I'm asking this mainly out of curiousity, but why don't I see many praises and accolades for Winchester rifles on this site? There is so much writen about Rems, Sako, Tikka, Savage, etc, but rarely do I see someone recommend a Winchester, unless it's an older version in a large bore with claw extractor. I bought a Winchester Stealth this past year and love it. It shoots great, the trigger is crisp and easily adjusted, form and finish are good, and most of all thier safety is fantastic. I guess this could be posted in the medium bore section as well, so feel free to comment on all calibers.

My friend has moved to the city to work and has left me his Win Super Grade to work on a couple of loads for him. Although it's the only Winny I've had a chance to play with I have to say I like it alot.

The action is what I like the best. It makes the action on my Brownings and Ruger feel sloppy. The magazine loads and cycles smoother also. It's a little heavy but kicks less than my other 7mag. The stock is pretty classy to boot.

I like Winnies. I have a pushfeed M70 HV (Heavy Varmint,the immediate precurrsor model to the Stealth)in 22-250. Difference between the two is the HV has a jewelled bolt and a matte stainless barrel. I've played around a bit with it and so far it shoots 5 shot groups very consistently in the .6s with a moderate 55gr VMax/Varget load I whizzed up. While this isn't exactly gilt edge bughole accuracy, if I do my part, it groups that load well with boring regularity not one good group, two average, one bad, one good, ad nauseum.

One day I'll hopefully find the bughole receipe for it, but I'm a happy Winnie owner nevertheless. It's one of my favorite toys.

Well Jeth: Mainly its because most of us Winnie owners are just tired of trying to convert the masses to the better product.......especially when Winchester can't keep up with orders.

Stealths are some of the best factory rifles on the market, but they get snatched so fast you have to hunt for them. Mine is a .223 and shoots .5 and sometimes better......sometimes worse, too, but hey, the varmints still fall over.

My .308 is a Winchester Sharpshooter.......you just don't find them around much, but you can drive tacks with them.

I just never liked the extractor on a Remmy, but I'd get one.....if it was built by George Gardner.

The Remington 700 clan is a vocal bunch. They just have to keep reminding themselves they have a good rifle.......me, I'm secure with Winchesters. I already know it.....don't need a reminder.

I've never owned a Model 70 that I didn't like, but have never owned any post-64's of any kind. My hunting buddy bought a recent safari Grade .375, liked it a lot, then traded it in on a Kimber of Oregon in the samecaliber!!

You'll be hard pressed to find someone that would openly denounce the Model 70 action....be it push or controlled feed, they're all exceptionally well designed.

Lee Martin
www.singleactions.com

I've liked the few I've owned but they are DAMNED hard to find with the bolt handle on the correct side! (Notice I didn't say, "the RIGHT side").

For me, the Montana MRC route would be better if I were to go looking for such things.

Redial

My first deer rifle was a Model 70 Winchester 30-06. Unfortunately it was made in 1964, but, I never had a problem with the gun and at the time (I was a kid), I could shoot it more accurately with iron sites than several of the dad's could with scopes. (what I convieniently didnt tell you is they were shooting 303 british....) I havent followed Winchester much of late, but it would not stop me from buying one. I would love to have a Model 70 270 WSM.

I have a Pre-64 (1952) Winchester 308 Win Featherweight that still shoots cloverleaf groups and I wish I had 10 more Pre-64's in different calibers. The old Winchesters are hard to beat but of course that is when Winchester made Rifles.

[ 05-22-2003, 20:39: Message edited by: Handloader ]

Hello Jethro,

Your question is an interesting one. Most Remingtons are very accurate. So are most Savages. I'm certain there are accurate Rugers, Winchesters and Brownings as well, but I think getting the real tackdriver is a risky proposition, sort of a crapshoot if you will. Currently the major competition to Remington and Savage seems to be coming from Sako, Tikka and possibly Howa. Ten responders would probably give you as many different answers. I guess there are no definitive answers. Some guy who has the bucks will scream "what about Cooper or Weatherby." Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

