i was thinking about using this bullet in my 22-250 in front of 36.6 grs of winchester 748 for deer hunting.what is the general feeling about the 53gr tsx bullet for deer hunting?any help is apprec.

That is what the bullet was intended for.. not intended for varmints...

I would use it in a heartbeat if I kept my distance inside 200yds. Get the good angle and or shot placement.

There are and will be a lot of Deer lost to inadequate Calibers every year.

If a person can't handle an adequate Deer Cartridge, they should just buy meat at the grocery.

quote:

There are and will be a lot of Deer lost to inadequate Calibers every year. Roll Eyes

If a person can't handle an adequate Deer Cartridge, they should just buy meat at the grocery.

There are and will be a lot of Deer lost to adequate Calibers every year.

If you can't shoot straight enough to kill whitetail with a 22-250 shooting the best bullet modern technology has to offer then perhaps you should stick to killing paper.

quote:

Originally posted by Hot Core:
There are and will be a lot of Deer lost to inadequate Calibers every year.

If a person can't handle an adequate Deer Cartridge, they should just buy meat at the grocery.

I've seen deer shot with larger calibers and took awhile to track because of bad shot placement. And then, I've seen deer shot with 22-250, and I've shot several with this caliber also, that didn't go more than 30-yards because of perfect shot placement.

SHOT PLACEMENT is where its at....

No offense, 22 cals aren't designed for deer. I know there are a million people that have done it with one shot kills that anchored them like being struck with Thor's hammer, but those who have had spectacular bad shots rarely speak up and tell us of the late nights tracking game.

That being said, head shots with the 53 gr in 22-250 will take a deer within 75 yds with good regularity. I would look towards a 100 gr 6mm if I didn't have plenty of deer to choose from.

John

I have now taken 3 deer with .224 caliber centerfires. One was with a 22-250 shooting Remington factory ammo (a 55 grain bullet if I remember correctly) from 80 to 100 yards, another with a 22-250 shooting a Speer 70 grain Semi-Spitzer from 360 yards (dropped in its tracks) and another with a 222 Rem. also shooting the Speer bullets from 80 to 100 yards. As you might guess, I don't consider a 22-250 inadequate for deer, in fact, it's just about perfect.

As far as using a Barnes bullet, I would see no problem with it. I have tried them but got better accuracy with the Speer bullets so that's what I use.

I killed 7 fallow deer (culling) last week using the 62TSX in a 22-243.

It electrocuted them

Blair,
Do tell. I am using the 70gr TSX in a 22/6mm and would love to hear your results. Last Spring I killed 11 hogs using the 62gr TSX out of my AR in 5.56 and was shocked at the lethality of that little bullet. I worked up a 53gr load last week in my 223s for culling and hogs but have yet to put it on any game.

Perry

+1 to Krochus

+1 Hot Core

Deer are not hsrd to kill. The "losing" comes from poor shot placement. As a kid I heart lung shot every deer I killed all with factory 222s.

Perry

Hot Core--"a lot of deer lost to inadequate calibers every year." Is that the old use a magnum and you can hit em anywhere? Hit em wrong with a small cal and you have a problem. Hit em wrong with a mag and you have a problem. People use bows to kill deer--compare the energy of an arrow to that of a .22 cal.

sorry i didnt mean to start a war here! just making sure the 22 tsx bullet would expand and not blow up.thanks don

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ddhotbot:
sorry i didnt mean to start a war here! just making sure the 22 tsx bullet would expand and not blow up.thanks don[/QUOTE

Don't worry.. that debate has been burning long before you knew AR even existed...

all your question did was fan the flames a little.... it doesn't take much of a breeze to turn it into a roaring bonfire again...

actually this isn't a war, this is pretty tame... name calling and questioning one's family roots is usually more typical...

