I have been thinking about building a new AR-15 style varmint gun. I just can't decide on what caliber I want. it is a toss up between a 223/5.56 or a 6 PPC. Any one have any experence with the 6 PPC and varmint hunting. I looked at a 204, but I perfer a heavier bullet. My main hunting will be is for wolfs, coyotes, fox, and lynx. I'm looking for a fur friendly round and my 22-250 can do a lot of damage if the animal is to close. Thanks any info would be great

woodelf, I think a 24" 8 twist 223 with 75 -82gr bullets would be good out to 200 yards and still be fur friendly. Plus i think the component will be more readily availible than the 6ppc. have you thought about a 6x45 [6MMx223] with a 10 or 8 twist? It has no feeding issues in and AR.

I am confused for a couple reasons. You want " fur friendly" and heavier bullet and larger bullet. Is that like wanting a high performance economical vehicle? A subject that gets beat to death here is using .22 cal on deer. I have experience on that and .22's will do the job, it's bullet placement that counts. I think the .204 would do the job and would be your best choice. I have zero experience on how it would rate out on being fur friendly but I'd guess way ahead of a 6MM.

Fur friendly and high velocity are pretty much mutually exclusive unless you can keep the bullet inside the animal. For that a lightly built, light weight bullet is needed. The 40-grain Nosler in the .223 is pretty much proven in this role on coyotes although nothing is perfect - hit the shoulder joint and even this load will blow a hole in the near-side hide.

Wolves are another story as they are much bigger. I've taken two with a .300 Savage Contender but that has little relevance here. For an AR I'd much prefer a hunting bullet like the 60-grain Nosler Partition or the 64 Winchester out of the .223 - they should not be too bad on the fur. But really, the heck with any fur damage, I'd want to make sure I recovered these large tough animals.


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A .17 Rem. upper would be about perfect for everything but wolves. With the proper bullets, you have a tiny entrance hole and no exit wound.

If wolves are going to be hunted regularly, yes, you'll need a bigger bullet.

I think a 6x45 might be your best option; it hits harder than any .223 Rem., there are a lot of very good bullets available, and you can use the standard .223 magazines, too.

With appropriate bullets, you can use it on caribou, deer, and seals, if legal.

George

Probably not fur friendly, but I have three AR types in 6.5 Grendel. Accuracy of one with a 24" Shilen barrel is excellent, little dime sized groups off a bipod at 100 yards. The others are more tactical styled, not as good of a quality barrel and not as accurate.

The folks who developed the cartridge, Alexander Arms claim it is accurate out to 1200 yards ( probably not on varmits), the proper bullets remain supersonic out at that range.

Ammo is commercially available, although not common. I have purchased some of the cheaper Wolf stuff and it's ok for plinking. The best results have been using Lapua brass, which uses small rifle primers, and Lapua 123 gr bullets, both pricy but extremely hight quality. I also make my own brass by sizing down 7.62x39 brass, which uses large rifle primers, in a 6.5 Grendel die, loading and shooting to fireform the case. This is the first cartridge which I have ever done this with and am pleased, it works quite well, and loads used when fireforming are very accurate and pleasant to shoot.

I think cases could also be formed by necking up your 6mm PPC as they are all based on the same parent round.

I would consider a .223 or 5.56 shooting 60gr Nosler Partitions. They will shoot through a coyote the long way. 100gr Partitions out of a 6 ppc would be good wolf medicine, but they are rumored to have some feed issues.

the 6mm ppc is a really good round, that is until you calculate the cost of the brass in an autoloader. like george says try a 6x45. 223 brass is cheap, not a buck or 2 a round like ppc. 6x45 is easy to make cheap to shoot and hold the wind much better than 22's

6x45 sounds like the best. I have a 6TCU (6x45 Improved w/40deg. shoulder,same cap. as 6PPC) in a bolt action rifle but it don't feed well with that 40deg. shoulder. They have been useing 6x45 for 30yrs in Ar's and there is a ton of data out there now. You should only lose about 150fps with the 6x45 as to the 6PPC. A 1/12" barrel will only work with bullets up to 80grs. A 1/10" should go up to 100gr bulletss.

If you are worried about up close I'd stick with a .223 and < 50gr bullets. You want blow up with no exit to be fur friendly.

I've got 20 Tacticals, 223's 6X45's and 6 PPC for matches and varmints. The 6X45 would be my choice for your game targets.

The 6X45 with a heavy bullet puts down plenty of energy and the ability to handle 87 grain Hornady has really shown my 3 6X45's will shoot well.

The 20 Tactical is a ballistic twin to the 204 and I feel would be fine with proper the bullet selection. Not all the 20's blow up on impact.

The 223 is fine but I think can be bested by the 6 MM bore with little effort.

The 6 PPC is a neat round but a brass is only available from Silver State on a ready to run basis if I am not mistaken, I get mine there.

It does offer plenty of energy and if you are not afraid to experiment may well be the best of the 6 MM's out there. The brass is hell for stout and you might be surprised how well they can shoot.

Greg