I had not been out this season and a couple days after Christmas my grandson asked if I wanted to go. Bought my license and got my gear ready. I violated my rule of if it aint broke--don't fix it. I took the sling off my .243 (which is all I have used for several years) and put it on my .223. I figured all the .223 threads I have been involved on, I better use a .223. And if I got one, I could stir the pot. Didn't see a thing. Didn't have to make the decision of do I really want to do this? No deer to gut out. Got home and no deer to skin. Next day, no deer to butcher. No blood to clean off my garage floor. No blood to clean out of my pickup. A great hunt and the .223 did REALLY GREAT. Maybe the deer have been reading here and knew not to show up when I had a .223.

great report!

but, no pix or it didn't happen


Best,

GWB

I took my 50-70 out hunting and the deer did as they normally do. They all want to be killed by such a nice looking rifle and they dropped dead at the sight of it. I got a guy that could not kill anything with his .223 to skin them for the livers and they are now in the freezer.

SR4759--You are correct. 223 guys are having a hard time getting deer as the deer have been reading the internet and have wised up to not get near guys with a .223.

Of course that also means:
No Tenderloin and eggs

No Backstrap medallions with veggies

No venison Roast with veggies

No venison based Green Chili Stew

No venison Sausage

No Venison Burger

No venison Summer Sausage,

but then there are the things you listed ALSO

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman1:
I had not been out this season and a couple days after Christmas my grandson asked if I wanted to go. Bought my license and got my gear ready. I violated my rule of if it aint broke--don't fix it. I took the sling off my .243 (which is all I have used for several years) and put it on my .223. I figured all the .223 threads I have been involved on, I better use a .223. And if I got one, I could stir the pot. Didn't see a thing. Didn't have to make the decision of do I really want to do this? No deer to gut out. Got home and no deer to skin. Next day, no deer to butcher. No blood to clean off my garage floor. No blood to clean out of my pickup. A great hunt and the .223 did REALLY GREAT. Maybe the deer have been reading here and knew not to show up when I had a .223.

This sounds a lot like my hunting this year. Sitting in the woods with my rifle an not a deer to be seen.

Mine too. I did not see a single deer of either sex on the few days I was able to get out. I was carrying my 257 Wby mag, so maybe it's not just a 223 issue?

It also meant I didn't get to banter with Ol Kabluewy about shooting deer with a .223. Bummer. Things were slow here this year. My nephew and his son didn't come down. My son in law got a nice buck with his bow and my grandson got a spike with his .308 and that was it.

My niece lives and hunts in Kanabek county in MN. They live so far in the stix the deer can't get internet without a dish, and being a bit economically depressed in that area I guess they can't afford it. She shot 2 deer with my .223 and Noslers new Bonded bullets. 2 shots, 2 dead deer and she watched them both drop. Luckily those deer had no idea how under powered her rifle was so they allowed complete penetration. Holes on both sides and blood sprayed in two directions...those deer up there are soooo stupid! I sure hope Windstream doesn't make DSL available anytime soon! In their ignorance they didn't even realize they should not approach a maniac with an assault rifle!

Quintus

is that the64 grain somewhat round nose?

It has a really thick jacket as it tapers toward the base.

My cousin was gonna use his 223 on deer around here, but I showed him that my custom upper in 6.5 Grendel would just snap onto his lower.

He and the deer he shot with it were impressed.

But I didn't cure him completely from the infliction of the 223, since he reported that he bought some hog slammer ammo, apparantly loaded with Barnes TSX. At least he's not using varmint ammo.

I'm amazed that he spent the money for premium ammo. I think the only reason he used my 6.5 upper was because it was already sighted in and the ammo was free. He's cheap and not really into details, kinda like Carpetman, but not nearly as bad. But that's typical of 223 users. I've learned to not expect much. Heck, I had to show him where the deer were hanging out, and clear the area around his stand so he could see the critters. He wanted to hunt over the corn feeder, to take an easy doe, and I let him once, sitting on the gorund on a bucket. He had one fat doe emerge from the woods within about 10 feet, and he scared her so much that she balled for 200 yards and deer quit coming to the feeder during day. He just laughed about it.

