quote:

Originally posted by wymple:

quote:

I don't think I could call the Savage rifle for sale here ugly, by any stretch..
I'd call it VERY good looking.


http://www.24hourcampfire.com/...2/page/3#Post2924732

Same as mine, except mine is in .243 and has a detachable box magazine.

Wymple,

I had never seen a Savage that good looking before I saw the one for sale. That stock is VERY well done. If your's is like that, you have a winner, and EVERONE know's that Savage's shoot well!!!! I've never heard of a Savage not shooting well. They're sure doing something right.

Don

It would help to compare apples to apples. 700 BDL to a M10 American Classic. 700 ADL to as std model 10 synthetic. If anyone thinks a 700 ADL is purdy you need your eyes examined! Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Compared to a Blaser, a 700 is kind of an UGLY duckling. You will always be able to find a rifle out there that will make what you have look kind of sad. I have more Remington's than Savage's, but for accuracy the only Remington that shot sub 1" out of the box was my lowly 788.

Function is more important than form, though I'm at a loss as to why modern Savage rifles are considered ugly (I'm talking wood/laminate stocks).
They shoot well & accurately, which is more than can be said for a couple of others I wont name.

The Savage 14 and 114 are VERY nice looking rifles too.

I am a relatively serious target shooter, and have built up a couple of Savages chambered in .260, with L/W target barrels and McMillan Tactical stocks. They are used primarily for 1000yd F Class shooting, and I like 'em lots. Unfortunately my winds skills need a bunch of improvement, but windy day scores in the 180's are typical for me. I seldom place very high, but that's not why I'm there. It's the journey that appeals to me most, more than the actual destination. I'm a fairly serious Savage fan.

Jar

Lads,

Won a Stevens Model 200 w/a Yugo brand scope at a Grouse banquet. It was a 308 and clad in tupperware. I checked prices on line and it just covered the evening's expenses for the wife and I.

Worked up some loads and headed for the back porch. After bore sighting, I shot some groups and was amazed...AMAZED, I tell you, at it's out of the box accuracy. No it doesn't have the accutrigger, but I'm getting used to factory triggers. Put a better scope on it and tagged a nice deer that fall. It was light, quick and came through a wet snowstorm with a quick wipe and oiling.

Last week a friend won a Stevens at a Duck's banquet. It was a 7/08 - he had no idea what to do with it so he sold it to me for $200. I have now spent over $300 to get it up and running (still waiting for the cases) and hope to shoot it soon. I'm expecting the same accuracy results.

The wife may use both Stevens for tomato stakes this year, and I'll just clean them up, re-sight and go hunting this fall. YES, they can multitask!!!

I think the greatest thing about this line of rifle is that you can get a new shooter into a good deer rifle, scope and ammo for $300-350. The long, fatal search for something better can come after we've hooked another hunter and gun owner!!

My endorsement is simple... I'd buy another!!!

Mike

I bought one because I did not have an UGLY gun ! Seriously though the floating bolt head the Accutrigger, headspacing with the barrel nut are all very clever ideas. Plus they tend to be accurate. Mine is in a Choate varmint stock. Double UGLY!! but it works .

regards,
JohnT

I own 4 sav 110 seris rifles they all shoot great with very little load devlopment. They well all turn in sub .5 inch groups at a 100 if I do my part. They are great varmint rifles I have had feeding trouble with them all.

I wouldn't use a 110 rifle for serious big game hunting I haven't found them to be relieibly enough for that.

When I go p dogging I carry spare a extractor ,spring and ball with me I have had them just fall off. That said I have kill thousands of varmints with them and a couple of deer.

Why do I use them I brought them cheap they are very accurate and it doesn't matter if they screw up on a p dog.

I brought a Savage /fox series B sXs back in 1975 because I didn't know better I could have brought a Nice Ithica for 50 dollars more. I shot heck out of it well in excess of 10000 rounds relaced the firepins in it twice. Killed hundreds of grouse, ducks ect with it. Now it has head space trouble and I don't shoot it anymore and just haven't gotten around to haveing it fixed. It served it purpose.

I have a 99 300 sav that I have killed dozens of deer with. It is one of the best handling running deer guns I shoot. My hunting partners think I never miss with it. Well we'll let them belive that. I haven't missed offen with it.

