A Freind has just got a .223 and he wants to know, what is the best factory ammo availble.
As he lives in Ireland too, he cant reload by law, so its factory ammo only.
At the moment, the ammo is hard to get over here, as this caliber is only very slowly starting to get licenced, so he has only tryd remington FMJ and Fedaral soft points 55 grains.
Both grouped 1 inch to 2 inches, and he is not a happy man. If he cant find the right ammo, he is seriously going to change to a .204, which I have .
I told him to get one in the first place .
It seems the .223 is best when reloaded for, or is their a brand of factory ammo out their that will suit this caliber? .
Thanks for any help
p.s, the .223 got worse at 200, 3 inch groups .
My .204 with factory 40 grain v.max, goups at present 1 and quarter inch at 300yds

Mik-

While factory ammo is constantly getting better, the only factory stuff that I have used lately is Federal Gold Medal Match. It shoots every bit as good as my best handloads, just a bit more expensive.

I'm sure that there are plenty of good 223 loads out there. I'd start with something that has higher end bullets (MatchKings, Ballistic Tips, etc) loaded in it, as opposed to "standard" softpoints and definitely not FMJ.

Another consideration is Black Hills. You can buy new or "remanufactured", if that is allowed in Ireland. (It is once fired brass reloaded at their factory; should qualify as factory ammo I'd think). Their stuff is excellent, and quite reasonably priced.

BTW, what kind of rifle is he shooting? Fast twist or slow?

Hope this helps!

quote:

I'd start with something that has higher end bullets (MatchKings, Ballistic Tips, etc) loaded in it, as opposed to "standard" softpoints and definitely not FMJ.

Another consideration is Black Hills. You can buy new or "remanufactured",

Very well said!!!

He has a CZ 527 .223. Dont know the twist rate, could be 1 in 12.
I have told him of your ammo choice, and he is going to see if he can order some, once he gets pass the red tape that is , which could take forever .
Its just that he went threw so much trouble getting the .223 licienced, that he is doing his best to keep it.
His going to give it 6 months and try and get the ammo mentioned orderd, if not its a switch to a .204 for him .
He told me that he was out the other day and the fox he shot at with the soft points ran off. . Only to be found 400 odd yars away on its last breath of air. The soft point ammo did not expand a 100%.It was hit threw the heart and lungs, at a distance of 198yds.
Thanks for info so far. .

Winchester makes an economical .223 loading in their USA brand. Not only is it cheap it is damn accurate.

M 16,
What are the bullet weaights and what brand of winchester is it?
Thanks.

Mik,
Since 223 ammo is hard to come by, it could be that your friend has not "broken in" the barrel.
After about 200 rounds, the groups should settle down. Also, have him check the tension on the stock attachment screws or uneven contact of the stock to barrel. Bedding may help.

Black Hill remanufactured 55gr. soft pt. or 52 gr. hollow pt. is excellent ammo for the price. A group of us just bought 15,000 rds of that stuff for a prairie dog shoot next week in Wyoming.

Geoff

Thanks Jeof,
He has put between 200 & 300 rounds threw it so far.
The black hills ammo sounds good. He is going to try and get it if he can, it could take 3 months or more.
He has checked every screw on it and had it checked out by a rifle smith with a bore scope ect.
All seems fine.
The rifle smith put it down to ammo and mentioned that .223s are very fussy about the ammo, thats why most reload for it if they can.

Mik,
I don't know if it's available in your neck of the woods, but Winchester, 45gr.HP's shoot well under 1/2" groups out of my Remington 700, 1-12" twist. I bought some to get brass to reload when I first bought my rifle and was surprised at the accuracy.
Stepchild

All rifles are different. What performs well in one may not in another. Twist is important in a .223.

I have a very nice match AR with a 1 in 9 twist match barrel. It does fine with 55s yielding 1" or smaller groups. But it REALLY likes Federal 69 gr Match ... delivering < 1/2" groups regularly. Usually around 0.4" average when I can shoot well.

Don't give up until you try several bullet weights as well as several brands.

Can your friend reload? The .223 really takes to reloading and the Sierra match bullets come in flavors from 50gr to 77gr to fit just about any twist rate.

If you can get the white box Winchester ammo in 45gr weight it is as accurate as the guys above stated and should shoot in a slow twist barrel.

Tell him to endeavor to persevere, he'll find a load the rifle likes.

