Wondering if any of the lads here still campaign this old classic. Brass has to be either Bertram or re-formed -- probably from .303 British as far as I can tell.
In the hands of fine, cool shots it certainly had a golden reputation in its day.
Also wondering if load data are the same for this case as well as the more common 6.5X54.

I form the case from 303Brit. I have used 30-40Krag in the distant past but that is getting harder to get now.
Greek HXP 70's surplus 303 ammo brass is my supply. Heavy duty stuff but makes good 6.5 too.

I've always used 6.5x54M/S data. Never wandered too far above minimum loads as it is just a paper puncher for me.


I use 6.5x54 M/S dies as well w/a 303Brit S/Holder.
Works fine. I guess there's some fine point difference betw the too but the dies work fine.

I had a set of dedicated RCBS 6.5x53R dies and I sold them for big$$. Never missed them.

I load for a 93Romanian Sporter , 1895 Dutch, and an 1896 Port Short rifle.

+1 to 2152hq

Mine is a Steyr 1893 from William Evans made in 1900; bought 1 box of Bertram to have properly headstamped brass to go with the rifle.
The real shooting ammo is re-formed and trimmed .303 British. My preferred powder is either RL15 or H4350 for “period correct” velocities. 6.5x54MS dies work fine for me as well.
Hornady 160 grain or Norma 156 grain “Alaska” shoot to the (iron) sights.
One could easily shoot cast gas check bullets too.
There are a few articles on the web on the process involved in reforming .303 brass......not as simple as one pass thru the 6.5 die, but not necessary to pop for a big $$$ RCBS case forming dies set either.
One link of several: http://castboolits.gunloads.co...ish-to-6-5x53R-Dutch

- Mike

I have a lovely Raick Freres of Liege exposed hammer double rifle in that caliber. The under rib is stamped “For Kynoch .256 Mannlicher. My brass is made from.303 British.

Good timing for me on this topic!
My pal just picked up an Army/Navy .256
He already has a well used Coggswell&Harrison .256.
I tried just brute force to make cases from .303 with a 6.5 x54 dies. I was able to split the sizing die doing that!
What process are you folks using to make them?

Back40: Brute force approach ... are you by chance descended from Vikings?

Bill,

I have one, a WR Pape I believe. It is identical in every aspect to one I know is a WR Pape. I'm at work in the oilfields right now and don't have access to my load data but I make brass from 303 Brit. It seems to work well. I've been using 6.5x54 data with 156 and 160 grain bullets.

Bill, at the risk of sounding redundant, you can use the 6.5X54 M/S data. Good info in Donaldson's "Handloaders Guide to Cartridge Conversions" + COW 2nd edition.

Thanks, Mart and Randy. Mart, that rifle is the equivalent of 4-weight fly rod. What a beauty!

Well Bill, I can crush an apple or potato in one hand, sometimes I don't think I'm forcing things but actually am.
Reading the replies, it seems I had some fat based brass, or undersized dies. I will measure base dia. before I start again. Perhaps touching the case with a file while spinning it in a drill press, to take off a tiny amount if I have to.

If you run the 303B into a 308 or even a 300Sav FL sizer die first to both push the shoulder back and it slightly necks down the 303, you'll find the next step of going into the 6.5M/S FL die is much easier on you and the die.

I am left with a ring of brass inside at the base of the new neck in the formed 6.5 case (reloaders call it a donut sometimes) and it's usually a job for an inside neckreamer to remove,,and should be I guess.
But I simply run a Letter Drll (G ?) down through the formed case neck (has not been Expanded yet). This removes that ring which blocks the base of a bullet from going any deeper than the base of the neck. The shade tree ream job also opens the neck to .just under .264.
Then when final formed with the die expander in place the inside dia is correct and the outside neck dia isn't oversize.

