Is there any accuracy advantage to the K Hornet or an increase in case life? I know that one can gain 100-150 fps, but I have three .222's and a .223 along with two 20's and two 17's, so I do not need the speed. Is there anywhere that will sell RWS Hornet brass in the US?

I've never owned one but everyone I've talked to said that K was the way to go. YMMV

I had a K Hornet barrel for a Contender pistol.

With a 4x scope I shot quite a few prairie dogs with it.

I have always heard the K hornet is the more accurate and brass lasts much longer as well.

I just shot standard factory loads to fireform my brass.

I have owned and shot both. I like the "K", and it does offer advantages as to case life and ease of loading. I also don't find the "K" as finnicky as the std. Hornet. As to "k"ing a Hornet you now own, depends on the rifle. If it is a 43 Winchester, or 23 Savage, in excellent shape, I think I'd leave it alone. Otherwise, you will have a ball with the "K". Lil Gun, and 35 grain V,Max's are the way to go.

Jerry

I own one "K" and two standards. I don't find much difference in any of them in terms of velocity, case life, or accuracy.

The reason that the K has a reputation for better accuracy is that (1) they are shot only with handloaded ammunition usually built by accuracy enthusiasts, and (2) when the conversion is done it frequently involves truing the action and setting headspace at a minimum. Such gunsmithing helps any round.

As far as brass life, load the Hornet only to the pressures it was intended and brass will last indefinatly in either configuration. Like you, I own 222's, .223's, .222 Magnums, and .22-250's, so when I want more velocity than the Hornet gives me I reach for a bigger gun. The K conversion in order to gain velocity is a fool's errand. The best reason to do it is due to having an oversized chamber and excessive headspace to be taken care of.

It is on a NEF superlight, so no worries about decreasing the value of the gun! I will need to check head space as I filed enough off of the breach end of the barrel to remove all the chop saw marks fitting the barrel! Like I said before I have no intention to hot rod, just looking for a possibly better shooter when done. Lots to ponder, but I suppose if the head space is tight, it would cost the same for either reamer, so dies would be the only increase in cost.

I've only had one K, it was a Contender pistol bbl, 14". I got it originally as a standard hornet, and it just wouldn't shoot. I diddled with it for months, every "pet" powder and primer combo of the day (before Lil-Gun came out). I was just never happy with it.

A good friend at the time and gunsmith talked me into K'ing it, as he had the reamer and had done several. He said at the time he'd never done one that didn't show improvement (if it had been a problem child).

Long story short, it "fixed" mine, accuracy went way up, with the same components that hadn't worked before. The brass life is better too, it's a win-win.

If you haven't shot it yet, wait until you shoot it. If it's a shooter, leave it alone and just enjoy it. I sold my first K hornet many years ago, which I regret.

I now have another Contender 14" hornet bbl, and this one's the most accurate Contender bbl I have. I'm not messing with this one ever, it just shoots too good.

I'm using Lil-Gun, Rem 6 1/2 primers, and 40 gr Vmax bullets. Same load works very well in my buddy's single shot Savage too. But his brass life is very short. Split cases at the expansion ring after the second reload. I've since got him to stop FL sizing his brass, and I believe he's getting a neck sizing die to "fix" his.

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
I own one "K" and two standards. I don't find much difference in any of them in terms of velocity, case life, or accuracy.

The reason that the K has a reputation for better accuracy is that (1) they are shot only with handloaded ammunition usually built by accuracy enthusiasts, and (2) when the conversion is done it frequently involves truing the action and setting headspace at a minimum. Such gunsmithing helps any round.

As far as brass life, load the Hornet only to the pressures it was intended and brass will last indefinatly in either configuration. Like you, I own 222's, .223's, .222 Magnums, and .22-250's, so when I want more velocity than the Hornet gives me I reach for a bigger gun. The K conversion in order to gain velocity is a fool's errand. The best reason to do it is due to having an oversized chamber and excessive headspace to be taken care of.

I want to congratulate you on an excellent post. You made several excellent points and logically explained why "not" to K a hornet.

There seems to be a desire to make the hornet into something it wasn't supposed to be. If I need more velocity, I'll reach for another caliber.

Thanks for your post.

As others have said, and I believe it to be true, k'ing some Hornets makes excellent shooters of one's that leave a lot to be desired in the accuracy department. Besides, if you have a rifle that dosen't shoot well, and constantly throws flyers,what do you have to lose?

Jerry

Good point, Jerry. My K-Hornet is one of the older Ruger 77-22H models which had horrible reputations for accuracy. The prior owner spent a bundle replacing the barrel with a Krieger, replacing the trigger, and doing no telling what else to it. In the process, he made it a great shooter. Once he tired of it, I bought it for about what he paid for the original Ruger . I suspect that it would shoot about as well if it had been chambered with a regular Hornet reamer, but had I been doing it myself I would have probably also chosen the K-reamer. Why not?

