Recently picked up a new .223 and am considering having it punched "AI". Any reason not to? Anyone ever experienced feeding problems after doing so?

Are we talking a bolt or auto?

Bolt, Kimber Montana, 1:9 twist.

Go for it, they're a lot of fun, and the 9 twist will allow you to shoot some longer bullets. 24hour site has a bunch of info.

quote:

Originally posted by Buster:
Recently picked up a new .223 and am considering having it punched "AI". Any reason not to? Anyone ever experienced feeding problems after doing so?

Why would you want to do that? roger

Doesn,t seem to make alot of sense to me either ... But I don,t have any experience with the round . AI that is .. I like the 223 just fine the way it is ......

To me the 223 is a waste of time and powder, so the AI is multiplying a waste of time.
KB

Depends upon what your smith charges to ream it. mine had a AI reamer as many use the 223AI for target and for a bit more wind bucking (my smith is in SD).

Not much of an increase -- about 1.5gr powder. i have one being built w. a 1/7 1" tube. mostly for shits and giggles as it will be the only bolt 223 i own. not to mention i expect my lapua brass to last a very long time!!!

my 30-06ai worked out very well so i have high hopes!!!

My experience with the 223AI has been with 12" and 14" twist barrels and light as possible bullets. With 40 and 50 gr. bullets t gives 100-300fps higher velocity (chronographed) depending on the powder used.

There are also advantages to the "squared off" shape of the AI - reducing case trimming. I use standard Lee collet dies which also reduce case stretching.

I can't speak for tight twists and heavy bullets.

quote:

Originally posted by Kabluewy:
To me the 223 is a waste of time and powder, so the AI is multiplying a waste of time.
KB

.. You do have something of a quality , tho mundanely boreing taste in rifles KB .. Perhaps you will be a joyful late bloomer to the 223 .. I know I enjoy mine all out of proportion to its size .. Especially now that it is printing little groups . And with my hack saw tracks on the muzzle still. And with a 53 gr Moly tumbled TSX bullet and 25.5 gr 4895 powder and range pick up brass to boot ........... I haven't painted it yet tho ......

quote:

Originally posted by gumboot458:
KB .. Perhaps you will be a joyful late bloomer to the 223 ..

Could be -- it's possible, however remotely. I know I have enjoyed my CZ 527 in 7.62x39 all out of proportion to its actual abilities. I shoot it more often than all my other rifles combined. Some consider the 7.62x39 close to worthless as a sporting cartridge, but I think it is more useful than the 223. I agree that the standard 123 gr bullets are very questionable, so I just bought some .311 boat tail plastic tipped bullets in 150 gr. with hopes of developing handloads that up the anti.

Also, hopefully soon I'll have a 6.5 Grendel bolt action to shoot. I suspect that will remedy any thought of somehow needing a rifle to shoot a smaller cartridge.

Question: How do you improve the 223?
Answer: Buy a 6.5 Grendel.

KB

No , build a 6x45 . . 85 gr TSX@ 2800,fps 90 gr Sierra fmjbt,@same , maybe 2750 fps ... 1 in 9 twist , of course .........

Or buy a 243 or 6mm Rem, or better yet a 257 Roberts - all 9" twist of course.

If it can't be grown, its gotta be genetically engineered. If it can't be mined, its gotta be imported.

KB

or just use the 222mag

223AI is 4000fps with 40 grn. Ballistic Tips and 3850fps with 45Grn. bullets.
Butch

quote:

Originally posted by Savage_99:
So called 'improving' cartridges like the .223 is just a waste of money. There will be no significant gain in any respect from velocity or operation.

There may be some loss of feeding ability.

There seems to be some game of using the .223 on deer. Perhaps some like to brag that "Its all you need".

Why do so many beat up on the AI's yet have no issue jumping to a magnum rifle to gain 200fps? Not sayin this is you.

My smith didn't charge me much at all to AI a 223 I am having made. Extedned brass life,little to no trimming, 100+fps gain??? Whats not to like?

Feeding issues??? Not if the smith has a clue.