Another brass you can try is .220 Swift. I've had success with it, but it may not work in everyone rifle.
The base dia is right but case is only a semi-rim. So if your bolt/extractor claw is worn or fitted such that it doesn't quite reach the smaller dia rim,it won't extract.

The case itself is easy to form to 6.5.
I happened to have had a supply of once fired .220 at one time so it worked out, But not exactly a caliber you find in the junk brass bbl at the range.
Uses a standard 30-06 S/H

Sometimes the reformed 303 cases are a bit to big at base to chamber in one rifle,or the other. HAving been fired in multiple SMLE's may have something to do with it.
I simply put the case in the lathe and use a fine cut safe edge file and a couple educated swipes accross the base brings them to chambering quality.
Spinning them in a drill press would work just as well.
Keep it simple

I have a few 6.5X53R rifles & as all have said .303 Brit cases are the go & 6.5X64 dies, when I had one 6.5X53R I used to just neck size with a 6.5X55 die set I had .

One tip that made it a lot easier to form cases is use new unfired cases & check on small head size brand, I think mine turned out to be Remington brand ?

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
Thanks, Mart and Randy. Mart, that rifle is the equivalent of 4-weight fly rod. What a beauty!

Thank you. It is a delight to carry. It does have some wear and pits but is a good example of a quality rifle that has had some use and still has some more life to live. When I go caribou hunting I usually take 3-4 odd rifles since we stay in the camper and day hunt from it. I swap rifles each day. Hopefully this year since I have a tag, I'll get a chance at a caribou with it.

Mart, thanks for the PM and the post. I think it would be the nuts to harvest a caribou with that Mannlicher, and I hope you get the chance.

Thanks for the help folks.
The only new .303 brass I have on hand is PPU.
It measures .456 at the solid head in front of the rim.
The one Kynoch round of .256 I have measures .4515, which goes with most books and their .452 base size.
I will look for Rem brass, but a touch with the file should be easy also.

Redstone, is that something like a 26-inch barrel on your William Evans? Beautiful rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
Redstone, is that something like a 26-inch barrel on your William Evans? Beautiful rifle.

Hello Bill,
Yes, 26” barrel and 14 1/2” LOP.
Weighs 7lb 7oz

Alamogordo ......did USAF Fighter Lead In training at Holloman back in 1976. Was nice and warm in the Summer!
- Mike

Thanks Mike.
Yes, Holloman is still busy, but with F-16s and MQ-9 Reaper drone training. The Luftwaffe completed its lease last year and left a big hole.
One of my uncles learned to fly B-24s here in 1944.
When it gets really warm in the summer, I run up to Cloudcroft for pizza and beer.

Ok I went & found a few rounds & cases, the new Rem was .450.5 & I have a few packets of Kynoch & the head on these is .450 .

Remember your "chamber" could be larger or smaller ?

I remember it was much easier to form the new cases but it is very easy, only the trimming is a pain !

I have 4 of them & one Westely Richards in .375EX 2 1/2in .

Also a English 1903 in 256 or 6.5X54

I really like them but working the bolt fast takes a bit of practice !

Take the .303 British case and lightly lube and resize in a .308 sizing die. You can also use a Carcano sizing die between the .308 and 6.5x54 sizig die This pushes the shoulder back without causeing the case to crumple. then trim to 2.11 inches. then lube and full lenght size in a 6.5 by 54 MS die set. using a .303 Brit shell holder then load either a blank charge or a medium charge and 160 grain bullet and fire form the case. I have better luck with the medium load with bullet . then check the length and load with recommended loads I have a number of load info but have used the info in Barns Cart. of the World I consider his load to be about max. in my sporter. etc. All sizing steps in the case forming operations should be with the sizing die set to contact the shell holder.
I use only new WW brass. Turn the rim to .520 so it will work in the clips I also aneal the brass prior to fireforming that way the case life is longer only have to do that once.

