Sorry for all the questions lately...I know the obvious benefits of a heavy barrel on a target rifle (slower heat up times, better balance, less harmonics) but is there a real noticeable impact on accuracy? I'm still considering the .260 Rem but I can't find anyone who offers it in a factory rifle with a heavy target barrel.
If you have two identical rifles of the same caliber, one with a bull barrel and one standard; how much if any difference will you see in accuracy assuming the barrels are kept cool?

quote:

Originally posted by rowdyredneck:
If you have two identical rifles of the same caliber, one with a bull barrel and one standard; how much if any difference will you see in accuracy assuming the barrels are kept cool?

I have that in .223 and the difference in repeatabilty is substantial. The hunting weight barrel can deiver MOA. The Varmint barrel will most always half that. Forget the .260 and get a desent cartridge. roger

There is a significant difference in repeatability if both are hot. However if the sporter barrel is kept cool and assuming both barrels are of equal quality the significance is not as great. I have sporter weight barrels, all of them Krieger barrels, that will hold .5 MOA if kept relatively cool and the conditions are tolerable. If you get the sporters hot, the difference increases quick.

For whatever my opinion is worth, (take that and 94 censt and you can buy a cup of coffee at a convience mart) the 260 is a very good cartridge. I have won my share of 600 and 1000 yard matches using it. Not to mention killing quite a few deer, feral hogs, and coyotes with it. Again, that is my opinon and you know how much it takes added to my opinion to buy a cup of coffee. Have a Great Week

PaPa 260

quote:

Forget the .260 and get a desent cartridge

Poor Roger must have had too many beers at lunch today, when he typed that...

But he is still a good guy, just misguided at times...

I own 260s in a sporter contour and 22 inches in length with a one in 8 twist, that are Rugers...

I also own one of the rare 260 Rem VLSs produced also, which has a 26 inch heavy barrel on it, with a one in 9 twist...

The one in 9 is pretty much good for anything under 130 grains, over that, the 1 in 8 twist works much better....

Minus that part out of the equations... my Rugers shoot as good as the Remington any day...

I have tuned the factory Ruger's triggers and also the Remington.. with the Remington being as nice as a Jewel trigger ( at least to moi)...

But even that and a heavy barrel in its favor... accuracy for both types are equal on par.. I wouldn't feel handicapped with a shorter barrel or a thinner barrel on the 260...

If you order a barrel, the one in 8 twist would be a very wise choice tho.. I will say that...

cheers
seafire

Gidday Guys,

When I read Rogers remarks re the 260 I knew that he must have had a session with the Doctor to make such an assertion.

Am I right there Roger had Doctor Jack Daniels been giving his ministrations as that is the only way you could have come up with such a funny misguided conclusion.

Its OK mate I have been known to do it myself and ended up married.

Happy Hunting

Hamish

Seaftre, if you can make a Rem trigger as good as a Jewell, you are going to be rich and busy.

quote:

Originally posted by eddieharren:
Seaftre, if you can make a Rem trigger as good as a Jewell, you are going to be rich and busy.

I wouldn't quite go that far but would agree that a Remington trigger, assuming properly adjusted, is a mighty fine trigger.....as good as a Jewel????...well...........

A standard weight barrel can be as accurate as a bull barrel. You are aware of the benefits of a heavy barrel on a target/varmint rifle so I won't go into them.

quote:

Originally posted by rowdyredneck:
...I know the obvious benefits of a heavy barrel on a target rifle (slower heat up times, better balance, less harmonics) but is there a real noticeable impact on accuracy? ...

The lighter your entire rifle is, the more susceptable it is to "shooter induced movement" and slightly different "holding pressure" from shot to shot.

This won't mean a lot to you at first, but as you get more Trigger Time, you will realize that it is important to shoot between heart-beats. As you look through the (high power) scope, it will be noticable. If not, then you still don't have enough Scope Power.

I also prefer a Tuned Remington Trigger Assembly over a Jewel - for Hunting. They are just more rugged and can take "unexpected" impacts that will jar the mechanism loose in a Jewel.

For a pampered rifle that doesn't Hunt, then a Jewel is a very fine, precise, easily adjusted, $$HIGH$$ tool.

Best of luck to you.

As I like my hunting triggers to break at 3#, a Rem trigger can be tuned to do that nicely.

Back on task: It's a matter of harmonics. When you fire a round down a barrel, it whips like a water hose turned on full blast with no one holding the end. The thicker the barrel, the less it will move around and the closer the bullet will exit from the same point.

quote:

Originally posted by eddieharren:
Seaftre, if you can make a Rem trigger as good as a Jewell, you are going to be rich and busy.

Nope, even a blind Hog can find an Acorn sometimes....

Pure blind luck and a figure of speech thrown in for good measure is all...

and as I highlighted " for me"....

besides, seafire is never going to be rich, even if he won the lottery...

I'd win $100 million and the IRS would show up, present me with a bill for $110 million, after seizing the winning check...confiscate everything I owned and I'd be sleeping down under the freeway bridge in no time...

quote:

This won't mean a lot to you at first, but as you get more Trigger Time, you will realize that it is important to shoot between heart-beats. As you look through the (high power) scope, it will be noticable. If not, then you still don't have enough Scope Power.

