters to see who might be interested in a group buy structured around a .375 Flanged. Why the .375 Flanged? Well, it is a great all round caliber that could be used on virtually anything, including North American game. Components are available. It is a caliber that is not the typical double caliber, by that I mean that a lot of double owners do not already own one so a group buy in the caliber might appeal to them. I think when you get up to the bigger calibers, you are into the world of individual preferences, recoil tolerances, etc. that make a group buy tough(er).

So in terms of specifics to start a conversation how about a rifle along the lines of:

- Neutral cast
- Individual LOP and drop
- 1" red Silver's type pad
- Steel grip cap
- Swivel Studs
- Ejectors
- No cheek piece
- 26" barrels
- One standing and two folding rear sights set up 50, 100, 200 yards
- Splinter forearm
- No palm swell
- Color case hardened or French whatever is cheaper
- Round body would be sweet if no extra charge otherwise the regular frame
- Barrels set up for detachable scope mounts (which can be taken off as an option)

So the only "individualized" features would be LOP, drop and w/ or w/o scope set up. Everything else would be "standard" to keep the price down.

I am sure the number of people interested would be a function of the price point, and the price point would be a function of the number of people interested. Sort of circular but I think that is just the way it is. I have asked Ken to consider whether he could quote pricing based on a number of orders, $XXXX for three to five, $YYYY for more than five but less than ten, $ZZZZ for more than ten, something like that.

Any interest (depending on the price of course)? Specification thoughts?

I like the idea and would be interested to hear more as details emerge.

Sounds interesting, and I like the idea of the 375 since I already have a heavy rifle.

I'd go from my Chapuis 9.3x74 to a 375.... especially if the price is just too much to to resist !!!

Sounds interesting. I've been thinking of a V-C double for a while... is this going to be for the US market only?

What about bullet used for regulation? Do you foresee any standardisation on bullet choice as well? I guess a "classic" 375 bullet, 300 grain, should be used, e.g. Woodleigh RN SN or Swift A-frame.

quote:

Originally posted by BrownMax:
SI guess a "classic" 375 bullet, 300 grain, should be used, e.g. Woodleigh RN SN or Swift A-frame.

The new Woodleigh 375 extra strong round nose.

I may be interested in a 450 on a 450/400 frame configured like the 500 with arcaded fences if the "group price" is attractive.

I need to talk to the factory & see what they are willing to do (if anything) on a group buy with some special pricing. The person I need to speak with is off hunting roe deer in Siberia & will not be back until Sept 15.
I am going to suspect this will only work if all the guns are identical with the exception of stock dimensions. All the V-C guns are made to order & I am not sure if there is a cost savings to the factory that can passed along by making a number of them the same.
I will explore the possibilities & be back with some info after 9/15.

Thanks Ken. I agree, I think the only way to make a group buy work and potentially save the buyers some hopefully meaningful money is for the manufacturer to be able to keep things relatively standard across each rifle. Otherwise all you are really doing is ordering multiple bespoke rifles at the same time. That said, if a group buy can be done at a decent savings and the stocks are made to the individual customer's dimensions, that would be a heck of a way to end up with a quasi-bespoke piece hopefully at a favorable price. Similarly if we can be a little flexible on delivery dates, that might let us save a bit too. Let us know what you learn from Jerome. In the mean time, anyone that might be interested just so indicate on this thread. Thanks again Ken.

I recommend NO long tang coming back over the
comb. Fellows may want to have these stocks
bent. With those LONG tangs the stock bending idea
is OUT before it can be thought of!

I agree. Plus that will add considerably to the cost of a possible group buy rifle.

Unfortunately, and I hate to rain on the parade, articles that tend to be built more on a hand made basis rather than a machine/assembly line scheme do not lend themselves to economies of scale. Ten of them cost ten times what one of them costs. VC double rifles fall into this category. I think any price break for quantity will be minimal.
Just my opinion here.

DPCD had it right. I spoke to the factory this morning and because of how the guns are made there is no savings in doing a group of guns the same.

Nothing ventured, nothing gained. It was at least worth a try.

You had me scared that I would have to jump in on a group buy with the talk of neutral cast and no cheekpiece. They would almost be comfortable for a lefty.

The rifle described in the original post sounded perfect, especially if with the case colored round body.

I was ready to jump in!!

I was too 470EDDY . . . maybe Ken can continue to gently work Jerome over on the issue. Sounds like a nice chance to sell a few rifles to me.

If it gives you any indication of my willing/ready status, the VC gunmaker did my measurements at Dallas!!

I am pretty flexible too. I do like the extended tang and a cheek piece, but at the right price I would take it like buying an "experienced double"....you take it as it is offered!!

Cheers,

A 450 or 500 would be interesting. Colour case only, however.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Nothing ventured, nothing gained. It was at least worth a try.

Hi Mike,
Perhaps you should look into lower priced rifles. Maybe a group buy on Sabattis? Look at it this way, they would either be all right, or all wrong.

That like a good ideal that the Sabattis group
buy.Maybe someone can post and get the ball rolling.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:
Maybe a group buy on Sabattis?

I have rolled the dice and won with my Sabatti. It shoots well and the muzzles are not ground. Having gambled and won, I am not prepared to double down.

Well we have been turned down by VC, earlier by Chapuis.....maybe a Heym group order?!!

MERKEL??

I saw a nice Heym in 375 Flanged with an Arizona dealer at the Denver show....I liked it...I should have bought it!!

I'll bet Cabela's would jump over themselves to support a Sabatti group purchase!!

I AM NOT A PLAYER FOR THE LATTER!!

CHEERS