i know...i know....
got my cz 527 hornet on layaway......
now the guy tell's me how great the .222 is....
what you guys think ??
squirrel/varmits/paper/yotes...
this is driving me nuts....
buckweet

Hey buckweet, I messed with various 22Hornets for 35 years. This was prior to Hodgdon's Lil'Gun and all the new "light weight"(below 45gr) bullets.

The 22Hornets I had were very finicky. One day they would shoot fine and the next day using the same Loads with the same wind conditions the groups might increase 50%.

Back when the 18" 223Rem M7 came out in Blue & Wood, I was seriously tempted to swap for one. But, I kept hammering at Remington to make one in a 20" Stainless & Synthetic M7. When they FINALLY made it, I swapped for one sight unseen. I could not be happier.

If I want 22Hornet level Loads, I use a small amount of "2400" and the old 45gr Hornet bullets. I just watch the Pressure Ring Expansion(PRE) with regular old 0.0001" capable Micrometers and compare it to a Factory Load. When the PRE is the same, STOP adding Powder. And if I want the Velocity typical of a 223Rem, I can have that too with regular reloads.

Some serious advantages I've noticed are much greater case life, easier to find on the ground if ejected too briskly and absolutely top notch accuracy that does not change from day-to-day. And using the "2400", the cost difference between the two is about 1 cent/shot.

Obviously the same benefits could be derived from the 222Rem.

[ 11-30-2003, 17:23: Message edited by: Hot Core ]

I've been using a CZ 527 chambered in .222 this season for squirrels and coyotes and such. I couldn't be happier. The version I purchased is the full-stocked Lux with 20.5" barrel. It shoots well despite the full length stock and muzzle cap. 20 grains of IMR 4198 gets me around 3050 fps with a 50 grain Hornady soft point. A reduced load with H4895 and the same bullet gives Hornet performance with better case life and pretty good accuracy.

hotcore.. lil gun is THE powder to use ???
im still not positive on wich to get, the .222 is an awfull good cartridge,but the hornet is a classic. but this new powder makes all the differance ???
how does a .222 react with lil'l gun powder ??
wish i could just buy both !!!!
thanks for your thoughts.
buckweet

dougw1969
with the reduced loads in the .222 accuracy ??still up there...???
case life is very good.hummm ???
dang... still in same boat !!!
buckweet

Get em both, "So many rifles, so little time!" As the good Colonel stated "The only interesting rifle is an accurate rifle". Clearly this means every accurate rifle is interesting therefore "DESIRABLE". Just like potatoe chips, ya can't do just one. Don't drive yerself crazy, there is no bad choice here, the're both great calibers and which ever one you get your gonna love. My gopher smucking buddy has a triple duce, (I don't but I will someday, too much .223 stuff now) when he's shooting it and I'm shooting a Hornet the gophers don't know the difference. As to accuracy, the .222 does have a better reputation(well deserved) however my Anschutz Hornet shots in the .2's and .3's (no bull) so how accurate do ya need it? Hornets way cheap to shoot, again you can't go wrong here. Two classics.---Shoot Safe---montdoug

I'd get the .222 Rem. They really do have a stellar reputation for accuracy (which is just about the opposite of the Hornet which seems to be much fussier).

My .222 shoots great, and the Hornet level velocity loads are about equally good. My real reduced loads (22 rimfire levels) are less accuracte, but still are about 1 MOA.

You can load a bigger cartridge down, but you can't load a small one up...

Another advantage is that you can make .222 Rem brass from the common and cheap .223 brass which you can often pick up for nothing.

Having said all this, I'd still favour getting both as suggested above!

jpb

jpb ??? really ??? you can make .222 brass outta .223 brass ???
i did not know that
ok,then i'm athinkin,i'll git the .222 1st
next year get the hornet,
[besides i've got a super 14 hornet barrel on the way][contender]
should be here monday
buckweet
thanks for all the help

Buckweet,
You are kidding aren't you? For paper, varmints or whatever you choose to do the .222 is so far superior to the 22 Hornet that they shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence. I couldn't word this any other way so I had to mention them together. Jim