I read the 1st post, That was enough. I bought a Savage 110 in 7mm Rem Mag Sierra light 12+ years ago, pre accu trigger. 400 yards is no issue. I paid 295.00 w/ Wood stock and piler bedded. Love it!

Hey vapodog,

You better watch your mouth here on the Forum, according to HOT CORE!

I, in my last thread about seating depth being a constant, sent HC a PM. In his reply he said that my foul language (I said my poorly seated loads "shot like shit", and I probably had a "hell" in there somewhere) was an indication of my "Scummy Charactor" (his spelling, not mine).

I just want to warn you of this in case you are unaware. He says I could get thrown off the Forums for using this kind of language!

I'm not sure about the etiquette of PM's but anything I send to anyone is fair to be seen by everyone in my book.

I have a Savage in 17 HMR. It's ugly but shoots well. I hope I don't have the problems others here have noted...............

I've shot with a gentleman at the NRA Whittington Center Sporting Rifle Match who shoots a Savage in 6.5-284 and he is tickled to death; shoots it well too.

quote:

Originally posted by rcamuglia:
Hey vapodog,

You better watch your mouth here on the Forum, according to HOT CORE!

Hey HOT CORE....behave yourself.

There.....does that fix it?

Just a bit of clarification.....if one is using some profanity and is used in the same sentence as liberals and Savage rifles, then it's justifiable!

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
...Hey HOT CORE....behave yourself...

I try to(occasionally).

Lads,

Picked up a second Stevens (well... a Savage w/out the accutrigger). This in 7mm/08.

Interesting story. A friend won the gun at a Ducks banquet and ended up selling it to me for $200nib (note: I always keep a small tube of KY for just such opportunities ). Found some old "theater tickets" (you know, the ones from the big rolls) and showed one to my wife claiming it was the winning ticket for the rifle!!!

Ordered all the necessities for reloading and will let you know how it turns out.

Now, let's discuss aesthetics. And by analogy, I will cite the existence of my 1996 Chevy half-ton 4x4 w/a V-8
1. It's original green has faided to roughly the color of the stocks on the Stevens'. Its ugly.
2. It starts every time
3. It plows snow all 6 months of our winter
4. It gets me into the woods
5. It gets me out of the woods
6. It hauls firewood
7. It pulls stumps
8. Did I mention it starts every time
9. Did I mention it is ugly???

If I had a gun rack for the back window, it would have a couple of Stevens' in it.

Mike

I bought a Savage 110 (pre accutrigger) with a hardwood stock and a cheap scope at a garage sale for $300 last year. Got a box of .300WSM in the deal and took it to the range. It would shoot factory 165gr ammo in 1" groups at 200 yds and under 1" at 100 yards. I considered it accurate enough but sold it because it was too ugly to look at. Not just the "hardwood" stock, but the non radiused edges, the wood to metal fit and the metal finish.....It seems that as soon as something fits, they quit no matter how rough it looks or how sharp the edges, this of course reduces the machine time and cost. I would probably pay a hundred dollars more for the same rifle with a better fit and finish.

Because they're like Tinker Toys. I have a Savage 11GL in 300 WSM that I just don't shoot enough so I decided to change it to a 22.250 that will get shot more.
Here's the gun this morning:


Here's the gun this afternoon:

I put a 26" tight neck (.250") 22.250 PacNor Supermatch heavy varmint barrel on it, changed the bolt head from magnum to .473", a Sharp Shooter Supply Stainless tactical bolt handle, EGW one piece base and a Choate Ultimate Varminter stock. I also have a Sharp Shooter Supply Competition trigger but I haven't decided whether to put it on yet because the trigger that came with the gun breaks at 2.5 Lbs and this gun is going to be used for varmint shooting in the field.

Here's a closer look at the action:


All this took me about 2 hours to do with a big hammer, a vise, some allen wrenches, barrel nut wrench, headspace guage, etc. It would have taken less time but I put the bolt together wrong.......twice!

I forgot to buy some rings for it so I have to wait for them to put the scope on it.

quote:

I also have a Sharp Shooter Supply Competition trigger but I haven't decided whether to put it on yet because the trigger that came with the gun breaks at 2.5 Lbs

Hey Frank, You might need to buy another one for the Sharp Shooter Trigger.