True Stonecreek, those early Ruger's had a rep for poor accuracy. My home inspector, (I am a Real Estate Broker), has a K hornet reamer, and if one of those 77's happen to come my way, I'll "K"chamber it myself.

Jerry

I have to admit, this has been one of the most informative and totally civil discussions I have seen on this forum in some time, thanks guys. I think I will shoot it first and see what it does. I have a ton of 40 grain V-maxes and I would be happy with 2800-2900 fps. with accuracy the first priority. I just can't see making it something it is not.

Good idea Moorepower! As to the civility on this thread, I think you'll find folks who load and shoot Hornets, are full of experience, and not the other stuff. Most agree that since the advent of Lil Gun and V Max bullets, the Hornet has become easier to load for. Still it took most of us a long time to get things right with the little cartridge, and it takes about 2 seconds to see if someone is full of the other stuff. LOL!

Jerry

Personally, I think forming brass is kind of a pain. Especially since 13 grains of Lil' Gun and a 40 grain V-Max out of a standard Hornet will do anything a Hornet should and is still very easy on the brass. If you want more than that, the .222 fits the bill nicely.

Pete

quote:

Originally posted by talentrec:
Personally, I think forming brass is kind of a pain.
Pete

Actually, my K-hornet shoots just as accurately with regular (unformed) Hornet ammunition as it does with once-fired K-cases. There is minimal and insignificant velocity loss due to a little less powder capacity and firing in a more capacious chamber, but as we've already established, neither the Hornet nor the K-Hornet is about velocity.

The thing that has always seemed to run counter to conventional wisdom when shooting Hornet cases in a K-chamber is that they always come out shorter than they went in. I can't recall ever needing to trim a Hornet case of any kind, but you certainly will never need to trim K-cases simply because they will never grow as long as the chamber since they start off so much shorter

Right on Stonecreek! I like forming brass, and making my own cases, part of the hobby I think. I don't believe we can have the velocity or the Ford Chevy argument here. The Hornet is a different breed of cat, in that regard! It either shoots, or it don't, that's the issue, IMO.

Jerry

Just to add my own $.02, I have an NEF that was converted to a "K" prior to the first bullet ever coming out of the barrel. I had read several statements that the original Hornet was not all that accurate, and case life was also not all that good. Mr. Kilbourn (sp?) supposedly had addressed both issues when he developed the "K".

Well, the long and short of it is this: with stock 55-grain Winchester soft points and ten grains of AA2200, my "K" is a five shot one hole rifle at 100 yards. I suspect once that data powder from Accurate is gone, Li'l Gun, AA1680, or some other powder will work just as well. I don't regret for a moment altering my little NEF.

Doubless,

You're happy with your K just as I'm happy with my K, but how do you know it wouldn't have done exactly the same thing if you had left it with the original chamber? After all, you said you rechambered it before ever taking the first shot.

My standard Hornets are a Sako M78 and an Oregon Kimber M82. I wouldn't dare touch the chambers on either of these little jewels. The Kimber is scheduled to make its first assault on prairie dogs tomorrow morning and will have exclusive rights to those which are naive enough to exhibit themselves within 150 yards. Beyond that, my .222 Magnum will take over, and when it's barrel is stretched beyond its competency, out will come my serious gun -- a .244 HB spitting 70 grain Ballistic Tips at 3600 fps. But the Hornet will undoubtedly be the most fun to shoot.

Stonecreek:

You sound like me, when doggin, I like to have the various ranges covered. I use the Hornet, a Model 43 Winchester 218 Bee, a 223, a 220 Swift, and then like you, if it is long and windy, I get out my 6mm-06, 28" barrel and all, zeroed @400yds.

Jerry

Isn't it fun to have "too many" guns!

I had this little beauty made up for my upcoming trip to Namibia...22 K

450, it is a beauty! I am sure you will enjoy shooting dik dik and the like.

Stonecreek, you are sooooo right about too many guns. There is however, a problem, which one do you shoot at the time! LOL!!

Jerry

I have a little G2 in a 22 k hornet. Very accurate and brass does last longer! Good way to go!

I went on a prarie dog hunt this weekend, and despite taking five guns and planning for every eventuality of weather, wind, and dog gunshyness, I still didn't have exactly the gun I wanted for one particular phase of our hunt. I'll just have to take more guns next time!

Funny that you should ask. I'm currently testing a CZ257FS in .22 Hornet against a BRNO .22 K-Hornet. Not nearly ready to make a comparison as yet, but the Hornet seems more accurate than the K. Could be the individual rifles though.

quote:

Originally posted by Moorepower:
Is there any accuracy advantage to the K Hornet or an increase in case life?