I hunt with my son in law and several of his friends as well as several of my friends. In the entire group only a couple of us reload. I don't know if that's the norm,but to me it seems to be. These guys use Remington,Federal,Winchester--mostly what ever Wally World carries and usualy whatever they have that is cheapest. They get deer too. So when the question of premium bullets comes up,why is it that a person that reloads and thusly probably shoots more needs a premium bullet? In .243 and .22 cals I have used the cheaper Winchester bulk packed with great results. Having said that,if the higher priced Barnes in the title of this thread will perform to the level of the cheaper bullets,have a sharp knife ready when you pull the trigger. A 22-250 with 55 grainer has more energy than a 30-30 with 150 grainer at 100 yards and leaves the 30-30 way behind thereafter. Not a knock on the 30-30 it has probably taken more deer inside 150 than anyother---(more Texans killed in pickup truck wrecks than Lambroghini crashes.)

I have shot a lot of deer and witnessed a lot of deer shot with the 222 and 60 gr. Hornady with perfect results over a 50 or so year period. Also used that bullet in the 223 and 22-250 but kept the velocity to 3000 FPS and under. I have also kept the range to 200 yards except on a few ocassions when I needed to take longer shots on wounded deer. Most shots have been under 100 yds.

I would not compare the hi vel calibers to the 30-30, for one thing the 30-30 will always leave a better blood trail..the .22's can be iffy on blood trails and for that reason you must place that bullet very carefully and not at an angle..The lighter hi vel calibers are also notorious for blowing up on the shoulder blade..

I didn't have much luck with Monolithic H.P.'s in the 22s, so I quit using them, but by the same token I have had exceptional luck with the old 75 gr. Barnes X in my 6x45 with a string of one shot kills on Whitetail, Mule deer and African plainsgame as long as your arm.

Ray have you used or seen the barnes 53gr trible x used on deer sized game?thanks don

ddhot...
I loaded some 53gr TSX running 3600fps in a 22-250 for a buddies wife and they took 2 160lb bucks with heart lung shots. The bucks went no more than 30yds and died. Both bullets went straight through at 100yds.

Perry

Also forgot to add that an elk was talken with the same load with a neck shot at about 100 yds

Perry

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman:
Hot Core--"a lot of deer lost to inadequate calibers every year." Is that the old use a magnum and you can hit em anywhere?

Hey Carpetman, I know, that you know, I did not say that. Never crossed my mind, because a poor placed shot from any rifle is bad news. Even more so when the Cartridge shouldn't be used on Game that size in the first place.

quote:

Hit em wrong with a small cal and you have a problem. Hit em wrong with a mag and you have a problem.

We are in agreement.

quote:

People use bows to kill deer--compare the energy of an arrow to that of a .22 cal.

I thought Arrows actually Killed due to creating quick, massive amounts of Blood Loss, or a fluke shot to the Spine. But..., you are no doubt correct that there is a "Minimum" amount of Energy required to drive the Arrow through the Deer. However, you have the advantage on me concerning Arrows. I only had a Bow for 2-years and never took a shot at Game with it.

Had I done so, I believe the 65# Martin Lynx would have had " Adequate Power " for the situation at the relatively close-up distance I was practicing. Isn't that completely different than using an inadequate Energy Level Varmint Cartridge on real Game?
-----

I do fully support using Varmint Cartridges on Varmint " Size " critters. But I sure don't understand trying to justify using them on Game they should not be used on. I really don't see an "argument" to it, just some folks getting bent out of shape because they know they are doing wrong and are being called on it.

We Kill Cattle and Horses all the time for the Dog Food Plants with regular old 22LR Rim Fires. That is not the same as a Deer though and is no justification for their use on Game that size - totally different.
-----

Is a Red Ryder's Recoil simply too much for some of you folks?

Here in Kansas the law is that you have to use a caliber larger than .23". I am very comfortable with that restriction. I know that there have been lots of deer taken with .22 caliber including 22lr but it seems to me that there are a lot more appropriate rifles and bullets out there.

Yes, bad placement with even a 45-70 will result in a wounded and lost animal, but one should use a caliber that allows at least a little margin for error.

