I am looking at getting a 25 cal rifle. I think I would prefer a short action calibre and the availability of good quality brass for calibres based on the 308win make these the obvious choice. I am not looking to wring the neck of this rifle and get every last fps out of it as I have other guns for that. What I am looking for is a dual purpose varmint/medium game rifle that is pleasant to shoot.

I am based in Australia and getting a 25 souper made will be a much easier prospect than getting a 257dgr but I do like the concept of the DGR. Is there any real difference in how they perform?

I would like to know what people who shoot this calibre can achieve with 87gn 100gn and 117/120gn projectiles. A special mention of what the 110 nosler accubond can do would also be appreciatted.

Thank you

The .257 Roberts will move a 100 grain bullet in neighborhood of 3300 FPS and in the net result nearly equal to the .25 sooper. Both make excellent dual purpose cartridges.

Build the .25 Souper. That was the overwhelming response from riflesmiths when I was building a short action quarter bore.

I considered the 25 Souper a few years ago, but had a short action 257 Roberts built instead. The 257 equals the 25 Souper, and brass and dies are readily available. Since then, I had a 250 Savage AI built, on a short action. It is a VERY fine round. Being a 25 caliber loony, I may still get a 25 Souper, just to say that I have one.
But, for the first 25 caliber, I'd go with the 257 Roberts, then branch out to other chamberings later.
I have two other rifles in the straight 250 Savage that are a joy to shoot, and as accurate as any rifle I have.

Don

I have used the 257 Ackley for near 20 years, that said I would go to the Souper next time around.

Some smith in Australia took the 25 souper and blew it out/improved and called it the 25 Humdinger, he was reaching hot 25-06 load speeds from a 23" barrel. The load info is sourced as "Breil Jackson"

There was another one that caught my eye on the Redding custom die list:

.25-.243 Imp

Basically a 25 Souper Imp.

That's what I'm going to do one of these days!

Indeed I have got the original magazine article describing the cartridge and have even talked to the smith who did the work about the 250 humdinger. It looks good on paper but he really must be ringing the neck of that cartridge to get that velocity out of it.

I am looking at something a bit more standard. The dgr doesn't need full fireforming and the souper can just be knocked straight up from 243 or 260 brass.

If you load the 250-3000AI, 257 Roberts, and the 25 Souper to the same pressure levels, they will do the same thing, but the 25 Souper fits into a short action a little better then the Roberts and feeds a little better than the 250-3000AI. If you want more performance, the 25-284 is probably a better choice. I have done the 250-3000AI x2 and it is a nice cartridge, but didn't feed as well as the 25 Souper in my Ruger 77 RSI, so I prefer the 25 Souper to the 250-3000AI.

Jeff

quote:

Originally posted by 260remguy:
If you load the 250-3000AI, 257 Roberts, and the 25 Souper to the same pressure levels, they will do the same thing, but the 25 Souper fits into a short action a little better then the Roberts and feeds a little better than the 250-3000AI. If you want more performance, the 25-284 is probably a better choice. I have done the 250-3000AI x2 and it is a nice cartridge, but didn't feed as well as the 25 Souper in my Ruger 77 RSI, so I prefer the 25 Souper to the 250-3000AI.

Jeff

Jeff,

I think you just sold me on a 25 Souper...
Of course I'm such a TOUGH sell...

Don

G.D
The load data (257DGR) on my web page is based on the average from 2 rifles, with 24" barrels. The 26" barreled rifles have been a consistant 50-60 fps faster than the 24".The Souper will/should be very close.

www.duanesguns.com

I have the 2nd 257DGR that Duane Built. I just ordered another barrel and will be building my 2nd 257DGR, this one on a Rem 600 action, the first was on a Nesika K that was then swaped for a T action (It is a long story). I love the round. 70-75gr bullets to 3700fps+ and 100gr bulllest to 3200fps+ are no problem (with good case life) in my current rifle (24" barrel). Just took another doe with it last Sunday @ a long 200 yards, no fuss no muss just a dead deer. The round is easy to load for and case forming is one trip through the FL sizer, recoil seems less then my 243 Win or 243AI.
All that said ballisticly I don't see any difference between the 257DGR, 25 Souper, and 250 AI. I also have a couple 3 250 Savages and they are also a great deer cartridge. I like the 257DGR a bit bettern then the 25 Souper because I liked the 30 degree shoulder and longer case neck. The 250AI required Fireforming and I have already BTDT with a 243AI and didn't want to do it again.
You can't go wrong with any of the short action 25's. the 257 DGR is just my favorite, so far.
Good Hunting
Jeff in ND

OK, all this info has got my attention, tell me again, what the DGR is...308 case.....difference between it and the Souper?

Brass used/case prep done? Accuracy had? Thanks......just have to find out what I never tried....

The easiest description is it is a 22-243 Middlestead necked up to 25 caliber.
More datailed description is it is a 25 Souper with the shoulder junction pushed back to give the case a 30 degree shoulder and results in a longer neck(as opposed to an AI where the Body /should juction is moved forward to make a 40 degree shoulder) and I believe a slight amount of the case body taper removed.

Personally I use 260 brass. One trip through the 257DGR FL sizer and your done.

Accuracy has been very good but I don't remember group sizes at the momment as it has been a long time since I have shot paper with my 257DGR. E-mail me if you woudl like more details I can find them when I get home (jmilender@csicable.net)

Duane has more infomation in his web page:
http://www.duanesguns.com/pages/dgr.htm
My rifle is the "deluxe" 257DGR pictured.

Good Hunting
Jeff in ND

Thanks Jeff.