I am in New York for a few days and decided to swing by Holland and Holland's gun room for a few minutes. They have a stunning new, round body .500 double for sale. Just under $90,000 for anyone interested.

http://hollandandholland.com/g...&l=new_york&v=new&c=

Does anyone have any views of the grain structure running through that rifle's stock, especially at the wrist when viewing from it's left side?

As it's an H&H, I presume it's strong enough, even for a double rifle's recoil; but it does make me think. And I can't see top or bottom tangs either.

Mike,

Does that rifle have a splinter fore-end? When I inquired about having my Round Body VC built with a splinter fore-end, Ken said the VC guys thought a splinter would not flow ascetically as well as the semi-beavertail. The pics on the H&H website doesn't show the fore-end in its entirety but the base looks like a splinter.

Will they take a check or do they want real money??

10 pounds 7 oz, a bit light for my tastes!

quote:

Originally posted by doubleriflejack:
10 pounds 7 oz, a bit light for my tastes!

Sounds good to me and the price is good for a new H&H.

Todd,
From pictures of H&H fore ends, the V-C's splinter is very similar. Ideally I would prefer the for-end a tad shorter at say 7" to 7.5" long in lieu of the 8".

quote:

Originally posted by ozhunter:

quote:

Originally posted by doubleriflejack:
10 pounds 7 oz, a bit light for my tastes!

Sounds good to me and the price is good for a new H&H.

Todd,
From pictures of H&H fore ends, the V-C's splinter is very similar. Ideally I would prefer the for-end a tad shorter at say 7" to 7.5" long in lieu of the 8".

Do you know of a picture clearly showing a splinter on a H&H Round Body? I'd like to take a look at one if so. It's probably not too late to change my VC to a splinter but would like to see one first since I was told they didn't think it would look right with the round body.

MJines, do not forget about the Beretta Gallery on Madison between 63 and 64, I was there on Saturday, came close to walking out with a 20g 686 Silver Pigeon with some lovely wood...

Todd, change it to a splinter (never could understand why anyone would put one of those beavertails on fine firearm ?), best, Mike

Grenadier,

Thanks for the picture. I think I much prefer that splinter fore-end. I'll get a message off to Ken to see if I can get that changed.

MB,

Very much agree with you concerning the splinter.

Todd,
Whilst not a H&H these pictures of a V-C show its similarity to the H&H fore-end.
With the small action, any bigger or bulkier for-end imo would look out of place.

the new round body sure makes vintage Hollands look even better. That is not an attractive gun to my eye.

that round body Holland is NOT attractive ?? My soul ? best Mike

I'll take a nice between the wars gun any day, or even a good pre-WWI gun. Now those guns had SOUL.

Don't forget 21 West 52nd Street to tip up a pink gin to Snr. Ruark...

Skb, does this have soul ??



best

That is nice indeed.

but I just a vintage rifle or gun myself. My .30 super on PD action.



and a royal self opener and my new pup. All good stuff.

both lovely amigo, those pheasants look to be in superb condition, best, Mike

I'm in agreement with you guys on the ascetics of the splinter. Actually, I like the way it feels in the hand as well. I suppose some don't like the round body but to my eye, I found it very appealing.

With the RB being new to VC, I guess they were reluctant to build it with the splinter, but IMO, it just looks and functions better. I've sent an email to Ken to try and get it changed but haven't heard back at this point.

Hopefully, I'll have some progress pics to post in a month or 2.

Mike B.,

Your H&H Royal in 375FL is a work of art my friend. Very nice indeed.

Thank you Todd, I shot that bugger on the last day of a 10 day hunt and we had been through 2 days of torrential rain, makes you wince a bit with water sluicing through the locks and barrels ! still, what are they made for ? best, Mike p.s. you won´t regret the splinter fore end

Mike,

I followed your threads on NE concerning your H&H Royal. Do you have some of those pictures posted here on AR? I'm sure we would all love to see them here again if you have them available. The pic you have here with the buff is a bit dark and doesn't do the rifle justice. But then again, I doubt any pics do it justice compared to having it in hand!

I can put a link up

http://s222.photobucket.com/al...d31/mlb6363/Holland/

Awesome!

Italian action, right?

Really interesting that H&H and Purdey are both doing projects with Continental makers.

It just begs the question: Is it really that expensive to run CNC in the UK?

I hope it gets a lot of use.

quote:

Originally posted by Chris Lozano:
Will they take a check or do they want real money??

That's what I was thinking! And as my late father-in-law and gun mentor used to say, " I will write you a check for that. And if it bounces, don' worry, I'll write you another one....just like it!"

i think i am going to walk 4 blocks down from work and check out holland and holland gun room in nyc in the near future.

the color case 375 H&H round action is my dream gun

quote:

Originally posted by MichiganShooter:
Italian action, right?

Really interesting that H&H and Purdey are both doing projects with Continental makers.

It just begs the question: Is it really that expensive to run CNC in the UK?

I hope it gets a lot of use.

