I am building a little double rifle in .22 K hornet. My customer intends to use 60gr bullets. I was going to work up the loads using lil gun powder. He suggested lil gun isn't the poweder of choice for the heavier bullets. Anyone have experience with the K Hornet and heavy pills? Powder suggestion?

Thanks!!

The range of choices are Lil Gun, 2400, 296 and H110. I have used both Lil Gun and 2400 in a 7-1/2" barreled custom revolver and have gotten ok accuracy. The K-Hornet is a very picky cartridge for sure. Uniforming the primer pockets helped a lot, and I use only Winchester small rifle WSR primers. Sometimes small pistol magnum primers helps, depending on the situation. Expect brass to split at the shoulders and have loose primers pockets within just a few loadings. I think the 218 Mashburn Bee is a better choice.

I tried some 55s in my K. Didn't work well, low velocity, poor accuracy. Might I ask why he wants to use 60s?

quote:

Might I ask why he wants to use 60s?

Ditto.

The Hornet and the "K" version of it are well suited for 45 gn bullets and below. They lack the powder capacity to do anything well with 55 gn bullets and heavier.
I began reloading in 1948 for the 22 Hornet, and have owned on since 1949. I used my Step Dad's model 54 Hornet till I could save up the money for a Savage 219 in 22 Hornet of my own.
I've never even loaded up 50 gn bullets as I don't feel the extra 5 gns of weight would offset decreased velocity, and possibly accuracy.
My thinking is, 60 gn bullets out of a Hornet would be a CHALLANGE, and for what purpose? I have no idea. He might get sling shot velocities with a 60 in a Hornet?? I don't know.
Twist of the barrel's rifling would be a real issue here. I wouldn't know what twist would work??

It's going to take a pretty fast twist to stabilize 60 grainers at the meager velocity a K-Hornet will generate. Also, the expansion at those reduced velocities may be marginal, depending on the bullet.

I would look to AA 1680 or AA 2200 (if you can find some) as the first powder choices to try.

Second the 1680, while IMR4227 will also work ok. I am like the other guys, why the 60 grain bullets? In that case the Mashburn would be a better choice.

Jerry

He wants to use the 60 gr bullets for more energy inside 100 yds. I am expecting to get around 2300fps through 22.5" 1 in 12 barrels.

From poking around online, it looks like H4198 might be the best choice. Seems to produce less pressure for similar velocity compared to H4227 and Lil gun.

This is a 100 yd gun, being a double rifle and it will have iron sights. Game he is after are duiker, jackel ect.

Will post my experience with the loading so we can all know what the "K" will do with the heavier bullet.

quote:

Originally posted :
the expansion at those reduced velocities may be marginal, depending on the bullet.

I would look to AA 1680 or AA 2200 (if you can find some) as the first powder choices to try.

I would agree with the 1680 suggestion...it would likely be a perfect match for that weight bullet.

As to the lack of expansion with 60 grainers...though that would not be my choice of bullets (I prefer 40 gr. bullets from my Hornets and AI Hornets), I can see where it might be useful when shooting edible rabbits....like cottontails or "bush rabbits".

The standard Hornet with light bullets tends to blow them all to Heck. A bullet which would NOT expand much, if at all, would be perfect for killing rabbits for the camp pot within 60 yards or so. Of course it would have to be stable and not tumble, and also be accurate...

That sounds so potentially useful, I may have to try it myself.

Probably won't work out, but sounds worth a test or two.

Bailey, you may find, that you cannot get enough 4198 in the case to acheive the velocity you want. I have had no success with this powder in the K or Hornet.

Jery

quote:

Originally posted by Jerry Eden:
Bailey, you may find, that you cannot get enough 4198 in the case to acheive the velocity you want. I have had no success with this powder in the K or Hornet.