Doesn't that seem typical of the 223 Aficionado?

KB

Kowblowey--It's not a matter of being cheap to not buy PREMIUM ammo. It is a matter of being experienced and knowing standard variety cup and cores work. I don't buy premium gasoline either. My big V-8 pickup runs great on regular and buying premium in that situation would be a waste. Your guns have uppers and lowers--do you attach the scope with Poligrip?

Tell us some more amusing stories of your uneventful season, and failure to use any of those bulk purchase CHEAP 223 stash.

I suppose your failure to shoot as least sustained your 110% success rate.

KB

TCLouis, they are the 64 grainers that look almost like a Bear Claw. I have tried long and hard to get the 60 grain partitions to shoot with no luck. I got lucky and got 2 boxes of the bondeds for the price of one and gave them a try. with 2 different powders they shot great and better. The wound channels were impressive and similar to those previously observed from 243, 257, 264, and 277 diameter bullets. They seemed to be more destructive between the entrance and exit holes than either the 53 or 62 grain TSX, but the results have all been the same.

Hey Kabluey when you were showing your cousin where to hunt were you on your golf cart? Gotta be careful that he doesn't shoot one in too rugged a terrain for the golf cart. If he should do that you can't give a finishing shot if needed. BTW your buddy that sights in your gun and tells you when it is not sighted in is back in Alaska. Do you know someone in Ga that sights em in for you?

KB,

You get on carpetman for pimping the 223 but you pimp that Grendel every chance you get.

The Grendel is a great cartridge, worth pimping. The 223 is greatly over rated.

The more I use the 6.5 Grendel, the more I like it. My buddy in Texas bought one of my AR15 treasures chambered in the Grendel, and this year that's all he hunted with for deer and hogs. He used a 270 for elk. He talked about it a few days ago over the phone, and said it was his truck gun and all-around tool. Not just its effectiveness, but its accuracy too are what he is excited about. His opinion, based on experience, mirrors mine. He's shot two deer and two hogs and several coyotes that I know of. One coyote was over 400 yds and he said his hold-over was estimated over two feet. Another surprising thing is the Hornady ammo, which is what we both use - the 123gr SST. It is so accurate that I have never shot any ammo more accurate, handloads or factory. It makes a decent size hole and pass-through. Neither of us has had to rely on a blood trail, even though there is one sufficient, because whatever we shot died real quickly.

I have one AR15 with a 20" barrel and another in 16", the latter of which is real light quick and handy.

Anyway, thanks for the opportunity to talk highly of the Grendel without seeming to pimp.

BTW, the Hornady ammo is inexpensive, not cheap, and readily available. The recoil and blast are very mild, and IMO a ten shot magazine is more than enough, and still not awkward to handle. The five shot, to be legal in some states, is readily available.

KB

Yeah YOU need a 10 shot magazine. For me with a .223 single shot is ample.

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman1:
I had not been out this season and a couple days after Christmas my grandson asked if I wanted to go. Bought my license and got my gear ready. I violated my rule of if it aint broke--don't fix it. I took the sling off my .243 (which is all I have used for several years) and put it on my .223. I figured all the .223 threads I have been involved on, I better use a .223. And if I got one, I could stir the pot. Didn't see a thing. Didn't have to make the decision of do I really want to do this? No deer to gut out. Got home and no deer to skin. Next day, no deer to butcher. No blood to clean off my garage floor. No blood to clean out of my pickup. A great hunt and the .223 did REALLY GREAT. Maybe the deer have been reading here and knew not to show up when I had a .223.

Seems to me that you didn't need any of that varmint ammo you use, or at least you didn't need to load the rifle, or perhaps carry one at all.