I've got 3 different hornets, a ruger, a cooper, and a contender. All 3 are pretty accurate (especially the ruger and cooper: <0.5" at 100), and I've got one set of brass going on 40+ reloads. I don't have any experience with the K, but I haven't had a reason to play with it either. The hornet is not a hotrod 22, that's what the 220 swift is for. I'd say there's not much reason to go with the K, particularly if you've already got the dies for the regular hornet. But if you just want to play, why not?

Another thought, if you like the hornet and are toying with the idea of a K, you might think about the 22 spitfire (aka 5.7 mmj, aka 22 johnson, aka 22/30 carbine). This round is even more unique than the K hornet, the cases are easy to come by, the case capacity is a bit more than a hornet (perhaps on par with the K hornet?), you can use the 30 carbine magazines if you want a lot of rounds, and you can go semi-auto too--kinda like a 10/22 on steroids. I really like this setup for prairie dogs because it's not very loud, you can shoot a lot without things getting too hot and the semi-auto is fun! Good luck.

This is a good post about my favorite caliber. I have a Contender in the Hornet. It has been a favorite since I got it. Its not extremely accurate but not inaccurate either. One thing I didn't know about was "K'ing" a Contender barrel. I thought the barrel had to be set back similar to Ackley Improving a chamber. DW

Regarding the 22 Hornet, is there much velocity to be gained by going from a 22"-24" to a 26" tube?
I am considering having a barrel built for a walkaround plinker/small game/varmint rifle and am not sure if it's worth the disadvantage of being forced to carrry a rifle with a longer barrel.

I have three 22 Hornet rifles, and I just can't bring myself to "K" any of them.
Seems sacrilegious to me..

How hard would it be to "K" a Ruger M77/22H rifle? I'm not looking for a real hot rod but, like the AI larger calibers so, it seems natural to K my rifle before I buy dies.

quote:

Originally posted by Sid Post:
How hard would it be to "K" a Ruger M77/22H rifle? I'm not looking for a real hot rod but, like the AI larger calibers so, it seems natural to K my rifle before I buy dies.

For a competent gunsmith who has a K-Hornet reamer, it is about as easy a job as one could ask. The R-77/22H barrel is easily removed and replaced.

On barrel length, mine is a 20" N.E.F. "Superlight" and I think, with of coarse no proof that it is long enough to get all I need out of the Hornet. I have decided that if it shoots well, it will stay a Hornet, and if I am not satisfied, I will K it, with accuracy the only deciding factor, if case like is the same.

Wow,

Lots of great info on the 22K

I would kill to get a case of Lil Gun powder in South Africa.

We have only one powder to load the Hornet with. Somchem S265

The K push a 45gr SP at 2800fps with a 11.3gr load.

I used the rifle as my predator calling rifle and have killed a lot of jackal. Some out to 200 meters but thats push the 45gr a bit.

quote:

Originally posted by DMB:
I have three 22 Hornet rifles, and I just can't bring myself to "K" any of them.
Seems sacrilegious to me..

I had a K-Hornet built on a Pre '64 Winchester Model 70 once. Had a new premium barrel installed with a 1-in-14" twist. while it shot fine and was easy to reload it was not all that different than the regular .22 Hornet.

quote:

13 grains of Lil' Gun and a 40 grain V-Max

With the Rem 6 1/2 primer works well for me, out of my Browning Micro-hunter.

Do you guys prefer a standard small rifle primer or a magnum small rifle primer for the hornet?

My 22K did well last night



The jackal on the right weighed 25lbs

quote:

Originally posted by Greg K:

quote:

13 grains of Lil' Gun and a 40 grain V-Max

With the Rem 6 1/2 primer works well for me, out of my Browning Micro-hunter.

One of my three Hornets is a Browning Micro Hunter, and it is as accurate as I could ever ask for. It's balance is superb. My Ruger 77/Hornet is very accurate also, but I like the Browning better.
My third Hornet is a Win Model 54.

Don

quote:

Originally posted by Gerhard.Delport:
Do you guys prefer a standard small rifle primer or a magnum small rifle primer for the hornet?

I use either Rem 6 1/2 Primers, or Fed Small Pistol Primers.
I think the small rifle primers may be too hot for the small Hornet case. Anyway, the primers I use deliver very good accuracy.

As far as barrel lenght goes on a K-hornet rifle the only reason I can see to have over 16" would be if you are useing iron sights. Look at the powders that are used, 296-Lil'gun-2400-H110, they are all pistol powders.

I just purchased a Savage Mod.40 in 22 H. I haven't planed to alter it unless it just will not shoot. But I have had this thread in the back of my head, with the knowledge that K'ing it might help, if it needs help.

While doing some research, I read where the 40 action won't handle the K preasures.

Does anyone know if this is true?

What are the relative preasures fopr the H vs. the K?

Thanks,

Chris