Just for dreaming purposes.

I was wondering what is the practical max range of a double rifle?

Granted, I would think it would be cartrage and gun specfic.

So, Searcy Classic, no scope, irons only in 450-400 standard loading or regulated for a bit faster if the 450-400 could take it 2200 to
2250?

I understand cross over would come into play at some point and would limit pratcal range.

And not for DG, for DG it would be at shorter ranges for other reasons.But for PG.

I've read they are for shorter range than bolt gun shooting. But how short, 75,125,150,yards, longer possable?

Allen

On game:
With iron sights and my 450/400 my longest shot was around 150/160 yards on a running caribou.
I also shot one at 85 yards.

With my 450 No2 [iron sights] my longest shot on game was a giraffe at @188 yards, 2 shots 2 hits.

I have shot both of these guns on rocks at 200 yards quite a bit and the 450/400 on rocks to 300 yards in practice.

The limit is not in the rifles but in the shooter, eyes holding ability etc.

I can shoot a double rifle in the field as good as I can shoot a bolt rifle.

Most of the animals shot with these doubles have been within 100 yards.

With my scoped 9,3x74R I have taken game at 271 yards and a little over 300.

NE 450,
Oh, so a double is not the handycap I was assuming.

So 180 to 200 yards on PG would be doable.Like you say open sights would be a limiting factor, at least for me anyway.

And to, most game is shot a lot closer than 200 yards. I prefer short range shooting no matter what I'm shooting with.That's the fun of the hunt for me.

It's just neat to know that if a person only had a shot that was pushing 180yds or so you wouldn't be SOL, as long you could use irons at that range.

Could a 450-400 be velosity pushed up a 100 or 150 FPS? Would the case safely take it. I would think a Searcy would be ok strength wise, but it would have to be regulated for it.

What kind of four shot groups can be gotten at around 180 yards?

I would not recommend increasing the velocity of a double to get longer range performance. Besides pressure issues it would probably effect your regulation.

I have used double rifles quite a bit the last few years, and while it might not be my choice for a sheep rifle I have not found them to be any type of a handicap compared to a bolt rifle. In fact I consider the double rifle superior to anyother rifle has a hunting tool for about 80% of most hunting.

A 450/400 would be an excellent choice for you first big bore double.

However if I was getting any new made 450/400 I would definately have it fitted with a scope in QD mounts.

I receintly had my British 450/400 fitted with a 1.1-4 S&B with a flash dot illuminated reticle.

It has really enhanced the hunting ability of the 450/400.

Also for plains game you could work up some loads with 300 or 350 gr bullets and use the scope for them.

Is it conceivable to shoot the double with a specially developed longer range load? With maybe a faster and slightly lighter bullet, only out of the barrel chosen for its precision with that load? Use it as a single shot! Then go back to heavier and closer game where you can make best use of the deuce. Only an IMHO. Experiment, it can only enhance your familiarity with the rifle and the total ownership experience. I opened up a different world for the grandkids with the 358 Win loaded with pistol bullets. More fun than you can shake a stick at. Come to think of it I will try that with a 9.3 and 0.365" pistol bullets some day. Maybe in a double. Packy

packrat

That is entirely possible.
I have found that if I use the same powder charge for the full weight bullet, and substitute a bullet that weighs @75% of the full weight bullet it will hit with the sights and regulate as well as the full weight bullet.

Example in the 450 No2 I use a 350gr bullet, in the 450/400 I use a 300 gr bullet.
Their velocities are around 2330fps.

However with a lighter bullet you can increase the powder charge until you equal the pressure of the heavier bullet load, thus increasing the velocity of the lighter bullet even more.

Sometimes when this is done one of your barrels will still put a bullet from this load into the same group as the regulated loads, and the other bbl will shoot wide.

Having different loads like this can over complicate things if you are not careful.

However with a scoped double where you could make use if a longer range load it is a possibility worth looking at.

