After buying my first double...a Merkel 140-2 .500 NE...I can't see what there is not to like about the Merkel for a good "using" rifle.

Please comment on the below statements:

1) I have been told that this is one of the strongest actions built. T or F

2) I have been told that they are usually fairly accurate rifles. T or F

3) Been told that they are too light for the .500 NE round (although mine does not seem too bad to shoot). T or F

4) Now...Merkel haters...tell me what is to hate. I would like an honest assesment of this rifle which seems to me to be a "good piece of equipment."

But what the heck do I know!

What I hate about Merkels is, I don't have one.

Maybe the most accurate double I've owned was a Merkel 470. I had the sights changed and that's it. Miss that rifle sometimes. Nothing wrong with a Merkel at all.

Gary
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NRA Lifer
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quote:

Originally posted by GarBy:
Maybe the most accurate double I've owned was a Merkel 470. I had the sights changed and that's it. Miss that rifle sometimes. Nothing wrong with a Merkel at all.

Gary
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NRA Lifer
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Which sight did you change too? Why? and Who did it? I will have to say...that is the one thing that does not blow my dress up with my Merkel either. The front brass blade just does not have enough contrast to stand out rapidly.

I have three Merkels and had a fourth that I sold. All shoot very well. The one I sold was a newer 140 2.1 in 470NE and the reason I sold it was the sights. The front bead sight was just not bright enough for me to see. The older Model 140 2.1's that I have in 470NE and 500NE have the square notch and post that I can see very well. The other Merkel I own is a 141E in 9.3X74R and the front post is red and visible. It is currently scoped with a swing mount by Recnagel.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
After buying my first double...a Merkel 140-2 .500 NE...I can't see what there is not to like about the Merkel for a good "using" rifle.

Please comment on the below statements:

1) I have been told that this is one of the strongest actions built. T or F

False, they are no stronger or weaker than other actions made today, i think that urban myth comes from a well known american maker, who got caught monoblocking sawed off merkel shotguns which is made on the same action and came up with a lame bunch of BS, about having made a chrash test on 10 or 20 different actions IIRC and in the termoil he thought that people forgot that he pretty much is flogging 30-50K$ rifles where the only good thing is the action from merkel

quote:

2) I have been told that they are usually fairly accurate rifles. T or F

true, the guy's at merkel have been doing this for a long time and knows their stuff.

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3) Been told that they are too light for the .500 NE round (although mine does not seem too bad to shoot). T or F

shooting expirences differ, some like the mother some like the daughter, i think you guy's over there got a few hogback stocks and they can be a handfull if you are not used to them, i dont mind them, but prefere a different stock style.

quote:

4) Now...Merkel haters...tell me what is to hate. I would like an honest assesment of this rifle which seems to me to be a "good piece of equipment."

But what the heck do I know!

I think you just made the best honest assesment of your rifle and merkels in general, which is a good piece of kit and good value for the money.

i like working rifles

cheers

peter

I've had several Merkels...great, purpose-built rifles. The weight "issues" can be rectified with the addition of weights in the right places to suit the owner. I happen to like the "square notch-square post" sights....reminds me of my 1st 22, and just about every handgun I've owned. With the market the way it is now, some great buys can be found of new and lightly-used Merkels in the $7,500-$8,500 range. If I needed a working DR, that's where I'd put my money.

They seem very well made including fit and finish. I think they are little piggies and the 470's I've handled were very muzzle heavy. The butt stock drop is too much and though I have never shot one the recoil, for me, would be abusive, as all large butt drop stocked rifles are.

Just my opinion.

I DO miss mine.

Mine had a square partridge type front sight which I had changed to a bead that is more suitable for the v type rear sight.
Ideally I would have a small bead with a pop up night sight by Recknagel.

On a recent multiple Elephant hunt, I had eye on a mates Merkel 470 and again was impressed with its sound work on Ele in the thick stuff.