Jim White:
lol !!! i hear ya buddy !!!
its ok..i just called n' changed my order..
cz 527 .222 is on its way.
there.its done.
whew !!! also did not know ??? cz does not make a varmiter in .222 why ???
any more thoughts on the .222 ???
thanx.
buckweet

has anyone here reloaded for the .222 rem useing .223 brass ???
buckweet

Ah, but know CZ makes the 527 in the 221 Fireball! Now another choice for ya, and LilGun or AA1680 makes the Fireball scream, especially with the various 40gr bullets. 3500fps+ is real, not theoretical. All this on 17-19gr of powder. Noise level is certainly less than my 223, but slightly more than my Hornet. I have shot/reloaded Hornets for 20+ years, and they can be challenging. Fireball, 222, or 223's typically are not.
I'm glad all the choices are there, so we can all have our "favorite".

ok,,,
just ordered a luepold vari-x 3 scope for the cz .222
die's ???
hornady,rcbs,lee ???
thoughts on dies ??
hummm....
i like hornady..
but thats me...
buckweet

muelrider...
wow !!! a .221 fireball run's 3500 fps ????
that i dids not know.....
now im ''not'' going to change my mind again...but am going to just have to study out this lil gun powder..with this hornet barrel thats coming,and also try it in my brothers .22 hornet ruger77/22
dang,so many differant cases , same caliber,differant performance,
looking forward to having fun !!!
buckweet p.s. ???? im not going to change my mind ....right ???

[ 12-01-2003, 01:08: Message edited by: buckweet ]

Buckwheat - I think you'll be glad you changed to the 222. The Hornet is indeed a classic and a loveable little cartridge.....but it's not a 222 by any stretch although you could get fairly close with the K Hornet.

Still the 222 seems to just have an inherent accuracy advantage few cartridges can match and it's a lot less picky about what it shoots. Plus with a RCBS file trim die you can even make your own cases easily from 223 brass.

Good move.

I agree that the 222 is the better of the two for overall versatility and accuracy. Lapua Brass and H-322 or Vithavoiri N133 for powders. Federal 205M primers. Redding competition Dies. Bullets up to 53 Grains seem to work the best in standsrd twist rifles. Bart's and Fowler's 52 grain bullets are exceptional in all my .224 guns. For "Factory bullets" Sierra 52 or 53 grain Flat based; Have not tried the new Nosler competition 22 bullets so can't say about them.

OTAY!

hey !!! thanks !!! for all the info !!! im going to stop by cabelas in kck sometime this week,n' try to get some redding dies...if they not in stock.i'll order them.
really looking forward to loading for this caliber,
n' try to putt a littel meat in the pot !!!
did i read somewhere ??? that an indian girl up by north pole shot a polar bear with a .222 ??

.buckweet

The story I heard is a Inuit woman was in her cabin during a storm at the beggining of winter. She heard a grizzly tearing at the meat shed in back. She knew if the bear ate all her winter meat she'd starve to death any way, so she took a single shot Stevens .22 long rifle, snuck around the edge of the shed stuffed it in the bears ear and killed him. Story says the bears world class. If it ain't true it oughta be cause I been hearing it since I was young and I've proudly attained old fart status! It's the story guys always pull out when they are trying to convince themselve and you that a little caliber they shouldn't be using for a animal is big enough to do the trick .---Shoot Safe---

buckweet:
I have had 5 .22 Hornets since the 70's, most were single shots. All shot good with the reduce load of 7.3 grains if IMR 4227. My current load is 9.7 gr of 2400.
The .222 Remmington is a very accurate "TARGET" rifle, with a 52 or 53 grain bullet. You will have to look the velocities up in your reloading manual[S]. The old standard loads are:
19.0 grains of 4198
22.5 grains of BLC-2
I have an Ruger Ultra-Lite that would not group until I reduced my load from 3200 fps down to the Hornet velocity of 2600.

I have shot both quit a bit, but the Hornet isn't in the class with the .222 Rem....The .222 its a classic....

My 222 is the most accurate gun I have owned along with my 6x45, they both cut a round hole in the paper at about 1/4 inch consistantly...

I have used my 222 for varmints including many coyotes and on our local rock chuck population...

I have shot many deer with it and the 60 gr. Hornady both soft and HP version...All my children and grandchildren killed their first two or three deer with this combo. Never lost one yet...

I have yet to own a 223 or 22-250 that satisfied me to trade off the 222...

The hornets all went down the road, they just didn;t have what I wanted in the accuracy dept or in the killing power I wanted...The improved Hornets were nice, but the .222 would do anything they would plus a bunch more.....