I've got an older post 64 model 70 featherweight
in .270 that will group 1 MOA any day of the week
if I do my part. I wouldn't hesitate to take it hunting if I could get it back from my buddy. I
will never loan any of my guns out to anyone again
ever. The gun is light weight and very reliable.
The only thing I ever had fixed on it was the safety but afterward it work perfectly. It kicks a
little but I never noticed the recoil when hunting. Winchester makes a good product but I own
several other brands too. It's just like women and
cars: sometimes you get a lemon, and sometimes
you get love! They all wear out eventually no matter what the name is so don't go by name but
by what feels right in your hands and shoots good
for you! Just my $0.02 worth! BLR7

Two of the worst shooting rifles that I have shot were factory winchesters.One was a featherlight in 30-06 and another a supergrade in 300win mag.Both had the worst bedding that I have ever seen in a factory rifle.They both also shot very well after being bedded properly.The problem was obviously quality control at the factory.

I have a bunch of M-70's, most of the time when I get one they go to the smiths for a tune up. I look at it, they don't cost much for what you get and well once some adjustments are made, they shoot very nice. I bought a M-70 super grade, back in 1996. It needed some adjustments, so I sent it to CPR and when I got it back, I zero'ed in for 200 yards and had not have to to resight in since. I have shot quit a few deer with that rifle, and its one of my favorites, feeds so slick, that some times I have to look to see if a cartridge has been chambered. And it puts 130 gr Nosler Partitions into a quarter at 200 yards all the time. Only thing is that at dam near 9.5 lbs its a little heavy after a few days on the trail.

J.Stordahl- A BIG AMEN.

Jethro,

I consider my Winchesters the same as I love my Volvo.

They are reliable, I like their looks and feel, and when all of the people bashing it are replacing what they had and thought it was better, mine are still doing exactly what I bought them to do.

I love a Sako, Tikka, and a CZ,
BUT..
There is no way in hell I would ever sell one of MY Winchesters to buy one of those.

go over to huntamerica.com....the only rifle for most over there is a Mod 70. Heck, you can hardly ask a question about another make without someone posting something to the effect of "why didn't you buy a Winchester?"

I really like their powder.

Easy to meter and it shoots great in my 308 Remington.

jeff

I've got a 70 lightweight in 223. I bought it in the early 90's and have put a lot of rounds through it. It has never let me down and is more than accurate enough to knock foxes down at 250+ yards. The only thing that I have done to it is to smooth down the rear of the mag elevator so that the rounds load a bit smoother and to remove the sharp edges on the bolt lugs and guide rails. It's quiet and silky now.

Fortune:

I have that same rifle, and Gawd do I love that thing. Just a sexy and functional rifle isn't it?
I will never sell that rifle, even for 5 times what I paid for it because I could not replace it. Have used it for even taking deer, with a handloaded 70 Speer, Semi Spitzer with 27.5 grains of H 380 powder. with a muzzle velocity at about 3050fps. The two deer it took were both at about 200 yds when I took them.

What do you have mounted for a scope on yours?

I have one Pre-64 Mod. 70 in .308 that I shoot with a peep sight. Does right well for this half blind old fart.
Most of the Mod 70 I do have are the push feed type, a couple post 60, pre-73 models and two of the later versions. All will do from .75 to 1.0" when I do my part.
The only one that did not shoot worth a damn was a Featherweight in 7x57. damned thing was about as erratic and temperamental as a woman on PMS.
I had it glass bedded, a decent trigger job, nothing seemed to help. Finally, I changed scoped and the rifle was fixed, but good. Groups now run from .375 to 1.0" depending on the bullet and load. Seems that the brand new Leupold M8 4X was defective. Sent it back and it returned fixed in les than two weeks. Decided to leave the 3x9X Vari-X II on the rifle.
I don't have a problem with any of the Remingtons I own, but I would like to see a better extractor than that "El Cheapo" rig they use.nI've had one fail on me. My other gripe is the bolt handle is too short. I would like to see it about .5 to .75" longer.
When practicing rapid fire, it seems like I can get hold of the bolt handle on a Model 70 much easier than the Remington. I'm neutral on Rugers. The ones I've had have all worked reasonably well. Never have used a Mk II model and don't think I ever will unless I can get it really cheap. I don't like the trigger and the safety is too damn small IMHO.
Paul B.