They are muzzle heavy but as biebs said, weights can be added to rectify this.

quote:

Originally posted by 500N:
They are muzzle heavy but as biebs said, weights can be added to rectify this.

As for the Muzzle heavy bit...they may be...so are most muzzleloaders...most 1885's...most Sharps...and 1873's. I have shot these all my life and kind of enjoy that "feel" to a rifle.

I tried on lots of doubles for fit...(Heyms, Krieghofs, Searcys, and several old Brits...even though I can't afford) and for me...the "particular Merkel" I bought...feels RIGHT in my hands.

quote:

The butt stock drop is too much and though I have never shot one the recoil, for me, would be abusive, as all large butt drop stocked rifles are.

quote:

shooting expirences differ, some like the mother some like the daughter, i think you guy's over there got a few hogback stocks and they can be a handfull if you are not used to them, i dont mind them, but prefere a different stock style.

I believe that Merkel must make some with straighter stocks. I don't belive mine drops much.

They do make them with straighter stocks.

Both of mine are very English style.

.

Sorry....just back to the thread. I put a shallow V for the rear and a warthog ivory bead for the front sight. They were awesome and I could pick them up in lower light quite well.

Gary
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NRA Lifer
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quote:

Originally posted by GarBy:
Sorry....just back to the thread. I put a shallow V for the rear and a warthog ivory bead for the front sight. They were awesome and I could pick them up in lower light quite well.

Gary
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Who installed them or where did you buy them???

Over the years I've owned several Merkel firearms mostly shotguns But some double rifles, and own two Merkel double rifles now, and 9.3X74R, and a 470NE and I've never been disapointed whith any of them. IMO, they are value for dollars spent!

Never owned one but have handled a few. Nice rifles in my opinion and I wouldn't hesitate to buy one if I were in the market for another double.

ledvm....JJ at Champlins. Don't remember the cost but it wasn't bad. He formed the existing rear dight into a V and then changed out the front sight. He did a great job.

Gary
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NRA Lifer
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quote:

Originally posted by GarBy:
ledvm....JJ at Champlins. Don't remember the cost but it wasn't bad. He formed the existing rear dight into a V and then changed out the front sight. He did a great job.

Gary
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NRA Lifer
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Thank you sir. Going to shoot mine a little longer with square notch rear and front brass blade...but...leaning towards a shallow V with front ivory bead as well.

I have 2, a 500NE and a 9.3x74R. Both are more accurate than me when I shoot them without a rest. Both have performed well for me on animals ranging from wild Texas hogs to Cape Buffalo and leopard. My 9.3 is scoped from factory and obviously more accurate. The 500 has a wide blade front sight but as I age I am getting to appreciate it more and more. I seem to shoot the 500 better than the 9.3 but fit may have something to do with. I have shot the 9.3 many more times than the 500.

Interesting!

When I was getting ready to buy...the Merkel negativity came out of the woodwork.

What is the proper name for that style (Merkel 140) of action??? Is it a Greener action?

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Interesting!

When I was getting ready to buy...the Merkel negativity came out of the woodwork.

What is the proper name for that style (Merkel 140) of action??? Is it a Greener action?

When the Merkels first were offered in the USA, there was a lot of negative comments made on the internet, about the quality, and all kinds of the sky is falling crap about they would shoot off face in less than 100 shots. If you do a search of those merkel comments and look at where the info ( read False info) was coming from it was repeated comments made by competors who simply could not meat Merkels price point, and tried very hard to defame the bramd. It didn't work, however, and once a few were in the field, and knoledgable folks used them some, all the hooey went out the window. There is absolutely nothing wrong with Merkel double rifles. They are well made, and good working rifles on the bottom end, and pure class on the top end but exibit some Germanic styling that some folks don't like especially on the top end rifles. Most of the rifles imported into the USA are more classic English styling than other German and French made double rifles.