Thanks for all your help, he is going to keep at it. .
Paladin, he cant reload by law, as he lives in Ireland.
Thanks.

Well, before providing more advice on what ammo has shot well in the past, what ammo brands can you actually get in Ireland??

If European brands are available, RWS "Scheibengeschoss" (match ammo) is usually a good place to start for accuracy. Norma and Lapua are other brands known for good quality ammo.

If you can get it, I'll have to agree to the suggestion above about the Winchester "White Box" brand - I have yet to see a .223 that would not shoot the 45 grs HP load. It is as cheap as anything in the States, but I have never run across it in Europe.

What is this business about not being able to reload in Ireland?? Is it some religious thing, a left over from when the Brits were "in charge" or just another example of misguided politicians??

- mike

P.S. This:

quote:

The rifle smith put it down to ammo and mentioned that .223s are very fussy about the ammo, thats why most reload for it if they can.

is largely a myth. Whereas the .223 Rem may not have quite the same accuracy potential as a .222 Rem, it sure is not far behind. If you happen to use a military rifle or military ammo, be aware that this involves twist rates totally different to commercial twist rates. But other than that, .223s are normally pretty docile beasts.

Most rifles don't shoot because: something is wrong with the shooter (sad as it is), something is wrong with the sights (scope/mount) or something is wrong with the gun. Factory ammo is pretty good these days. So,,, make sure you get your friend to shoot from a steady, sandbagged position, and if that does not work, have somebody else shoot the rifle, or if that fails, try out another scope. Eventually, you'll come up with more ammo types to try out...

P.P.S. consistent 1" groups (5 shots for a caliber like .223 Rem) are nothing to turn up your nose at in a factory rifle with factory ammo - even in these days of Internet .5" guns...
- mike

I agree. If it's shooting inch groups, it is doing well. I would also check the rifle out as, as much as I like CZs, they sometimes need tweeking like most others.

Telly

mho,
As I have said in my first post, only Remington 55 grain full metal jacket an Fedaral 55 soft point are available at present.
Its not a religous thing, that the reason is that we cant load, its what the law dictates! , unfortunately.
Firearms laws over here are very strict, certain calibers like the .223, 308, 303, ect,
are very hard to licence. I agree its poltical crap
My freind has a good gun vise for holding the rifle steady and has won many cups in shooting compitions.
He is going to import if he can more ammo from the UK, where their is a wide choice.

I think an empirical approach will serve you best. I don't reload either... too little time is my limiting factor. So I was faced with a similar problem when I bought a new varmint rifle last summer. I shot the barrel in using about 80 rounds of inexpensive, reloaded South African UMC 50 gr. jacketed stuff. Then I experimented at 200 yrd.s with about a dozen factory loads in bullet wt.s from 45 gr.s to 62 gr.s until I settled on the one my gun liked best. The gun shot any ammo with 50 to 52 gr bullets well, but it shot remanufactured Ultramax with 50 gr. Nosler Balistic Tips, one of the cheapest, best of all. The groundhogs and one coyote have been impressed.

winchester white box 45grn value packs are the finest 223 ammo that money can buy, plus they are cheap, I have had 3 223's an nef and 2 CZ's all have shot the white box into sub MOA. my CZ varmint averages in the mid 5's for 5 shots with white box. they only thing I don't like about it is its kinda slow in speed, I usually get less than 3300fps from a 24" tube. so with that said don't shoot coyotes with it over 200yds, I use the stuff for plinking and such, when coyotes are on the agenda I switch to 50grn blackhills vmax, slightly more expensive but much greater performance. instead of .5 groups It usually goes around .75

Mik, I'd recommend trying Black Hills 52gr. Match bullets (if available in Ireland).

I'm a big fan of the Federal Gold Medal Match bullets, BUT Federal only offers the 69 & 77gr. bullets in .223 Remington. These are not suitable for a rifle with 1:12" twist.

Stay away from the "white box/ paramilitary M-193 clones". Very inexpensive.... but loaded with a bullet that has an exposed lead base, heavily crimped, and generally of a poor design for accuracy.

Actually..... I think your friend should take up reloading his own ammunition! Then he could custom manufacture the ammunition to the rifle.

But, if he can't do this..... then he should try a several different types of factory ammunition from 45-60gr.

those look like vmaxs to me