Well Frank ugly or not the bolt is on the correct side of the action !.

I own two modern Savages 16 FLSS .308 Ditto in .223 They're not pretty but function well

and shoot for the most part sub MOA with hand loads . The .308 goes 1/2MOA more tomes than not !.

For those of you who don't know or care I shoot groups of # 15 shots for accuracy #3 5 round groups !.

I don't care for #3 shots or # 5 shots unless they do it repeatedly I don't consider that accurate !.

To me owning a rifle is much about pride of ownership; it's more than just a tool to me. A rifle is just as much about function as it is aesthetics. I have a couple hammers and could care less what brand they are or what they look like. Some view a rifle the same way - as a simple tool. For those folks, there is the Savage and its ilk. For the rest of us, there's Sauer, Blaser, Sako, Weatherby, etc. It's nothing more than personal preferences. Lou

I guess that I am different from Dr Lou. I have no safe queens.(Well actually I do but they belonged to Daddy and Grandpa so they don't count!)If I buy it, it will perform or I won't own it! As a matter of fact, a lot of what I may advertise for sale on this forum will perform with extravagancy or I wouldn't sell it on this forum.........it would be relegated to lesser venues of salable items.
SAVAGE was never known for beauty. The company was known for function and value. Why do they still button rifle barrels? The couldn't afford one of them "beat the hell out of a piece of metal" hammer forging machines that the rest of the American gun makers had to have and due to volume of sales could afford.(only takes about 45 seconds for a barrel to be hammer forged)..........my time may be off here a bit but not by much. But Savage does some other things to!! They deliver a rifle that is FREE-FLOATED...............single most accuracy enhancing improvement mechanical change ever thought of. But also they Pillar Bed the stocks! Any form of bedding(Pillars or Glass bedding of action) is an improvement over "inletting and dropping the action in" which is what you get with almost any of the othermajor gunmakers! And then you have the "Accutrigger"(not on the Stevens 200's)on all Savage rifles now!! And EVERY OTHER MAJOR MANUFACTURER is advertising some improved trigger..............and for the most part they are BS'ing the public!! But they know that SAVAGE did it right!! They know that they are trying to play catch-up. For the money, the Savages(Stevens) for out of the box accuracy won't be beat! If they do get beat, it's by the TIKKA's...........knockoff of SAKO's! The one and ONLY gun manufacturer who got the machining right before it left the factory!! When you send your Remington or Winchester to the smith for the rebarrel job and action squaring, he will have work to do! If you send him a SAKO it was done before you owned it! Just my thoughts! I like accuracy! I can take ugly if the accuracy is there. I don't own 32 safes to keep the safe-queens in. If I own it, it gets shot! But then, I'm not a doctor! GHD.......pastor at the church of GHD and the 25-06

GHD, like you I don't have any safe queens. I only buy rifles I will use, but at the same time I must be happy and confident with what I am packing. I don't get that same warm and fuzzy feeling with the Savage, Ruger, Remington, or their ilk. I do like the M70 with the classic action, however.

I like and appreciate the precision machining and fine craftsmanship that Sauer, Sako(old), Steyr and other European makers put into their production rifles - no CZs. IMO, they fall into the same category as Savage.

I agree with everything that you said, but for the same reason I don't like spinach, I don't like Savages, CZs, etc. It's simply just because they don't meet my taste standards. It's nothing more complicated or deeper than that.

GHD, it's ok. You don't have to possess a Ph.D to have good taste Lou

hey guys!!!!!!!It all boils down to two items and they are--do you like accuracy or do you like ugly, nothing else. Savage =accurate and ugly---winc. =no accuracy and ugly.

quote:

Originally posted by groundhog devastation:
..The one and ONLY gun manufacturer who got the machining right before it left the factory!! When you send your Remington or Winchester to the smith for the rebarrel job and action squaring, he will have work to do! If you send him a SAKO it was done before you owned it! ...

Hey GHD, Are you talking about carrying the sako-scrap pieces in "after" they explode? Nothing like having the sako-scrap Top Management try to "cover-up" exploding rifles, rather than WARN and RECALL, to endure them to me.
-----

Just reread the thread and a whole lot of folks enjoy being able to say "it looks ugly, but...". Seems like a good bit of smug pride in being able to say that.