The barrel sets of the early ones were Shoelump just like the Heym, but they have changed to the mono-block barrel sets now, and offered selective ejectors on the big bores. Both are strong and there is no problem with either type barrel. The barrels are COLD HAMMER FORGED as are most German barrels, and Merkel sells barrel blanks to the trade, and many of those barrels will be found on some top name rifles.

Anson & Deeley and they are the 20 ga size! The 141 is the same except on a 28 ga size. This is not to say these are simply rifle barrels on shotgun acrions. The actions are tempered for rifle use, and in real terms the Merkel double barreled shotguns are made on double rifle actions, not he other way around.

I personally own two Merkel double rifles, and have pushed a lot of ammo through both, and have had zero problem with either except for a small burr on the right trigger internals that caused a very hard trigger pull on my 140E-1 9.3X74R rifle, now fixed. the other one is a 140-2 470NE. Both are very accurate, both fit me well enough that I can make two for two on running wild boar, POP, POP, two dead boar! The 140E-1 has selective ejactors, while my 470NE has extractors.

My PH in Zambia had an older Merkel 470 that had been shot A LOT....and it was still in top shape.

Gary
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NRA Lifer
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quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

The actions are tempered for rifle use, and in real terms the Merkel double barreled shotguns are made on double rifle actions, not he other way around.

...there was an interesting post in the "shotgunning" section recently evaluating the merkel sxs on an argentine dove hunt...

...apparently, 12,000+ doves were taken in 4 days by the merkel sxs...the author also evaluated other brands and came to the conclusion that the merkel was one of the few sxs' able to withstand the rigors of cordoba...

quote:

Originally posted by GarBy:
My PH in Zambia had an older Merkel 470 that had been shot A LOT....and it was still in top shape.

Gary
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NRA Lifer
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Was your PH in Zambia Peter Chipman in the lower Lupande? If so he picked that thing up after failing to get off a second round from a 458 win mag bolt rifle before a wounded lion the gave him a little left leg adjustment!
If it was Peter's rifle Marc Watts also used that rifle to take his second buffalo on his safari with Peter!

Nope....Johnny DuPlooy.

Gary
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NRA Lifer
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My experience was mixed.

I bought this rifle to take to Zim for an ele hunt.

I got the last 500NE from the first batch of ejector rifles shipped to the USA. Doubled right out of the box, no matter which trigger was pulled. Back to GSI. Got it back. Still doubling. Back to GSI. Did not get it back in time to take it to Zim, took my 458 Lott instead.

Danny Spahn at GSI was great to deal with in regard to getting it fixed, ended having to get new triggers and sears from Germany.

The rifle was well made, accurate, easy to regulate. I had difficulty seeing the sights with my crappy eyes.It did not fit me very well and kicked like a rented mule.

I realize my experience is an anomaly and that the majority of Merkel owners are well pleased with their rifles. Enjoy your new 2-pipe

quote:

Originally posted by Head Trauma:
My experience was mixed.

I bought this rifle to take to Zim for an ele hunt.

I got the last 500NE from the first batch of ejector rifles shipped to the USA. Doubled right out of the box, no matter which trigger was pulled. Back to GSI. Got it back. Still doubling. Back to GSI. Did not get it back in time to take it to Zim, took my 458 Lott instead.<< SNIP

SNIP>> I realize my experience is an anomaly and that the majority of Merkel owners are well pleased with their rifles. Enjoy your new 2-pipe

My experience is before the new ones made on mono-block, and with ejectors on the big bore rifles. This is the second instance I've heard of in regard to the newer 500s, and I think it is simply that they were still learning on the new models, and were simply blind-sided by the heavy recoil of the 500NE the rifle being actually lighter than the 470NE, and misscalculated the recoils effect of the sears that were the same as used on the 470NE that actually weighed more. I do think they have a handle on it now, however!

I'm always in a "WAIT AND SEE" mode with any new model of anything till they have a little time under the belt to work out the bugs that show up in the field over time!

quote:

My experience was mixed.

I bought this rifle to take to Zim for an ele hunt.

