I just finished reading Taylor's Big Game and Big Game Rifles chapter on rifles for Lion hunting. I makes reference to a "12 bore magnum 'Paradox'" (p.96) I understand that a "Paradox" has a smooth bore with the exception of the last portion of the barrel rifled.

But, when Taylor refers to a 12 bore is that the same as a 12 gauge? Like what I am accustomed to in shotgun jargon?
Is "bore", in the description of caliber, a term only applied to non conventional caliber firearms, i.e. 4 and 8?
With Paradox doubles, what is the standard barrel length, considered normal and how much of the barrel is actually rifled in a standard length?

I know it is a lot of questions, but I am just trying to sort out the difference to understand the book a slight bit better. Thanks for the help in answering my questions.

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But, when Taylor refers to a 12 bore is that the same as a 12 gauge? Like what I am accustomed to in shotgun jargon?

That "short" answer is, Yes, some say 12 bore, some say 12 guage...

DM

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Originally posted by DM:

quote:

But, when Taylor refers to a 12 bore is that the same as a 12 gauge? Like what I am accustomed to in shotgun jargon?

That "short" answer is, Yes, some say 12 bore, some say 12 guage...

DM

........and the LONG answer is it means a few things, but basiclly a rifled barrel where Tayler is concerned.

In regard to double Paradox it means a 12 guage simi rifle, made to shoot both ball, and shot. 12 Bore single or double rifle means the rifle is fully rifled, and is designed to shoot only ball (BULLETS) and no shot. Like our 12 ga shotgun barrels the we call special slug barrels,with iron sights, or scope, and are fully rifled are the same as a 12 bore rifles, not shotguns with this barrel attached.

Most of what Tayler talks about are rifles, but both the rifles, and paradox can be called bore rifles or bore guns.

I doubt Tayler would have wasted his time with a true shotgun. That would have been left to one of his gun bearers to gather camp meat birds. I doubt John shot birds very often, and so his Bore guns were usually used with bullets! So I think you will be close to correct to take his mention of any "BORE" gun as rifled, at least to Paradox extent, and all useing single bullets!

Others can probably add a lot more but here's my 2 cents:

A longer answer to the info above is also yes, but the term 'bore' must be taken with a grain of salt, just as 'gauge' must.

A 'standard' 12 bore/gauge is .729", but may be .745" or anywhere in between. "8" could be .810" to .875" (really 7 bore) depending who is talking. To add to the confusion, when thin brass repaced paper cases in large bore rifles, some makers kept the chamber diameter the same and used a larger bore (becasue of the thinner case, thus a thin brass '8' might really be 7-bore), while others used the same bore and a smaller chamber, thus the range of sizes going by the same name. Many nominal "4-bores" were really 6s. My 4 rifle is 1.005" groove to groove, and has a shot barrel, with the same chamber size, that is .938" after the forcing cone and choked to .890" at the muzzle. My 8-bore ball and shot gun has the same 3.25" chamber as most .835" 8-bore papercase rifles but only a .8265" bore. It would be a disaster to fire a .835" load! With any old bore gun it is vital to slug the bore and make a chamber cast before loading because even the markings can be deceiving.

All Bitish rifles used to be refered to by 'bore' size. I believe the change in the rule of proof in the 1870s started using inches, ie an old 577 rifle would previously been stamped '24', for 24 gauge, a .450 cal a 51 bore, etc.

Hope this helps. Bob

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Originally posted by bkhall:
I just finished reading Taylor's Big Game and Big Game Rifles chapter on rifles for Lion hunting. I makes reference to a "12 bore magnum 'Paradox'" (p.96) I understand that a "Paradox" has a smooth bore with the exception of the last portion of the barrel rifled.
With Paradox doubles, what is the standard barrel length, considered normal and how much of the barrel is actually rifled in a standard length?

.

The standard 12 paradox barrel length would be 28" with about 2" of rifling and would weigh about 7.5lbs. A magnum would weigh .5 to 1lb more. They would shoot a 740gr .735 bullet at 1050 and 1200fps respectively. Heavy smooth bore ball guns were also used on DG with short heavy barrels and could be used for shot but that was never their intented purpose.

quote:

All Bitish rifles used to be refered to by 'bore' size. I believe the change in the rule of proof in the 1870s started using inches, ie an old 577 rifle would previously been stamped '24', for 24 gauge, a .450 cal a 51 bore, etc.

My .450 Express No 1 is marked 56 on the flats - no other calibre markings.