Hot Core--Using an inadequate cal when hit wrong"even More so". To me that has connotations of larger cals having a larger kill zone. That you can make a bad shot and a larger cal is forgiving. I don't agree with that. If a cal regularly puts em down,I consider it adequate. We are talking .22 cal here and folks always saying a 6mm is not adequate. So my question is where do "adequate" cal begin. Heck lots of people don't consider a 30-06 as adequate---why else would there be so many .30 cal mags sold? You are correct a bow kills by causing hemorrhagging. My grandson hunted several years with a .243--killed a bunch of deer too. Then I gave him a .308 not that he needed a bigger cal,I just had one I thought he would like. He has shot it 8 times--2 times at a can--second shot was dead on so he used it hunting. 3rd shot an 8 pointer,4th shot a ten pointer that was down for the count but he neck shot it to put it out of misery. 6th shot was an 8 pointer,7th shot an axis deer and 8th shot a ferral hog. I truly believe his record would be every bit as good had he still been using the .243,or the .22 cals he used before the .243. They were all well hit,and I firmly believe that was a result of my not exposing him to too much recoil. I started him shooting at 7 and he took his first deer at 9. His first few were with .22 cals and then onto .243 and now .308. The .308 is a pre 64 Win mod 88. I also gave him a pair of WW2 Bausch & Lomb binoculars. He thinks it's pretty neat using all this real real old stuff.

quote:

Originally posted by perry:
Blair,
Do tell. I am using the 70gr TSX in a 22/6mm and would love to hear your results. Last Spring I killed 11 hogs using the 62gr TSX out of my AR in 5.56 and was shocked at the lethality of that little bullet. I worked up a 53gr load last week in my 223s for culling and hogs but have yet to put it on any game.

Perry

Perry,

I liked it so much, I'm thinking of building a 22-06 to shoot the 70 TSX and 80 Nosler CC

I load the 62 grainers behind Re-15 or N550 and it shoots beautifully.

All broadside shots exited, but quartering shots sometimes stayed in the body.......lost their petals, but the fallow were deader than hell.

Ranges varied from 100 yards or so to 380.

Cheers,

quote:

Originally posted by ddhotbot:
i was thinking about using this bullet in my 22-250 in front of 36.6 grs of winchester 748 for deer hunting.what is the general feeling about the 53gr tsx bullet for deer hunting?any help is apprec.

I've used that same bullet and caliber on smaller mule deer here in Idaho with good luck. The last one was at 345 yards lazered. My theory was that after shooting around 60-70 rockchucks at extended ranges that summer and about the same number of jackrabbits it was one of the more accurate rifles I had to hunt with. At one point I was going to shoot a mule buck in the head at around 290-320 because I had shot a lot of other critters at that distance that were about the same size as his head. I don't know how to say it any different other than dead is dead. One shot no traveling no movement just flat out dead. With an accurate rifle and a good rest along with lots of practice you should do well with that combo. Good Luck

Well, living in Missouri I see alot of hillbillies who use guns they shouldn't for deer. I have observed:
.204 Ruger is amazingly effective if shots are kept in the neck or head.
.223 Remington worked fine with heavier bullets and lung shots
22-250 worked fine with lung shots with 55 grain soft points, and with a V-Max to the forehead, the deer had scrambled brains

I bet a TSX out of 22-250 would work as good as anything if you place a shot well.

Just passing on what a friend told me long ago, about when the Barnes intro'd the 45 and 53x, I am almost 99+ % sure, he 'experimented with 53gr from a 22/250, shot a small buck or good size doe about 100 yds, purposefully aimed at the rear hip area, dropped the deer, left a good dollar sized exit or so, was stunned as he did not expect that deer to go straight down.

Me, I don't recommend what he did, not a humane thing, but he was convinced. Later shot another deer, very large buck and I honestly cannot recall anymore of how that turned out.

I would expect it to do well, spoken to many 22/250 owners who killed deer very dead using 55's of conventional type. I would feel fine using a 22/250 or 220 swift up to 200 to 250 yds, taking head, neck and lung broadside shots. With a TSX, I imagine it would drive stem to stern, how soon death would follow would be any guess, but if vitals hit, I would assume that little buzzsaw would do well.

I would ask barnes what feedback they are getting. They may have more to say than many here. I know you want 'non-biased' info, hopefully you would get a straight answer. As said above, shot placement will ultimately dictate quick kills.

A 70-75 grain, 224 caliber Accubond would be a nice addition to one's arsenal.