Jery

While it is true that H4198 is too slow for the Hornet or K-Hornet with conventional bullet weights, it might work reasonbly well when stepping up to the heavy 60 grainer. Still, AA 1680 is likely one of your best bets. I would suggest going to a 1-10" or even 1-9" barrel to assure stabilization of the long 60's at such low velocities. A 60-grain Hornady Spire Point (or 63 grain Sierra or 64 grain Winchester semispitzer) should act like a larger caliber game bullet at these velocities and give you at least some functional expansion.

As someone else suggested, have you considered chambering for the .218 Bee or Mashburn Bee instead? This would give you a little boost in case capacity and velocity. It could be loaded down to Hornet levels if so desired.

The double rifle is long since obsolete and would never have been invented in the first place had it not been the only practical way of acheiving a quick second shot. I have to assume that your customer simply wants the double K-Hornet because he likes doubles. I don't envy you the formidable task of getting both barrels to toss their lead somewhere within the same body-width of such small game as duikers and jackals. But it is a fascinating project. What action are you building it on?

I have said this before in other threads:

My NEF K-Hornet shoots 55-grain Winchester jacketed soft points to one hole at 100 with 10 grains of Accurate 2200 and a small pistol primer.

Stonecreek,

I am building my own actions of my design. The last one I finished ( thread on the double rifle forum "Damascus hornet-in progress") will place a round from each barrel inside 2" at 200yds. Chuck Hawks reviewed the rifle and repoted that back to me. It is chambered in .22 Hornet.

I am with you on the .218 Bee. Still scratching my head as to why it isn't more popular when everyone seems to want to add the K to their hornet.

I picked up some imr4227 and small pictol primers today. The heavier bullets with the H4198 don't develop as much pressure, and so less velocity. I can always drop a grain if pressure becomes an issue with the 4227.

I have had nothing but trouble with my k-hornet bolt gun made by cooper. I can only get 11/2 moa out of it, case life is short. The 1/14 twist won't stabalize 50 gr bullets.
If you are going to do it I would go 1/10 twist, with a long throat. If you do that it won't work wellwith 40 grs when you fireform.

JD

I tried all manner of powder and projectile looking for an accurate load for heavier bullets and found that my gun likes I4198 and 50 gr VMax's. If you are going to shoot heavier bullets, give one of the 4198's a try.

Three different powders work well with 52 to 60 gr in my K--

1680, 4227 and IMR 4198

but I used a 1 in 9 barrel

45X's stoked with '296,will do it all and easily.

Picked up the .22 k-hornet double with extra set of .410 3-inch barrels from Bailey two days ago. Will be off to Namibia with it next week. Load is 9 gr. of IMR4227 that I will chronograph tomorrow as I formally check composite group for possible tweaking.

Don't rule out eventually trying a 45 gr. bullet such as the Barnes Triple Shock that I believe a modern double rifle can safely digest. But this trip will wring out the Nosler 60 grain partition on Damara dik-dik, warthoglet (not Mom or Dad) and maybe a black-backed jackal.

Will write up results with a pix or two. Note: the shotgun barrels will do for sandgrouse, dove with #7-1/2 and, with 11/16 of #6, for 25 yard guinea fowl.

Regards

.224's impacting at any speed,assuredly ain't Feel Good Spray.

But in fairness,those wicked little 45's have to be seen in action,to be even partially appreciated.

Head her straight to the Striped-assed Ape Patch and Wage War.

I use my 22K Hornet as my calling rifle for jackal in South Africa.

I have played with VMAX 35gr and 40gr as well as Sierra 40gr bullets but have found that they do not have enough punch to put a jackal down quickly.

I have started loading 45gr PMP SP's 11.3gr S265 (Somchem powder). This will give me 2800fps and more than enough to hammer a jackal out to 200 meters.

I have tried 50gr but was never happy with them.

The 45gr SP will do the job on any antelope up to blesbuck size providing you pick your shot and keep it with in 100 yards....

If you have trouble finding a powder that will work for you, you might try IMR3031. I wouldn't go out and buy a pound just to try it, but if you already have some on hand, it might be worth a try. I have used it with decent results.