I love all rifles and certainly like the AI's. Next one up is a 35Wheelen AI.

quote:

Originally posted by BISCUT:

quote:

Originally posted by Savage_99:
So called 'improving' cartridges like the .223 is just a waste of money. There will be no significant gain in any respect from velocity or operation.

There may be some loss of feeding ability.

There seems to be some game of using the .223 on deer. Perhaps some like to brag that "Its all you need".

Why do so many beat up on the AI's yet have no issue jumping to a magnum rifle to gain 200fps? Not sayin this is you.

My smith didn't charge me much at all to AI a 223 I am having made. Extedned brass life,little to no trimming, 100+fps gain??? Whats not to like?

Feeding issues??? Not if the smith has a clue.

I love all rifles and certainly like the AI's. Next one up is a 35Wheelen AI.

Consider the source..

quote:

Originally posted by Buster:

quote:

Originally posted by BISCUT:

quote:

Originally posted by Savage_99:
So called 'improving' cartridges like the .223 is just a waste of money. There will be no significant gain in any respect from velocity or operation.

There may be some loss of feeding ability.

There seems to be some game of using the .223 on deer. Perhaps some like to brag that "Its all you need".

Why do so many beat up on the AI's yet have no issue jumping to a magnum rifle to gain 200fps? Not sayin this is you.

My smith didn't charge me much at all to AI a 223 I am having made. Extedned brass life,little to no trimming, 100+fps gain??? Whats not to like?

Feeding issues??? Not if the smith has a clue.

I love all rifles and certainly like the AI's. Next one up is a 35Wheelen AI.

Consider the source..

What you will get is an awesome chambering.. This coming from the owner of a 223AI, moi...

Don

Edit to add: I've been drooling over AI chamberings for the last 55 years, and, my take is, the 223, the 250 Savage, 25-06 and the 7x57 are the ones I could live very comfortably owning.
The 25-06 is in the mix because my Step Dad had one built, and I admired it very much. In fact, I hunted and shot a Deer with it. Talk about lightning strikes.. That thing delivered lightning...
I have one each of the first two, but not the 25-06, or the 7mm Mauser AI. I'm kind of luke warm on the 22-250, 257 Roberts and the 30-06 AI's.

I think it's a funny (for lack of a better word) that the AI cartridges appeal to some and are something less than desirable to others. I am in the latter catagory. For one thing I don't even like the way the AI cartridges look - they just look like feeding issues lurking, whereas the original cartridges were designed to feed in adverse conditions, and a lot of money and time was spent to figure out what is obvious today.

But the shooting sport is diverse and surely there is good reasons to go with AI, so I surely support that. I suspect the case life issue may be real. I hope so, because my 6.5 Grendel has the features of sharper shoulder and straighter sides, and I hope that contributes to case life.

Effectively, the Grendel case is an "improved" case, modified from the 7.62x39 or 220 Russian, whichever. I don't have a problem with that, and like it, so maybe that is my way of understanding the appeal of the AI cartridges.

I suppose it's about perception. Another thing is that apparantly the "improved" case of the Grendel gives better ballistic performance than the parent case, which may speak to the claimed ballistic improvment of those using the AI cartridges.

Speaking of perception, when I was in my 30s, there was a shooting accident at a hunting camp that I belong to, and a friend was the shooter. A kid died as a result - short story. The rifle was a 25-06, and it indeed killed like lightning. My friend gave up hunting and shooting forever, and I shall always associate the 25-06 with that accident. Unreasonable perception - I know, but it just is.

KB

To me the advantage of the AI is for people that shoot alot, and would rather reduce the time spent trimming cases. The sharp shoulder and straighter body do limit the growth of brass. I find my std 223's need to have cases trimmed every 3rd firing, and when you are trimming and deburring 500 or 1000 cases at a time, that's a time consuming task.

Not to mention 50 gr @ 3500 fps makes for a great varmint or target round out to 600 yds, with almost no recoil in a varmint weight rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by Savage_99:


There seems to be some game of using the .223 on deer. Perhaps some like to brag that "Its all you need".

.
.
. I,m going to kill a grizzly with my 223 .....maybe some black bears also , maybe a few grizzly s.......... KB; Now your being morbid .

You can't really improve the .223.