Come on Nosler

Given all the reports over the years I've seen of deer (and larger animals) being taken with .22's, I conclude they are able to make large enough wounds to kill a deer. The question is whether there is enough bullet mass to break a major bone if hit by accident, and if there is enough SD left in the expanded bullet to penetrate deeply enough from less favorable angles. In both cases, the all-copper bullets seem to be the best bet for these difficult situations. For what it's worth, the maker of the G.S. bullets is confident 40 gn is plenty for deer size game when using one of his all copper bullets, so long as fps starts above 3500 or so.

Me?, I think I'd still want at least 100 gn of bullet, say a 6mm of some sort, but I'll keep an open mind. When I get back to the US, I'll borrow a friend's .22-250 and play with it some in test media. The all copper bullets are a relatively new development, and one should be prepared to set aside old notions if the evidence warrants.

You don't say where you are located, but the first thing to check is whether a .22 is legal for deer in your jurisdiction. As at least one previous poster noted, some states impose caliber restrictions that would preclude your using a .22.

quote:

sorry i didnt mean to start a war here! just making sure the 22 tsx bullet would expand and not blow up.thanks don

Monometal bullets won't blow up in the traditional sense. However, X bullets can "shed their petals" if the impact velocity is high enough. I.e the nose will peel back and come off in 4 small parts. I don't think this is preferred, but it does create 4 secondary projectiles while the shank of the bullet drives on.

quote:

I liked it so much, I'm thinking of building a 22-06 to shoot the 70 TSX and 80 Nosler CC

Not nearly enough powder capacity! Try a .30-378 as the base cartridge. That should do it!!!

LWD

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman:
Hot Core--Using an inadequate cal when hit wrong"even More so". To me that has connotations of larger cals having a larger kill zone. That you can make a bad shot and a larger cal is forgiving. I don't agree with that. If a cal regularly puts em down,I consider it adequate. We are talking .22 cal here and folks always saying a 6mm is not adequate.

asdf did a fine job of describing just a few of the things that can go wrong with inadequate calibers. Once a person gets enough Kills with a 243Win, they will also understand what can go wrong with them, even on shots that should Kill quickly. One example is the size of the Exit being so small. It is a real problem when the Innards shift around and plug the Exits. It seems the Entrance Holes plug even more of the time, so a good dependable Exit is a serious advantage. This will become clear to people that make enough Kills.

quote:

So my question is where do "adequate" cal begin.

I was wondering if that would come up.

Bigger is better than small. Faster is better than slow. With Big and Fast the best of all for Killing.

The 308Win you gave your Grandson is w-a-y better than any of the other Calibers he had been using. His chances of recovering the Game are significantly enhanced with it.

quote:

Heck lots of people don't consider a 30-06 as adequate---why else would there be so many .30 cal mags sold?

I do agree that Faster is better. Plus it helps ensure "clean Kills" at distance due to the flatter trajectory, quicker flight and more retained energy. I don't consider the 30-06 as inadequate, but it is not as good as a 30Mag.

quote:

...I firmly believe that was a result of my not exposing him to too much recoil.

I can agree with that, but go with waiting until the youngsters are old enough to handle an adequate Cartridge.

Best of luck to your Grandson, his 308Win is certainly adequate for Deer.

There's also an article on using 22 centerfires for deer in the current issue of RifleShooter.

LWD

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by Hot Core:
Once a person gets enough Kills with a 243Win, they will also understand what can go wrong with them, even on shots that should Kill quickly. One example is the size of the Exit being so small. It is a real problem when the Innards shift around and plug the Exits. It seems the Entrance Holes plug even more of the time, so a good dependable Exit is a serious advantage. This will become clear to people that make enough Kills.
[QUOTE]

Hot Core - I've shot a few deer with 9.3, 30-06, 7x57, quite a lot with 6.5x55 and a really really large amount with 6mm rem and 243 with 85-90gr bullets.

For an average white tail taken at sane range, with sane shot angles the 243 is IMHO perfection. I would not use it out of choice on really really large white tails, mule deer or reds but I have shot a red with it and it worked exceedingly well.