No different than the folks who choose a mud covered 4x4 over a 2-seat ragtop(your choice of manufacture). It looks ugly, but...

Back in 1976, I took an old 722 Remington action, screwed a 28" Douglas air guage supreme straight taper barrel on it, chambered in 6x47 and competed in a few BR matches while I was a student at VA TECH. I won!! The old action and barrel rested in the ORIGINAL 722 stock that had been opened up to accept the BIG BARREL. It was not aesthetically pleasing to the eyes of some. To me it was beautiful! IT WOULD SHOOT!! It outshot Shilen DGA's(they were new then), Remington 40X's and a lot of whatevers! It weighed 14.5 lbs with it's 6-18 Redfield scope and I carried it countless miles across the countryside shooting vermin and also taking it to matches. And then when it won it seemed to make the other competitors mad! I had after all the trading and reconfiguring, about $90.00 out of pocket in the rifle! And those guys had whatever in their glorious rifles! I WON!! UGLY as it was I WON!!
When I sit down at a bench and test a rifle or carry a rifle afield I look for accuracy first. It could be the most beautiful piece of craftsmanship, wood, bluing,fit and finish as has ever come forth..............if it doesn't shoot up to my expectations............it is labeled as as a failure! A 6mm Remington BDL with wood that looked like it came from the roots of a walnut tree, absolutely with figure that most stockmakers would charge exhorbitant prices for, bluing that rivaled custom shop stuff, fit was done with almost custom shop expertise..................wouldn't shoot 2 days in a row the same comes to mind. Beautiful + won't shoot = someone else can own it!
As far as SAKO's go, the failure of them in only one caliber I'm aware of was due to bad metal in the barrels. As far as I'm aware of also, they (Sako) admitted their failure. I sell them all and have had good experiences with most and bad experiences on a much more frequent basis with others and if I, GHD, was going to buy a rifle tomorrow for myself, it would be a SAKO, TIKKA or SAVAGE if I wanted it to perform "out of the box".
"Smug pride"..........BTDT!! Wanta shoot rifle for rifle?(same as the old days when people raced cars title for title)What I drag out to the bench may be ugly(in your eyes) but it will damn sure get the job done if you're wanting to shoot "screamers"!!(groups that start with ".0" for those of you in RioLinda!!) ".1's" are the norm for it even if you've never fired it! 20" 40X barrel chambered in .222MAG. Bring your pretty ones on Hot Core! And then after that little demonstration, I'll bring out the VLP .204!! Strictly factory. Strictly nothing else done to it other than 3000 rounds down the bore and it will do in the .2's! Wanta shoot something bigger? We can do that. 6mm's(I've got a light barreled 6x47 that can probably handle whatever you bring!)and a 6mm Remington that is semi-bautiful but accurate! .257's..............GHD and the "church of GHD and 25-06". .264's..........a pretty good ol' .260 Remington will suffice here!(it's semi beautiful also with a little bit of reworking of the metal) Anything bigger than these is overkill!!
And with the 6's. 25's and .264's we'll start the competition at 300 yards!! Groundhog hunting starts at 400 yards! GHD

quote:

Originally posted by groundhog devastation:
...groups that start with ".0" for those of you in RioLinda!!) ".1's" are the norm for it even if you've never fired it! 20" 40X barrel chambered in .222MAG. Bring your pretty ones on Hot Core! ...

Hey GHD, I don't believe I currently own any "pretty" rifles. Had one "pretty" original Kimber 22Rimfire a long time ago. Couldn't enjoy it because I was concerned about having it "outside" - might get bumped, blue boogered, sweat, etc. Finally swapped it off for a couple of usable rifles.

I know for sure there are currently none in my Safe that will shoot 0.0"s or 0.1"s with me doing the Trigger Yankin.

That is some fine accuracy you are talking about - almost believable. Are you measuring in feet instead of inches with them sako-scraps?

There are a couple more people on the Board that mention sako-scrap accuracy being quite good. I always figured it was due to cheap liquor.

Best of luck Blasting the Ground Hogs this year.

quote:

that will shoot 0.0"s or 0.1"s

This reminds me of fishing.