May I suggest that you visit the H&H and Purdey factories, if you find Italian or Spanish junk there, I'll reimburse your trip !!!

Michiganshooter, I´ll have a wager of any size you like that Holland have never used an Italian or Spanish action, how much ? like Bobby says, go and visit the factory, see the CNC, see the barrel making and see the benches

Mike Bailey, I see that your 375 is marked No 1. I vaguely remember you were planing on a second rifle. Could you please post the link or photos of that one as well.

Thanks for sharing.

Nakihunter, sure, No.2 is the .500, here is the link

http://s222.photobucket.com/al...b6363/Holland%20500/

best,
Mike

I beginning to warm up to the round body Hollands but Mike it's just not fair showing your mustachioed, sideclipped sidelocks in the same thread!

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Bailey:
Nakihunter, sure, No.2 is the .500, here is the link

http://s222.photobucket.com/al...b6363/Holland%20500/

Two beautiful guns Mike!

Skeletized buttplate on the .500? Yikes!!

In regard to those trying to be more Catholic than the Pope:

Have a look at the Perugini and Visini website. "In 2005 James Purdey & Sons, one of the oldest gunmakers of London England, recognised this and commissioned P&V to manufacture their acclaimed Purdey Sporter." http://www.peruginivisiniusa.com/index.asp

The Famars website was redone for the US store launch. Prior to that they said much the same thing about the round body rifle actions for H&H. The same way Beretta sells a Famars (or A&S, for those interested in distinction without difference) as a Beretta DR. And didn't H&H also make at least one single-shot on a Ruger?

More on the Purdey: "The new Purdey Sporter caused a stir when it was launched in 2007 not least because it was partially manufactured in Italy in association with Perugini and Visini (two former employees of Perazzi). The new gun was based on the generic Perazzi MX8-style action as copied by Perugini and Visini, Kemen and others." http://www.thefield.co.uk/gunr.../Purdey_Sporter.html

Rigby in UK sold Spanish shotguns they rebadged, the same way Churchill does now with an Italian gun. http://www.gunmart.net/gun_rev...j.churchill_perazzi/

From Bobby van der Putten: "May I suggest that you visit the H&H and Purdey factories, if you find Italian or Spanish junk there, I'll reimburse your trip !!!"

Let me make a counter suggestion. Stick it up your ass. I've already seen the glories of Audley House and am not ashamed to state that I cannot afford most of their goods, Italian, British, or American (see their knives). That is, of course, the problem: very, very few of us can. British manufacturing has languished for over half a century because the financial firms, not manufacturers, drive economic policy in the UK. That is why the firms that can make it frequently seek out lesser-cost quality elsewhere. You can call it junk, but then I've already documented that those doing so do not know what they are talking about.

Please note that I am not saying what these firms offer is not splendid. It is. It is other posters saying that things that aren't English are by definition inferior. I am saying even the London marques know that a firearm costing as much as a yacht has a tiny, and not necessarily viable, market. England has given us many great things, including and aside from firearms, like Orwell. Here he is discussing another of London's gifts to the world, "One very striking thing about Dickens, especially considering the time he lived in, is his lack of vulgar nationalism. All peoples who have reached the point of becoming nations tend to despise foreigners, but there is not much doubt that the English-speaking races are the worst offenders."

Maybe it is time we stopped acting like former colonists (with all their attendant insecurities) and started realizing that "Old World" artisanship extends to places beyond walking distance of the Court of St. James's.

Michigan shooter, I did not mention Purdey, I know they are doing a model based on an Italian action. I also know Holland have made single shots on the Hagn action and, have by customer request, made single shots on the Ruger action. A number of UK makers are building shotguns in the "lower" price bracket on Italian and Spanish actions, this is not new, since the 1880´s they have been using Birmingham actions so no real change. However the best models are always made in house, I can assure you that Holland do not buy in any actions for their double rifles. best, Mike

Sorry Michigan but I do agree with you on a couple of points, there is marvellous stuff made in Italy, Fabri, Bosis, Piotti and I think high end Spanish guns are the best VALUE in the world, as the head of one of the big London names said to me and I quote..."Buggered if I know how they do it, 90% of the gun for 30% of the price, if you hid the names with tape on this and a London gun, 99% of buyers wouldn´t know which was which"

DoubleDon, thank you, to be honest the recoil on the .500 feels less than a Dumoulin .470 O/U I bought as a "stop gap", I think stock fit is all, I don´t shoot more than 8 rounds at paper at a time without getting a minor headache but shooting anything alive I don´t hear it or feel it ? best, Mike

Thanksa for that Mike. Why is this rifle not markedNo 2? Have you shot any BIG game with it?

Greeat rifles and thanks for sharing.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Bailey:
Nakihunter, sure, No.2 is the .500, here is the link

http://s222.photobucket.com/al...b6363/Holland%20500/

best,
Mike

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Bailey:
Todd, change it to a splinter (never could understand why anyone would put one of those beavertails on fine firearm ?), best, Mike

+1 I agree completely! There is no way I would order a double rifle of any make with a Beaver tail forestock!
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