IMHO blood trailing is about shot placement. You can shoot a deer high lung with a 30-06 and not get a speck of blood other than at the strike. The difference is that with the 243 you are probably going to see the bullet strike and the deer react to the shot - that means you know where it was hit and what it is likley to do.

http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/tm.aspx?m=1285210&mpage=1

My old link to the .224 TTH will not work, 22/6mm article used on deer. Amazing results with 75 grain amax using fast twist custom barrel.

Hot Core--Certainly not flaming with you and I'm enjoying the exchange. We agree and we disagree--hell that's good or we might have both married the same woman. Once a person gets enough kills with a .243,they will understand what can go wrong with them. What is enough? My son in law was not my son in law yet when we first started hunting together. He was still a teen-ager. He had a .243 and I switched to a .243 so that one or the other of us would have ammo. Throw in the truckload of deer my grandson also killed with .243 and there is plenty of experience there. We can kill 4 a year here. I did have one bad experience with the .243. I tried using cast bullets and results were horrible. I had a load with cast that was accurate and actually exceeded the velocity of my jacketed load. My grandson shot a spike that ran a few yards and stopped and it was then on my side. I took a shot and the deer took off never to be seen again and nary a drop of blood to be found. I cant believe either of us missed,I felt my shot should have been a good one. I've not seen wounds healing or sealing themself and very adequate exit hole. Maybe that happened with the cast? I don't know. I'll not experiment anymore with cast on deer in .243. I hear you on the bigger and faster and better---but dead is dead and if that was being obtained with smaller,don't see how it got improved. " A 30-06 is not as good as a magnum--the magnum ensures a clean kill at distance due to flatter trajectory,quicker flight and more retained energy. In my books if you need more distance than the 30-06 provides,you are shooting them way too far off. Don't ask me what range is reasonable--I don't have a definite answer. The 30-06 is going to shoot through and go a few more yards--for example if it shoots through and goes 50 more yards where the mags shoot through and goes 100 yards--so what? All said the mag is probably going to kill it 75 milliseconds sooner. If you need more than a 30-06,my take is you need a bigger cal not a faster .30. If you can haul your families groceries home in a pick up-- an 18 wheeler really isn't going to do a better job. "I can agree with that,but make him wait until he can handle an adequate cal."- My grandson was killing deer cleanly with what he was using--why make him wait? Still don't know what you consider adequate--not .22 cal,not 6mm--a 30-06 is adequate but a 30 mag better. Those Carolina deer wear Kevlar?

quote:

was thinking about using this bullet in my 22-250 in front of 36.6 grs of winchester 748 for deer hunting.what is the general feeling about the 53gr tsx bullet for deer hunting?any help is apprec.

You will have no problems as long as you do your part.

I have shot a bunch of deer the last few years with that particualr bullet and have yet to recover one.

All out of a 22-250 @ 3850fps. Shots have ranged from 40-400 yards and all angles.

sdhunter,what did the exit holes look like? was there good expansion?thanks don

ddhotbot---I have hijacked your thread and not answered your question as to what would happen if you used 53 grain Barnes tsx bullet for deer. well,for sure,all your future kids would be born naked.

quote:

Originally posted by LWD:
You don't say where you are located, but the first thing to check is whether a .22 is legal for deer in your jurisdiction. As at least one previous poster noted, some states impose caliber restrictions that would preclude your using a .22.

quote:

sorry i didnt mean to start a war here! just making sure the 22 tsx bullet would expand and not blow up.thanks don

Monometal bullets won't blow up in the traditional sense. However, X bullets can "shed their petals" if the impact velocity is high enough. I.e the nose will peel back and come off in 4 small parts. I don't think this is preferred, but it does create 4 secondary projectiles while the shank of the bullet drives on.

quote:

I liked it so much, I'm thinking of building a 22-06 to shoot the 70 TSX and 80 Nosler CC

Not nearly enough powder capacity! Try a .30-378 as the base cartridge. That should do it!!!

LWD

The old 22-06 is coming into it's own again with all the slower burning powders, that are available now.

My barrel maker, Robert Tobler has the reamer on order............

If it works out, the rifle might make it to Namibia as my "baboon" rifle........I have an invitation to knock off the baboons on two ranches