I have a set of RCBS form and trim dies that I use if needed I could form some for you if you send new WW brass

Rolland, PM sent.
Guys, just looked at the Shilen page and they recommend a 1:7 twist barrel for bullets heavier than 130 grains. COTW lists 1:7.8 for the 6.5X54; 1:7.9 for the 6.5X55 Swede; and 1:9.8 for the 6.5 Dutch and Romanian. I had fine accuracy from Swede barrels with everything from 120 to 160 grains, so am thinking a 1:8 would suffice if putting a new barrel on an M95 Dutch action.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
Rolland, PM sent.
Guys, just looked at the Shilen page and they recommend a 1:7 twist barrel for bullets heavier than 130 grains. COTW lists 1:7.8 for the 6.5X54; 1:7.9 for the 6.5X55 Swede; and 1:9.8 for the 6.5 Dutch and Romanian. I had fine accuracy from Swede barrels with everything from 120 to 160 grains, so am thinking a 1:8 would suffice if putting a new barrel on an M95 Dutch action.

My Evans Steyr 1883 Mannlicher noted above has a 1:7.8 (200mm) twist. Apparently the really early 6.5x53R Dutch/Romainian had the slower twist, and maybe the military rifles specifically?
- Mike

Several years ago, I built a .256 (6.5x53R) on a Gibbs Farquharson action. It shot extremely well with Norma MRP and Lapua 156-grain Mega bullets. I made cases from .303 brass & started by sizing and trimming them in a 6.5x54 trim die. I made my own size die with a custom reamer designed especially for .303 brass which is a little smaller in the head than the 6.5. Probably unnecessary, but I obsess over such things.

The rifle was featured in Rifle's Custom Corner. Let me know if you're interested in seeing some photos.

Jeez, Do you really think you need to ask if we want to see it? Of course we do!

You bet!

Rogers: Yes please, sir!

Truly the most breathtaking rifle I have seen in my 20 years on Accurate Reloading. Simply exquisite! Thank you for sharing these images.
Now I have been to the mountaintop.

Digging around on the loading bench I found a half-dozen old Kynoch 6.5 cartridges. One was more corroded than the rest so I broke it down. The bullet weighs 158 grains, but that could be due to tip deformation. The powder charge comprised 36.5 grains of a coarse flake type.
Rim diameter is .518; base is .452. An R-P .303 case shows a rim of .530 and a base of .452.

fullsizeoutput_146c by ComeWatson, on Flickr

Here's the Hembrug action. The barrel is complete toast, unfortunately.
fullsizeoutput_146f by ComeWatson, on Flickr

fullsizeoutput_146d by ComeWatson, on Flickr

I know this is a bit off the topic, Bill/Oregon, I did my hitch at Holloman. Was there when they changed over to the F15 from the F4. Worked Egress systems.
Trips to Cloudcroft were always worth the ride. Ruidosa was nice to.
I have a Mosin Nagant as well as a couple friends. One has a 6.5 Swede.
Lot of fun to shoot.
Leo

Rogers, that is one beautiful piece of work!

Leo, Cloudcroft is still a pleasant 25 minutes from Alamo. From cactus desert to aspen elk woods is a great way to escape the summer temps. But don't tell anyone, for gosh sakes!

Was looking through some photos old & new & found these, all game shot with the 6.5X53R in Ducth 95 Carbine, English Sporter & one By Gibbs that I shot a nice Fallow Buck with this Rut !

Here is one I built a year ago.

I once had a 1908 Manlicher Shonauer (SP?). How I loved that rifle in 6.5x54 as I recall, lean and mean rotory brass magazine..They just got so high dollar that I sold mine and bought 2 or 3 Brno mod. 21, 22!! not funny I want it back.

Ray if it was a 1908 MS it would of been in 8X56 I think, needs to be 1903 to be in 6.5X54, I have a few of them also, need to get out more with them to !

I like the Brno Model 21's & 22's also, just need to mount the dam scope so high, if it is the Butter knife handle model !