Anyone know what kind of juice you can get out of this little cartridge ?

The idea of getting well in excess of 3000 fps with a pinch of powder sounds like alotta fun.....

[ 04-10-2003, 20:23: Message edited by: sdgunslinger ]

3000 fps?? I've had five 17 Ackley Hornets of various persuasions. The performance is ridiculously out of proportion to it's size and powder appetite. How about 3800+ fps with a 20 grain V-Max? Easily done in all my rifles with at least a couple different powders. It's the most fun you can have with your clothes on!

Dan C

Dan, I was guessing 3500-3600 . That's why I said "well in excess of 3000".

3800 sounds dang good , and FUN alright.....

[ 04-11-2003, 05:45: Message edited by: sdgunslinger ]

I should have read your post closer. Seriously, once you shoot one you'll wish you'd done it long ago. The Berger 15 grain can be run out at close to 4300 fps in a 24" tube for a close range starling vaporizer, and 25's will do 35-3600. But the 20 grain is a perfect weight for this case. The little V-max has a BC equal to most 25's, making it the long range bullet of choice provided your rifle likes it. My second choice is the Berger 20 grain match.

Dan C

Dan---------which action did you use to build your .17 Hornets on ??

Dan C---I have a .17 Mach IV that I'm just getting to know as well as a .17 HMR in a CZ that was love at first sight. I hooked into small caliber news about a year back and promptly got all the back issues. The caliber that's keeping me awake nights now is the .17 Ackley Hornet. Good reading what you think of yours. I'll probably end up with a Cooper as their just down the road , and the two I have already shoot so well, at a price I can afford(sort of) . sdgunslinger---if you haven't tried a .17 you ought to.---Shoot Safe---montdoug

sdgunslinger, I have had 17 AH's on the Ruger 77 Hornet action, the CZ 527, and 3 different Coopers. The Ruger was a case-stretching machine due to it's mid-locking action. Just too springy for good case life with upper end loads. The CZ is fine, but the feeding is balky if that matters to you. The Cooper 38 action is as cute as a button, stiff and accurate. Tough to beat that one and that is what I currently shoot. They have fat chambers but that's of no consequence as long as you neck size only.

montdoug, the 17 AH is a 'must have' for me from now on. And if you already have Coopers you know how addicting they are. Small Caliber News will end up costing you some money buddy. And all the back issues? I feel for you!! That was my mug in the "17 Predator" article a couple issues back, to say I'm a 17 caliber fan is an understatement. I use them almost exclusively on prairie dogs and coyotes here in WY with a couple 19's and 20's thrown in. I went up to Havre and shot gophers with your neighbor James Calhoon last summer, had a good time.

Dan Clements aka Dan C

OK guys.....I think I'm getting the Small Seventeen fever .

A couple of questions......Do you find the form dies a neccesity , or could you get by with using your full length sizer ? How about a Redding bushing neck die with an intermediate size bushing to neck down with ? Do you have to turn the necks on these small cases ?

Also , maybe thinking of the Mach IV . There would be alot more choices for actions to build on . And maybe single stack magazines like the Tikka or 788 Remington would feed the short cartridges . Which case would be easiest to form , Mach IV or Hornet ?

Also , in your experience , do these smaller seventeens have enough poop to take yotes out to a couple hundred yards or so ?

[ 04-14-2003, 19:59: Message edited by: sdgunslinger ]

Dan C ---I looked up your article, What did all those coyotes do to you? No matter, didn't look like they were going to do it to anybody else either after you were done. Your absolutely right Coopers and small calibers are an affliction. 1st Cooper was a K Hornet, shoots in the .2's and .3's . (so much for Hornets being in-accurate). .17's had been on my mind for along time when I had the good fortune ( "I think" )of talking to Todd Kindler on the phone. I guess I'd been teetering on the brink, cause imediately after hanging up with Todd I called and ordered a Montana Varminter in .17 Mach IV. Much like the magazine, if you talk to Todd much you'll be reaching for your wallet. I'm about to hocus pocus a couple of my big boomers into a .17 Ackley Hornet and a Tactical .20 (THANKS AGAIN TODD!!!) Oh well I'm hooked, I might as well enjoy it.

Hows case forming for the .17 Ackley compared to the Mach IV ? Mach IV's a piece of cake, ( you do need form dies for it ) "Great article by the way!!!"

sdgunslinger if you need some help deciding whether or not you need a .17 , might I suggest reading a few issues of " Small Caliber News " not a magazine for those of us that are willpower challenged! Lotta fun though.---Shoot Safe---montdoug

I'm still kicking my own butt for not buying a MachIV that I had a chance to buy this winter for 550.00 including the forming dies and 100 rounds of loaded ammo!!! Where is the checkbook when you need it?!! This Ackley Hornet deal may get some serious thought!! Those are some pretty serious numbers from a very cheap to load for case!!! Montdoug, I'm still sitting here imagining hndreds of gophers getting an airmail invitation home courtesy of the 17HMR!!!! GHD

Montdoug and sdgunslinger......I normally prefer not to take shortcuts when forming cases. With the Mach IV, I use both the form die and trim die before finishing with the FL die. Having said that, there are many people who simply use the FL die in one fell swoop when making 17 Ackley Hornet cases. Didn't work for me but the full complement of dies is not needed either. Just get the form die and finish with the FL die. Some folks use the seater for the initial forming step with good results- it may be worth a try.

Standard neck diameter for the 17 AH is .195" and loaded rounds will run around .193", a happy situation. I tested some neck turned cases one time and could see no accuracy advantage so discontinued the practice. Standard neck dia. for the Mach IV is .202" and again requires no neck turning. But with the quality of Remington Fireball brass being what it is, I prefer having a chamber cut with a .197" neck and then turning the necks for about .002" total clearance.

Those coyotes were just dumb, unlucky, or both!! I got 'em all in about an hour and a half, never do that again!

Dan C

Some powder manufacturer's data (ADI or Mulwex, 'Handloader's Guide','3rd ed, Nov 2000):
25gn, AR2205 10gn, 3,100ft/sec
25gn, AR2207 11gn, 3,100ft/sec

max charge weights.
According to the text:
2205 is approx equiv to IMR4227
2207 is approx equiv to IMR4198