I always measure my fish instead of weighing them.....many will be three inches to six inches.....but then I always measure them "between the eyes" and not the entire length!

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
I always measure my fish instead of weighing them.....many will be three inches to six inches.....but then I always measure them "between the eyes" and not the entire length!

Are you talking about the eye of one fish at the top of the stringer and the eye of a different fish located 5-6 other fish down the stringer???

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

quote:

that will shoot 0.0"s or 0.1"s

This reminds me of fishing.

I always measure my fish instead of weighing them.....many will be three inches to six inches.....but then I always measure them "between the eyes" and not the entire length!

Waaahhhhh???? roger

My prairis Dog hunting buddy bought a varmint Savage .223 about 3 years ago. It didn't shoot 52 or 53 gr bullets much better than 1". We tried some 50 gr. Sierra's that I had on hand and groups immediately dropped to below 1/2". At that time it cost less than $400.00 brand new.Who cares what it looks like, it"s a shooter and a keeper.

Hot Core, I only have 1 Sako, but it is purdy and accurate, and older than I, an L-46 in .222. I would not call it scrap.

Nothing personal intended Moorepower - unless you are a member of sako management.

That had to be one of the scummiest, poorest handled situations that I've ever heard of in the Firearm Industry. sako was aware they had exploding firearms on the market and did NOTHING at all to alert the people who owned them, nor the public who was about to buy them.

I take it personal when companies "don't care" if they Kill me. As far as I know, there has been no reports that they were all axed. So if they were faced with the same situation on current production or in the future, my confidence in them doing the right thing is non-existant.

Hopefully it will never happen again. I do wish you continued good luck with your's.

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
This reminds me of fishing.

The internet reminds me of fishing:

The first liar doesn't stand a chance.

A friend just brought over a Savage 10 FP he horsetraded an AK and $100.00 for...

it has the plastic stock on it, and the accutrigger was replaced with an aftermarket one that breaks at 17 ounces...

boy this action and a batch of barrels is about all anyone would ever need..

I have a 12 BVSS and a Stand Alone Action I picked up, waiting for the 3 barrels I ordered for it...

This 10 FP he has is chambered in 308...

It looks plain but I sure was impressed...

quote:

Originally posted by Hot Core:
That had to be one of the scummiest, poorest handled situations that I've ever heard of in the Firearm Industry. sako was aware they had exploding firearms on the market and did NOTHING at all to alert the people who owned them, nor the public who was about to buy them.

I was under the impression it was Beretta (the importer) that was to blame here....

anyone else on this?????

We could go do a "Find" on the GunSmith Board and see what all transpired back then. Now that you mention it, Beretta might have "owned" sako-scrap-tika-tock back then. I have no problem tossing beretta in that pile of "who cares if our customers get Ka-Boomed" management too.

SOMEBODY in Management should have been doing the same kind of "ALERT" and "WARNING" full page ads we used to occasionally see in the Gun Rags. I could have this all wrong too, but I think the last one I saw was on some kind of Factory Ammo being a bit too hot. I don't see the Gun Rags as often as a lot of other folks though.

I am a Sako collector, but not a fan of the 75 or 85. However, how many actually went ka boom? Lou

No idea, but enough that we found out about here at AR. You can read all about it in the GunSmith Board. Just use the "Find" button at the top of the GunSmith Board. If you put in "sako Ka-Boom", that should find it.

Thanks, I'll do that. Did Savage ever change their firing pin/bolt to make it more user friendly for field stripping and servicing? I understand it used to be a pain. Lou

They certainly aren't the most attractive rifle and that Accu-Trigger only makes them uglier, but they shoot plenty fine and are at least as tough and as reliable as anything out there in my experience. The Stevens 200's are similar with rougher triggers and metal work, saw one in .223 practically out-of-the-box shoot a hair under 1 inch groups with cheap American Eagle FMJ. Handloads with Sierra Matchkings have gone half that. Not bad. Not pretty, but not bad!

Snowwolfe is correct--the only thing that counts is results.The savages that I have work as designed, they shoot where you look. Had my .300 RUM to the range yesterday and came away w/5 shots covered w/a dime at 100 yds. That will kill any animal in North America at that range and closer. Bar none.

True, Savages do work work, but so did the Yugo and Chevette...if that's what you chose to drive.