While deciding on while rifle to buy recently, I looked at the Winchester Coyote. It looks impressive and balances fairly well. But when I looked closely, I noticed the stock was touching the barrel along most of one side of the barrel channel and there was a large gap along the other side. Thinking this was an unusal occurance, I looked at another one at a different store...it had a simular problem. Now maybe USRAC ship the junk seconds to Canada but if this an example of their current fit and finish, I'll never consider a Winnie.

Eagle

quote:

---

I noticed the stock was touching the barrel along most of one side of the barrel channel and there was a large gap along the other side. Thinking this was an unusal occurance, I looked at another one at a different store...it had a simular problem. Now maybe USRAC ship the junk seconds to Canada but if this an example of their current fit and finish, I'll never consider a Winnie.

---

Both A-bolts I have and my friends super grade came like that also. All three rifles shoot sub moa with out custome work yet. My ruger has no free float what so ever and I get 1/2" groups out of her. I don't think it's a big deal unless it comes back from the gun smith with that problem.

Yeah okay but....in this day and age of robotic construction and computerized lazer guided cutters and such there is no excuse for poor fit and finish. This is especially true when there is a $1000 price tag on it. Hell, with commpetition the way it is, USRAC better clean up their act or they will be out of business.

Here is my mid-80's Push feed M70 in .22-250.

Action as smooth as silk and shoots sub 1" groups out of a sporter-weight barrel. The only work I did on it is lighten the trigger and free-float the barrel.

All my target/varmint rifles are Remingtons, Sakos, Coopers and Nesikas....But all my real hunting rifles are Winchester Model 70 with CRF. (270, 6.5-284 and 338 Win Mag). All in Featerweights (the worlds best looking rifle!) Non of the Winchesters shoot better than a bit less than 1", but that is more than good enough for hunting big game.

I love pre 64 M-70 Winchester and Mausers, most of my guns are that.....

Check this out and you'll see that Model 70 pushfeeds are more than capable of being used for "custom" rifles.They are one of the many underrated bolt actions out there.Another is the Howa 1500/Wtby Vanguard etc.

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=179375&page=1&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=7&fpart=1

[ 08-02-2003, 06:33: Message edited by: rembo ]

Well this thread has made me realize that, with the exception of a 1948 Model 94, I have no Winchester rifles. I have a Remington 700, a CZ 527, a Savage 110, a Tikka Whitetail Hunter and a Howa, plus a bunch of .22s and a couple of military surplus rifles. I have a MRC SA stainless on order, though. One of these days, I'll have to rectify the shortfall in my rifle collection.

Pre 64 Remingtons and Winchesters were very close in price. The 870 Remington for example has gained the reputation of THE pump shotgun. Did it even start to compare to a Win mod 12? Not in my books. We are talking machined,fitted parts on the Win vs stamped parts on the Remington. Did the Rem 721 for example compare to the Win mod 70? Not in my books. My dad had a mod 721 only because he got a heck of a deal on it. He killed lots of deer with it,but he'd tell you in a New York minute the Mod 70 was more gun. To me there was a HUGE difference in quality but the prices about the same. It cost more to build the Winchesters to get the quality,yet sales were neck and neck. I think this was because a lot of folks didnt know the difference. I do think thats the same reason a lot of 30-30's that rattle when you shake them were sold too. Winchester had to lower their quality to compete--raising price was not an option. Their post 64 was inline with and possibly ahead of 700's,but there were rumors to include the post 64 had plastic trigger guard. I can stick a magnet on mine---something I cant do with my 600 Remington for example. My model 42 .410 with full choke is just the sweetest thing ever made,only gun I have with the serial number memorized--it's the same forwards or backwards. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

The winchesters in our household have all been excellent current list is just a pre-64 m94 (1938 -92% condition) and a 22-250 coyote. I have not shot the coyote much but right before I left for the Navy I han up some handloads -15 rnds or so, I gouped into a dime at 100 (didn't have the calipers with me never expected a group like that!), Since I have not shot it and unfortunatly I don't have the load info with me but I would recomend a Winchester with no reservations.

Andrew