It is great when your wife insists on buying you anniversary rifles. But it has to be 25 caliber - so for mule deer, Russian Boar, coyotes in open country with maybe a black bear or pronghorn in the future - which rifle and why?

Thanks for the help - I reload so factory ammo price isnt a factor. I have a 243 and 7mm Rem Mag so this does fit nicely in between I do like being able to reach out to at least 400 yards accurately. I have access to a 1000 yard range and practice out to 800 yards before hunting season. At my house we can shoot to around 500.

weatherby. for no good reason I can recall, the .25-06 never appealed to me.

will you be hunting here in CA? which bullets will you use?

I'm thinking the Barnes 100 grain ttsx is the most likely first choice for a bullet. I'm in a lead allowed area but no pigs aren't plentiful here so i might mix in a Nosler ballistic tip.

7*64 or .280r because of russian boar and black bear, maybee in a sauer 202!

25/06 is the practical choice. 257 if you want something different.

Why? I don't really see these covering anything not already covered. My question of a 25-06 is what does it do that a .270 doesn't do better? So it would be out. I'm not a fan of Weatherbies, so it would be out. Now the .257 Roberts I do like. Probably a conflict there to some as the 25-06 does have a little more pep in the step. Practical applications you'd probably never notice that. Really your .243 is right there with it. The .257 Roberts should be plenty for all your applications and if you think you need more, drag out the 7MM.

Specneeds--BTW congrats on 25 years. This reminds me of a story I'll share with you. It is good that your wife is checking to see what your preference is. Many years ago I ran across a new in box, never fired Win mod 70 in .243. It had a Tasco World Class scope not mounted and sealed in plastic. In the box was also an anniversary card and the receipt of purchase. The man was a fan of handguns, but didn't care for long guns. She had bought him a long gun. They divorced. I doubt that her buying the long gun or him not liking it caused the divorce. He moved out of town and gave the rifle to his grown son. Son was also handgun fan but not long guns. He ran ad in newspaper to sell it, and I was the buyer. Gun was maybe 10 years old when I bought it--unfired. I still have the box and the anniversary card. I have hunted with it for about 25 years, I think she made a great choice.

Correct me if i'm wrong but I thought the use of conventional lead ammo was not allowed for hunting anymore with the passing of a law this year.

Now as for a choice between the two calibers. I have a Remington Sendero in 25-06 and my brother has a Weatherby MK V in 257 WBY. He is happy with his rifle and i'm happy with mine. They have both taken Elk with a single shot. There was no difference in the results. His rifle will shoot a little flatter at distance and carry a little more energy but at the cost of more powder and recoil.
Initial start up on reloading components will create some sticker shock. 257 WBY brass is significantly higher than the plentiful 25-06 brass. Brass is almost $1.00 a piece for the .257WBY. It's certainly more available now then when my brother bought his back in 2001.

It would depend on your preference of rifle. The Wby chambering is fairly limited, but better than it was. Both will perform seemingly the same as far as on game performance goes and right now it is almost easier to find new 257Wby brass. That said I love the 257 Weatherby. It is FAST and loud and it does give the 100 grain TSX some authority. I find it hard to beat in the Weatherby Mark V Ultra Lightweight for accuracy and portability while still being easy to shoot comfortably. Either way, happy anniversary and congrats on a great wife (anniversary guns) and soon a great rifle. Now on to your new problem, What scope to put on it?

Quintus--Which scope to put on it? Shouldn't that be which model leupold scope to put on it?

Palladin, the California lead ban goes state wide starting in 2019. That includes all hunting: rifle, shotgun, and handgun.

Every .25 caliber affiliation should own a Weatherby rifle in .257. The action is different but excellent. The cartridge exceeds .25-06 performance by around 200 fps, enough to make a small but noticeable difference at long range.