I suggest that sometime this spring you take your ass and a camera into the woods and take photos of the squirrels fucking and report back. That's probably more your type and speed of outdoor activity.

KB

KB--I can understand your wanting the squirrel pictures to feed your perverted appetite. I can imagine you getting your own pictures would be difficult as the terrain would be too rough for golf carts. You are correct--didn't see any deer that day so there was no need to carry a rifle. Had I not been carrying the .223, who knows, they might have shown up in abundance.

Well I went to my nephews ranch in texas and shot two whitetail bucks and 7 big hogs with my Rem 600 in .222 Rem with 60 gr. Hornady HPs..guess all of them thought I was using a 223 and it scared them to death...

Shot some more hogs with my 6x45 and 75 gr. GS customs HPs..all but two of the animals had exit holes about the size of a nickle.

All animals were shot at under a 150 yards from a blind or walking the brush line in senderos.

He certainly has a hog problem, they shoot them daily and have trappers working them constantly, seems the problem gets worse every year down there.

Ray Atkinson--Some of the deer I have posted about were shot by my great nephew and my grandson using a Remington 600 in .222. They were using either Remington or Winchester bulk packed 55 grainers. I have used both brands and can't tell any difference in the two brands--put em in the right spot and you have a dead deer. I already had a Rem 600 in .222 and traded for a second one. I knew when I traded I'd give the 2nd one to my grandson. I had also given him a Win 88 in .308 and he alternates between the two but is partial to the 88, not that the .308 performs any better, he just likes the rifle. Dead is dead with either one. There are no hogs on my sons in law ranch but they are getting closer.

I sure wish KB and Carpetman would announce the date of their wedding. I have known normal folks that have been married for 50 years that ain't in love with each other as much as you two are.

That's so strange that it is a bit funny. I do enjoy teasing with him. When the other segments of the forum get a bit boring, carpetman is generally somewhere to be found, and go another round exchanging insults. He's kinda steady that way, sorta like a foot fungus.

KB

Yeah KB and I love playing horse. I'm the head and he is such a natural at his part.

quote:

Originally posted by Kabluewy:
The Grendel is a great cartridge, worth pimping.
KB

Grendel is a terrific round for AR 15 platform rifles.

Before I relinquished my bias against AR15s, I had a Ruger 77 MKII PPC action rebarreled in 6.5 Grendel and restocked with a sporter stock. I also replaced the trigger. It's very accurate too, and a sweet shooter. When I just want to use a bolt action, that's the one I go for nowadays.

KB

Atkinson---Ray that was a very smart move using the .222. You got deer. We, using the highly effective .223 did not get deer in some parts as the deer have wised up and know to not come around. Had you been using the highly effective .223, you probably would not have seen any deer. It wont take the deer long to realize they are no match for .222's with well placed bullets. When that happens, guess us real hunters will have to drop on down to .204 Rugers. Those wanting to bivouac them can use those Mattell Grendels. Spray and pray away.

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman1:
guess we will have to drop on down to .204 Rugers.

What about your motto of a true cheapskate: "if it ain't broken, don't fix it"?

You're too cheap to buy another special purpose rifle, and find a bulk sale of the cheap varmint bullets to go with it.

You're just blowing farts again.

KB

KB--You probably nailed it that I wont buy another as "If it aint broke don't fix it." I have eyed the CZ in .204 Ruger for a few years now. Couple reasons I haven't bought one. One is the backwards safety. The main reason is I can't justify getting one as I already have .22 centerfires that the .204 wouldn't really do anything not already being done. If it aint broke don't fix it. I was low on .22 bullets and didn't find any of the bulk packed I have been using. Bought a box of Sierra Gamekings, but haven't used them. Might be several years, if ever, before I need them. If I find some more bulk packed, I'll get them.

I wish CZ would chamber their 527 in 6.5 Grendel, and correct the safety.

A simple rebarrel of their 7.62x39 would work too, but like you I'm too cheap to do that mostly because the AR15 is a much better choice.