Thats one of my biggest problems. I have a Nikon Monarch on my .223 and at 20X I can see every heartbeat as I try to hold steady. Its especially bad when I'm shooting at longer ranges since my pulse rate goes up after walking back and forth to check the target.
That rifle is a Remmy 700 SPS and the trigger is very stiff on it. Someday I'll have to try tuning it.

Fatter barrels "whip" less
SHORTER barrels also whip less..

this is why benchrest barrels are typically short and fat.

yes a thin barrel CAN be very accurate, but as it heats
POI will usually change more rapidly than it would with a heavier barrel.

The MASS aids stability as well.

All other things being equal it's usually easier to find an accurate load for a heavy barreled rifle than for a light barreled rifle.

I have never had a heavy barreled rifle that I couldn't find several accurate loads for, but that is not to say that it was "happy" with what I wanted it to shoot...

AD

quote:

... I have a Nikon Monarch on my .223 and at 20X I can see every heartbeat as I try to hold steady. Its especially bad when I'm shooting at longer ranges since my pulse rate goes up after walking back and forth to check the target. ...

It gets worse the older you get.

If you want to address the issue, a good high intensity Martial Arts Class and a lot of swimming helped me. Both also seemed to sharpen my focus and the ability to control my breathing.

Had to run a lot in the CORPS, but I'm not a fan of it.

Once you attain the Position Stability where the 20x looks steady, then it will be time to get a higher intensity scope. Nothing at all wrong with the 20x to get started, in fact, it is a good place to start.

Best of luck to you.

rowdyredneck,

Tikka makes the T3 Varmint in both the .260 Rem. and the 6.5 x 55 SE.



Enjoy!

The only thing keeping me from buying the Tikka is that ugly magazine sitcking out from the bottom. Otherwise I would order one right now.

quote:

Originally posted by rowdyredneck:
The only thing keeping me from buying the Tikka is that ugly magazine sitcking out from the bottom. Otherwise I would order one right now.

rowdyredneck,
I believe that the picture shows the high capacity magazine. All of the T3s I have seen on the rack with standard magazines don't have the mag extended down below the stock. I have a 695 Whitetail Hunter and the 3rd mag is flush while the 5rd mag hangs down like the picture above.

Personally I wish Tikka made their rifles without the detachable mag. I once ended up at the range for a session only to find out that I had left all my mags at home about 40 mi. back. I had to drop rounds into the chamber and close the bolt behind them.

I have never felt that I didn't have enough ammo in the gun for deer and no whitetail has ever forced me to reload!

Great, I'll check into it. Tikka's website shows that rifle coming standard with a 5 round clip. I wonder if the 3 round from a regular T3 would fit it?

quote:

Originally posted by rowdyredneck:
Great, I'll check into it. Tikka's website shows that rifle coming standard with a 5 round clip. I wonder if the 3 round from a regular T3 would fit it?

As I remember it, the standard sporters come with the 3 rd. mag. and you can buy the optional 5 rd. mag. So I think that the two would probably be interchangeable. Check it out though before you throw down your Benjamins!

eddieharran,

there are still lots of BR rifles using the Remington trigger with a 3-lever conversion. My HBR rifle has a Kostanich 3-lever conversion that has a two-stage 1 3/8oz trigger.

Rich
DRSS

Silly Roger here.

As life goes on it seems more evident that when someone gets stuck with a lemon they try very hard to justify having acquired it to the point of telling you that it really tastes sweet. Some go out and buy another.

And yes the answer is " Fast horses, pretty women and Jack Daniels." OK through in a 6.5X55 roger

It would be very easy to have a heavy barrel Savage in .260 (if they don't already make it).

Allready checked with tikka they won't sell you a tikka in 260 or 6.5 here in the us.????Said if you ordered 100 you might get one though.

Rich, but then that's not really a Rem. trigger is it? I could say the same for the Burns or the Olewine or the Culver triggers I have. They are not Rem. The original statement by Seafire was " You can adjust the Rem to be as good as a Jewell". I simply do not agree.

quote:

Originally posted by rowdyredneck:
Sorry for all the questions lately...I know the obvious benefits of a heavy barrel on a target rifle (slower heat up times, better balance, less harmonics) but is there a real noticeable impact on accuracy? I'm still considering the .260 Rem but I can't find anyone who offers it in a factory rifle with a heavy target barrel.
If you have two identical rifles of the same caliber, one with a bull barrel and one standard; how much if any difference will you see in accuracy assuming the barrels are kept cool?

The precision with which a barrel is produced has more effect on how well (or poorly) it will shoot than its' weight. Most barrel makers try to make the barrels that they intend to market as target or benchrest barrels to as high a precision as they can, and often such barrels also have chambering and crowning intended to maximize their target shooting performance. (This is not to say they don't try to do as well with hunting weight barrels.)

If a hunting-weight barrel is made to the same standards, it can perform as well except for the factors you listed, which will have an effect on its' ability as a target rig, even if only that the heavy one will be easier to keep steady while firing.