I have owned three .257s, one a custom on a Ruger No.1, the others Weatherbys. Still own two and love both rifles. Would I be handicapped with a .25-06? Probably not but the novelty and cool effect do it for me. YMMV.



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Thanks duckboat for the clarification. The person I heard it from didn't say there was a start date just that they had expanded the lead ban to state wide for hunting.

Quintus the featherweight is what my brother has. Very nice and balances nicely for me. If I were in the market for another quarter bore I think it would be it. My friend just bought one in 300 WBY. Hasn't shot it yet though.

I'll vote for the 25/06, I've used mine, a Browning Stainless Stalker, on everything from groundhogs, coyotes, to deer. I just added a 257 Roberts to the family. I do like quarter bores, as I have a 256 Win Mag too. If I need more power than a 25/06 I'd grab my 270WSM.

I have a 25-06 and 257 wby. Both are great cartridges. I like the wby best though.

Thanks for the great and interesting replies. I have to agree that the 243 and 7mm RM do overlap about everything in the 25's.

Maybe using some mental gymnastics ill get that 25 caliber necked down and fill the hole in my arsenal with a 22-250. That doesn't overlap my 17 Hmr or the 243 and soul get used fairly often. Any rifle is a nice reminder of 25 great years particularly when it gets used.

One thing you have not mentioned is the budget. I guess if the budget is under 1K for the gun and you are buying new that might make a difference. I would definitely go with the 25-06 if my 257 were to be limited to 24 inch barrel like the Vangaurd. true in some instances the longer barrel does not translate to higher velocity, but in most cases it does, and in many cases it is substantial. If you are going to burn the extra 10 grains of powder you may as well get something for it. Fortunately for you, you are in a win - win situation and really can't go wrong either way. And luckily there are many Leupold options that will enhance either cases performance, right Carpetman1?

Spec---Now you opened another can of worms. This started as 25 cal ONLY. I don't see the 22-250 adding anything that you don't already have by loading lighter bullets in your .243. I use my .243 for deer hunting and have other choices for varmints. I seldom use my 22-250. True you have a 17 HMR---but you can't reload that. So what you need is a Ruger .204---mild shooting---shoot it all day long. If not the Ruger .204--go with a .222 or .223. Why? Low recoil and blast. The 22-250 is right there with the .243 in those depts--possibly more blast.

Quintus--If you look at Saeed's guns, most have scopes with a gold ring. To me that says volumes.

Spec--More as to the why of the .204 Ruger. I shoot air rifles and have .177's and .22's. I also have a 5MM (.20 cal) The .20 cal is my favorite--I consider it the best of both worlds between the .17's and .22. I thought years ago I'd like a .20 centerfire--but I'm sorta in a situation where I have a 6 inch knife, but want one that is half a foot long. I'd probably have bought a CZ in .204 but the backwards safety on CZ's killed that deal. You mentioned you could shoot to 500 yards at your house. I envision a shooting bench right outside your reloading room. (I'd love that). So you need something you can set there and shoot--not something that makes your shoulder sore and ears ring after a few shots. BTW your wife would probably enjoy shooting the Ruger .204. Gosh if she gets hooked, you can start another post on which rifle to get her. And the glowing reports you post about the Ruger .204 might finally push me over the edge and I buy one.

One of me favorite rifles is my .257 Ackley, that I built from a .25-06. I've used this rifle for about 35 years and have taken more North American game with it than all of my other rifles put together.

If I was to do it over again, it would be a .257 Weatherby.

In facotry rifles I would pick the .25-06. It has enough powder capacity to burn out your bore with 1500 rounds.
Anyone that picks a .257 Wby just because they think it is cool is childish.
The 257 Wby would be a good round but not in a crappy Wby rifle. For the most part magnum chambers are poorly designed and cut. If you go with a .257 WBY besure to have someone that knows how to cut a Benchrest chamber design a reamer for your new chamber.
I have used a .25-06 since 1972. It will make you trade off your wimpy .243 once you start using it.