I plan on trying such in my newly scoped 450/400 when I get the chance.

packrat

You and I are not the first ones to think about using one bbl of a double for long range shooting.

My 450/400 3 1/4" London Sporting Park double rifle is marked on the left bbl
"This barrel is accurate with the sights to 400 yards".

The right bbl is marked "This barrel is accurate with the sights to 50 yards".

The rifle has a standing 50 yard sight and folding leaves for 100,200,300,and 400 yards.

The rifle was made in the 1920's.

The folding leaves are dead on to 300 yards for sure as I have fired the rifle that far.

Double rifles are not just short range affairs.

Allen,
It's your money, you can have the rifle made to what ever you want it made for.

The double rifle is designed to deliver 2 large caliber rounds at close quarters in tropical heat with ease of extraction/ejection of the spent cases.

In the capable hands of NE450#2 his scoped 9.3X74R has killed a coyote at 270 yards. Both rounds hit the target.

We all like to extend the use of our doubles. My longest kill is an eland cow at 120 yards with my 450/400 3 inch. My new Chapuis 9.3X74R will have a scope on it. I have no delusions about what ranges I will shoot it at.

You aren't the first person to want to "Hop Up" his double and make a long range rifle out of it.
For my long range shooting I use a bolt action rifle. (Please don't tell Tony.)

quote:

I understand cross over would come into play at some point and would limit practical range.

Allen:
This is not true of a properly regulated double. The shots from the right barrel should land on the right side, and those from the left barrel on the left side, of a useful composite group at all distances to infinity. The barrels converge only to compensate for the slight tendency to recoil apart under fire. As the projectiles leaves the muzzles, the bores are actually parallel. Hope that makes sense.

Most British double rifles in the .400 class were fitted with sight leaves to 300 yards at least, and they were 'shot and regulated' at those distances by the maker. If your eyes are good enough, and the rifle is well-made, and you have a steady rest (..and you can shoot!), then a 6 to 8 inch group at 200 yards should be easily achievable. Since the majority of shots should land closer to the centre of any given group than the 'fringe', shots on game to 200 yards or a little more (with a rest) can be ethically justified.

Get closer if you can, though!

Crap just ready to post a reply and I erased it some how!

Thanks for all the info guys. I know so very little about doubles but am working on changing that.I think doubles are extremly intersting.

Rusty, I didnt even think about extraction, good point.

Marrakai, ah, now I understand, That makes sence.For some reason I thought they (bullets) converged at a aiming point then then crossed.Ok they stay paralel.

Is there a spell check on the board? I used to copy to outlook express check spelling then post.But I can't copy now. Am I missing something? Heven knows I NEED my spellcheck!

Allen

quote:

Originally posted by AllenBosely:

Heven knows I NEED my spellcheck!

Allen

Allen, anyone on this website will tell you that you can't posibly spell worse than me! The last sentence of your post should be in my signatyre line!

Marikai beat me too it! It seems you are not the only one who was under the misconception that all double rifle cross at some point. About 90% of the gun writers over the years have made that statement. SO.........Is it any wonder most people think that way? Those express sights on very expensive double rifles with flip-ups for 100, 200, 300, and some even have addtional with ladder sights for 500 yds, were put there for a reason! If a load is proper for the regulation of the double, the rifle will shoot to those sights. The only thing that will alter this is the ability of the shooter, as Tony said!

Welcome to the forum at AR, and the home of the DRSS (Double Rifle Shooter's Society)

I have shot my scoped 9,3x74R double to 300 yards on paper.
The shots did not cross.

I've killed hogs past 100 yards fairly often with my .470 and my all time long range game shot with a .470 was at a lasered 218 yards on a wildebeest.

The posts above are accurate in stating that the doubles range limitations are in most cases the shooter.

A properly regulated double should not have a significant cross over at any range.

One should be able to reach out to 250yrds with 2200+/-100fps velocity and 150yrd zero.
I have seen Jones under-lever .450/400NE 3&1/4" with set of folders to 300 yrds and ladder sight to 1000yrds.