You should get off your wallet and buy an AR15 in 6.5 Grendel.

KB

I have sons in law and next month will gain a grandson in law that are big AR fans. I have not warmed up to AR's. To me they are ugly. I'll probably get one about the same time as I start listening to rap music. That label of "music" was put on it by someone else, not me. The 6.5 Grendel is probably a fine round, possibly another of those deals where it is a fine answer, but there really was no question. Probably the same could be said of the .204 Ruger, but I'd still like to have one.

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman1:
I have not warmed up to AR's. To me they are ugly. I'll probably get one about the same time as I start listening to rap music.

That's funny.

I used to feel the same way, and haven't completely gotten over it, which is the reason my AR15's are set up with the least stuff hanging off them.

I actually had to own one to start getting past my preconceptions. Shooting one belonging to a friend didn't do it for me, and he now makes fun of me for badmouthing the AR15.

In time, taking them to the range, and actually hunting and getting something, deer and hogs, has warmed them up for me a lot. I still don't like the lack of getting my cheek down on the stock. The main thing I thought in the past was that they were not good quality and sturdy built, and plastic and kinda hokey, and such. But I like almost all the features of them now, especially the interchangability of parts and uppers, etc., the modular aspect, and the availability of lots of parts from many sources.

The main thing about the AR15, when set up right with a free floating hand guard, is the inherent accuracy. And it will do it with a reasonably light and handy rifle.

I also have an AR10 in 308, Armalite carbine with free floating handguard, and together with it and the AR15 in Grendel, the combo pretty much covers anything I want to hunt.

Right now, my mission is to get a bunch of stuff listed on Gunbroker to sell, and many of my bolt actions are going. Don't want or need them anymore, in part because I like the ARs so much better.

For now I'm keeping a core lot of bolt actions, such as the Ruger in 6.5 Grendel, a 308 Ruger 77 MKII, and a FN in 30-06, and several CZ 550s in various calibers, but it's just because I can't yet stand to see them go, but I doubt they will see much use by me in the future. The Grendel for example makes bigger cartridges seem like excessive overkill. And if I want overkill, I've got the 308 AR10, a real blaster.

KB

Several years ago, my thoughts about .223 on deer was not favorable. I had the same thoughts many here, without experience express. Then I saw them used repeatedly and could compare the results with those of larger cals. It converted me. Could be like my thoughts about automatic transmissions many years ago. But after using them, I changed my opinion. For now, I have no interest in the AR style. I don't like "tactical" style knives either. Maybe I'm a caveman. I've only had a cell phone a couple of years.

I killed many deer on my dads ranch in Mexico feeding a fencing crew..I shot them with a Win. mod. 63 22. long rifle solids or with any ammo...Folks were just coming out of the Great Depression, and nobody had any money and we did what had to be done with what we had. 22s were cheap.
Those Mexican deer, both Mule deer and Whitetail were tame from not being hunted and two quick shots in the lungs or heart and a ride off and they layed down and died very quickly..if you shot then pushed them, they ran off and then you were in for a tracking job but those Mexicans could track better than Africas best, and they taught me how to hunt with a 22, as they had been doing that their whole life when and if ammo or guns were available and that was seldom. Adrenaline makes a difference on a hit deer, sometimes they didn't even quit eating if you just slipped away or stayed real still....Kept ranges to about 25 to 40 yards. Later as times changed and ranching prospered I got a 25-35 and later a 250-3000. But the lessons learned on that ranch in Mexico have stayed with me througout my life..Use what you have but use it properly and it will work. I have a friend who is a African PH and he has killed an elephant and a Lion with his 44 magnum pistol when he was a park official in Kruger. It was all he had at the time and he waited until the last moment and killed the Lion off the front sight was his comment..The elephant was killed from a helicopter, shot thru the top of the head..His name is Hannes Swanapole, and he is a hunter.

There are hunters and there are shooters and there are thoes that can hunt and shoot and they are the most successful.