25-06

I think you ought to stay with the .25 bore...after all, it IS a 25th anniversary present. The .25 bore will remind you of that every time you see it, and will touch a soft spot in your wife's heart every time she sees you fondling it.

As to which .25, I'll start by saying I have 5 different high powered ones. .250 Savage, .250 Donaldson Ace, .257 Roberts, .25-06, and .257 Wby. (also have a .25ACP, .25-20 and a .25-35, but they aren't relevant to this thread.)

If my wife was going to get ME one, I'd try to wangle a nice used .250 Savage in a model 99 rifle. My second choice would be a .25-06.

Brass is available everywhere for the .25-06.

Ever since 1959 I've just run .30-06 brass into my .25-06 sizing die, and VOILA, .25-06 cases. Has worked with no neck turning required in at least 7 different .25-06s, including the two I have right now, and has worked with either G.I. surplus '06 brass or commercial '06 brass. And it will do every practical thing a man could need a .257W-Bee for. Not theory; Experience.

quote:

Anyone that picks a .257 Wby just because they think it is cool is childish.
The 257 Wby would be a good round but not in a crappy Wby rifle. For the most part magnum chambers are poorly designed and cut. If you go with a .257 WBY besure to have someone that knows how to cut a Benchrest chamber design a reamer for your new chamber...

Name-calling, how mature. My two Weatherby rifles' chambers were great and allowed groups agging in the 0.6s. Long case life too. My Ruger has a bench rest chamber and shoots too well to report. Some folks without much experience will denigrate whatever they do not use. Everyone knows that all magnum rifles have terrible chambers and cannot shoot straight anyway. I read it in a post on a gun forum, it must be true!

Budget $1000 including glass so custom chambers aren't on the menu. With several reasonably priced rifles giving MOA guarantees these days a hand loader can really get good groups without spending a ton of money. I would probably put a 3x9 VX2 or one of Doug's specials on the Viper 6.5-20 mil dot for glass so about $700 on rifle maximum.

I think Savage's are ugly but would buy one. I like my Rugers, I wouldn't mind a TC venture and the vanguard S2 is certainly a good option - my older vanguard in 300 Weatherby with a Timney trigger shoots very well,I think the new series would shoot at least as well. I know all of those can be had for less than $700. Used opens the door to more rifles you wonder why they are being sold sometimes but I've had great luck buying used.

Years ago when I was making a similar decision, I went with the 25-06. I did so mainly from a $$$ point of view as I had, well still do have, a ton of 30-06 cases to work up loads or just dobber head around with.

What I found with mine a factory Rem 700 BDL, was that while the 100gr bullets shot good velocities, grouped excellent with regular groups being around 3/4" at 200yds, they had a tendency for being on the fragile side when it came to hunting.

I experimented with just about everything on the market back then, and after a year or three of hunting with it and actual field use, I settled on the Nosler 115gr Partition. I get velocity averages of 3150fps form the load of RL-22 I was/still am using, and the accuracy has remained right in there with the groups I was getting with the 100gr loads. As a compromise, it is hard to equal the effectiveness of this combination.

That said they now have the excellent new breed of bullets out from which to choose. Being where your located I would look at the Barnes TSX in 115 and you should have about all you would eve need in that one bullet provided you get ti up into the 3100fps range. If memory serves, which is iffy anymore, the above load I shoot in ours, sighted in zero at 200 it drops right around 18 or so at 400. THis makes using the duplex crosshair in some scopes great as a rangefinder as with several I have used the brisket of a mature buck fits perfectly inside something variable in the 12-14x range. I had the Leupold 4-14 mounted on mine, until I passed it over to my daughter and now it wears a nice Weaver 3.5-15 Tactical.

It will still shoot the little bug hole groups after all these years and between myself, my daughter and oldest grandson, it has taken several very nice bucks and three of my daughters best bucks.

