Ok guys, It's back to the problem 9.3x74 Beretta. This is what I have done so far and I am open for suggestions again.
I lowered the comb of my stock enough to be able to see the iron sights, and it looks pretty good. It's nice to be able to see the sights anyway. The rifle shoots to about the same points of aim without the scope as it does with the scope. Upper barrel shoots about 4" low and to the right, at about the four o'clock position at 50 yards.
I made Midway's first quarter by ordering the reloading dies and components for the 9.3x74. I loaded up five different loads with two different bullet weights. 250 gr and 286gr They all shot to the same points of aim. The group shot with all the different loads from the lower barrel could be covered with a 50 cent piece. Same with the upper barrel. The two groups are still about 4" appart at 50yds. With the lower barrel shooting the high group and the upper barrel shooting the low group.
As the velocity increased I did not notice any change in the separation of the two groups. I am pushing the max on the loads now and will try some different bullets.
It still seems odd to me that the barrels cross by 3" to 4" at only 50 yards. That seems to me to be a big error to try to correct by using a different load.
I have been looking for a good reason to build a 9.3x62 out of a 98 Mauser in 30/06 I have. All these bullets I am going to end up with will have to be shot in something.

Harry
Since the individual barrell groups are so good I would contact JJ Perodeau at www.champlinarms.com and have the rifle re-regulated.
I use a Chapuis double in 9,3x74R. I have killed quite a bit of game with it.
I would have it re-regulated with a 286 grain bullet, either the 286 gr Woodleigh or the 286 gr Nosler Partition.
I would have it re-regulated with the scope at 100 yards.

Harry,
Taking a shot at this though I'm out of my area of expertise. The talk as I recall was faster bullets will cross more not less. You need to slow them down not speed them up. Try heavier bullets at slower speed not lighter and faster.
A cheaper alternative to reregulating would be to call Superior Ammo. Tell them what the rifle does. Buy a box of mixed ammo 3 rounds of 6 shots different bullets and charges and see what happens. It's a cheaper faster alternative.

Cross-firing is usually the result of too much velocity (not enough barrel time) and/or too light a bullet (not enough movement through the recoil arc during barrel time). Which 286 grain bullet did you use? What powders did you use. As you worked up with the 286, what was the velocity spectrum? If you didn't use a chronograph, get one, and do it over. What you're trying to do is very difficult without velocity data.

Yes, 3 to 4 inches at 50 yards can be corrected with load adjustment. However, sometimes regulation doesn't occur at the appropriate velocity, in which case you're stuck with re-regulation. Without knowing what velocity you got with your 286 grain loads, jumping to re-regulation may be premature. If 286 Woodleighs cross at, say, 2250 fps, then 300 and 320 grain bullets are worth a try.
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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

You guys are fast!
I have shot factory loads with a 285 grain Mantel, a 293 grain Brenneke, and handloads using a 250 grain Barnes and a 286 grain Barnes, both Tripple-Shock X bullets. I was using IMR 4064 powder.
I used a chronograph and recorded the velocity of each shot as well as the location of each shot on the target. I left the data at my shop, so I can't quote the actual numbers, but the velocity increased about a 100 fps from the lighter load to the heaviest with both the 250 and 286 gr bullets. I started out at about 2150fps with the 286gr Barnes. Much more barrel time and I'll just shoot my 35 Remington. I went up to about 2280fps and I could detect no change in the spread between the groups.
I will get some heavier bullets and try them. But if this thing has to be shot much slower than the velocities I was getting today, to regulate the barrels, I would rather work up a good load, with a bullet I like and then have the the thing regulated to shoot that load.
Thanks for all the help. I'm going to load some varmint loads with those 250gr Barnes bullets. Should be just the thing for some beavers that are flooding my food plots.

quote:

Originally posted by Mathsr:
You guys are fast!
I would rather work up a good load, with a bullet I like and then have the the thing regulated to shoot that load.
.

I'd try the heavier bullets first, but I think you are on the right track, with re-regulating the rifle for your load. I have an O/U double rifle chambered for 9.3X74R the shoots tight groups at 50 yds of less that one inch for two shots from either barrel. The problem is, the bottom barrel group is 5" right of POA, and the top barrel is 5" left of POA, both groups are exactly the same elevation.
When you look at the muzzle end of the rifle you can see, with the naked eye, the bottom barrel pointing to the right, and the top barrel pointing to the left. I've already talked to JJ about this rifle and he says it needs tweeking. The rifle shoots well enough with iron sights, or with the scope that it is well worth sending to JJ, to do his magic!

Good luck, with you rifle!

I strongly suggest that you reconsider the use of the TSX. Mono-metal bullets, like the TSX, are not a good idea in a double. My experience with them in a 9.3 double was with the 286 grain X. That rifle shot well with 286 grain RWS and 300 grain Barnes Originals (the lead core bullet) at standard velocity. The X bullets cross-fired above 2150 fps and worse, they ruined the barrels. You might want to ask J. J. what he thinks about it. He'll be diplomatic about it, but I know the gist of what he'll say.
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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

400 Nitro Express, thanks for the heads up on the Barnes bullets. I have used them in other rifles with no problems. I guess I will save them for a bolt action. The things shot good too, what a shame. Back to Midway for some bullets better suited for a double. Maybe with a little luck I will get the groups together or at least get a good load out of it.
MacD37, it sounds like you don't have a choice with your 9.3X74. Mine isn't quite that obvious, but the results might be the same. I think I'll contact J.J. and see what he thinks about this double rifle and then take his advice.
I really appreciate all the helpful comments I have received about this problem. I have watched this forum for about a year with great interest. The people on this site made me want to get this Beretta shooting, when I had decided that it was a "gun cabnet queen" and was keeping my eyes open for the next double rifle.
Thanks again.

mine likes 300 gr bullets w/65 gr of H4831. Its a bit slower velocity that you're getting with a heavier bullet.

Butchloc, what kind of velocity are you getting with the 300 gr bullets and that load? I am going to order some of the 300 gr Swift A-frames next week and give them a try. I will probably only use the rifle on deer and hogs, so I am not that worried about the energy. I just don't want to end up with more of a rainbow trajectory than I have to. To be able to use this rifle like I want to, I might still end up developing a load and then getting the rifle regulated for it.

Has anyone tried the PRVI 285 gr bullet from Graf and Son? They have two cannelure grooves and were quite economical. I have yet to try them but they are calling my name from the loading room. Packy