I got the last 500NE from the first batch of ejector rifles shipped to the USA. Doubled right out of the box, no matter which trigger was pulled. Back to GSI. Got it back. Still doubling. Back to GSI. Did not get it back in time to take it to Zim, took my 458 Lott instead.

Danny Spahn at GSI was great to deal with in regard to getting it fixed, ended having to get new triggers and sears from Germany.

The rifle was well made, accurate, easy to regulate. I had difficulty seeing the sights with my crappy eyes.It did not fit me very well and kicked like a rented mule.

I realize my experience is an anomaly and that the majority of Merkel owners are well pleased with their rifles. Enjoy your new 2-pipe

I own this rifle now and after about 50 rounds have had no problems. Hopefully it will remain trouble free!!

ledvm: I had the Merkel gunsmith who works for Merkel at the U.S. distributor here in the States put a factory fiber optic front sight on mine. It is shaped just like the original front blade/bead but is bright red/orange. It really makes a difference!

HELL I sold mine to ozhunter and have wanted another ever since!! What a mistake to sell it but next time will get it with ejectors

My Merkel .500 NE was bought NIB but it was built in 2006...I believe (will check for sure). It has a more English styled straight stock and has a course brass blade for front sight and big square notch for rear...like a pistol sight.

Where does this make my rifle fall into the category of new or old as the trigger thing goes? Again...140-2 .500 NE.

...round and round it goes...guys - FWIW - money on the table if they'd be around 100 years ago... they'd cost so much I bet I'd rather buy Jeffery's instead...

Can you get a Merkel in a 450/400?

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
My Merkel .500 NE was bought NIB but it was built in 2006...I believe (will check for sure). It has a more English styled straight stock and has a course brass blade for front sight and big square notch for rear...like a pistol sight.

Where does this make my rifle fall into the category of new or old as the trigger thing goes? Again...140-2 .500 NE.

The problem IMO was that they didn't allow for the extra recoil of the 500NE in a rifle that actually weighed less than the 470NE rifle.

Because of that they set the sear enguagement the same as on the 470NE rifle, and the big jump in recoil of the lighter 500NE rifle requires a heavier sear enguagement to avoid double discharge!

I beleive after a couple went back for a fix, they got the message, and increased the enguagement on the 500NE rifles. That is why some of the 470s later came out with too heavy trigger pull, and were lightened by smiths in the USA, and Australia.

The real fix would be to offer sear intercptors in all the big bore actions. I doubt they will do that however, because it would adversly impact the price point!

My 470NE 140-2 has very nice triggers, but has never doubled on me in five years of useing it!
The 500NE Merkel 140-2 came out in 2006, so I'd say yours is one of the early ones. However the couple I've heard of problems with were the late 140-2s that are built on the mono-block barrels, and with selective ejectors. If yours was made in 2006 then it has extractors, and is made with shoelump barrel set like the Heym.

All the 140-2s however have English style stocks, rather than the hog back unless order with the hog back by the buyer. The hog back rear stock is still an option.

Actually the hog back stock is a well designed stock, it is just that Americans simply can't seem to warm up to the strong Germanic look! My 140E-1 has the hogback, and it fits me perfectly and shoots very well, while my 140-2 470NE has the English type, and fits me well too. I simply don't see any difference between them while shooting, only the way they look!

Mac,

Should I be worried about my rifle doubling and be pro-active???

I love mine, in 470NE

Here are a few mates shooting mine:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CanYpsvF96U

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNX_aS4FSCs

For better or worst,I too have entered the DR cult and purchased an early Merkel 9.3x74.It is used,but well cared for.It's had 200 rounds of factory ammo and appears to shoot very well.I will not recieve in hand until after Oct 1st,as I am in the middle of my move down south.
But,I think good things too come...

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Mac,

Should I be worried about my rifle doubling and be pro-active???

I think if your rifle is not doubleing on you don't worry about it. I would, however, shoot the rifle a lot before taking it to Africa to be sure.