Myself, when I passed that one over to her, I built a AI version with a 28" barrel. I wanted to use it for reaching out across our back pasture with a bit more umph than I was getting with the standard version, and to be able to get a bit more velocity using some of the 120gr bullets as well as a small supply of 125 and 130gr customs i have on hand. I haven't been disappointed what so ever. It will pretty easily hit 3350fps with the 120gr loads using Ramshot Magnum and of course every bit of that longer barrel. I will also say that when those 120's hit something, it drops with no doubt about it. The last coyote I shot at 450yds, had a puff of hair raise up in the wind that looked like someone shook out a feather pillow.

Anyway wishing you all the best with yours, and I hope it provides you with years of pleasure as ours has. One thing I would add, when you start to load, start off with RL-19 on the 100's and RL-22 for anything heavier, and I doubt you will need to look any further for a more efficient powder.

I know it is true from experience.
Magnum chambers are oversize in diameter and too long at the shoulder. Even you admit to having a BR chamber. So what is your point?
I like to reload with Wilson tools and it is a rare magnum chamber that is small enough that once fired brass will fit in the Wilson tools.
As far as agging .6. Yes sure at 50 yards maybe. You have already lost telling a whopper like that.
Some people that think they have a lot of experience are just full of hot air and will make any number of ridiculous claims that prove they are full of hot air.

quote:

Originally posted by TX Nimrod:

quote:

Anyone that picks a .257 Wby just because they think it is cool is childish.
The 257 Wby would be a good round but not in a crappy Wby rifle. For the most part magnum chambers are poorly designed and cut. If you go with a .257 WBY besure to have someone that knows how to cut a Benchrest chamber design a reamer for your new chamber...

Name-calling, how mature. My two Weatherby rifles' chambers were great and allowed groups agging in the 0.6s. Long case life too. My Ruger has a bench rest chamber and shoots too well to report. Some folks without much experience will denigrate whatever they do not use. Everyone knows that all magnum rifles have terrible chambers and cannot shoot straight anyway. I read it in a post on a gun forum, it must be true!

I'd go .257 Weatherby. If there's a easier way to make deer sized open country animals into steaks I don't know what it is. Kid's stuff, really.

Happy anniversary!

Since 400, 500, and 800 yard shooting is on your itinerary, the 257 Weatherby would seem the logical choice. As for rifles, what about the Weatherby Vanguard S2? http://www.longrangehunting.co...-magnum-review-1.php

Yep gotta have a tight chamber! Magnum chambers are cut too big...we are talking about rifles right? Hmmm. Anyway, have shot dozens of "crappy" Weatherbys. I found them all to be Sub minute of deer, and fox, and p-dog and so on out to as far as one would reasonably expect to shoot such things as wild game. Custom chambers not required.

Neck sized cases fit plenty tight.

If you want something completely different that will have your friends scratching their heads it is the 25 WSSM. An accurate 25 that has 25-06 ballistics. Since brass is nearly impossible to find you can buy one on the cheap, too.

I would go with a Weatherby chambering. Bang flop for a long ways out there.

Next year, you can get a 26 Nosler, too. A year later, a 270, then a 280 ...

I'm trying to sell her on that caliber idea myself - she did it for year 17 and now 25 - at 30 I'll really be confused.

Thanks again for all of the suggestions - haven't found the rifle yet but am looking hard.

Spec--no brainer--30-06 at 30 if going bolt action. If not bolt action, .308.

25.06 does NOTHING that with the 100 grain bullet the 6mm Remington or even 243 Winchester doesn't do better and with less powder.

With the 117 grain bullet it doesn't do anything that the 270 Winchester or even the 280 Remington doesn't do better with the 130 grain bullet or 139 grain bullet.

So I can't see it being worthwhile.

I've never had a 257 Weatherby but I'd have to say that if I was ever to get a .257" calibre rifle it would be either a 257 Roberts or a 257 Weatherby Magnum.

That is part of the .257 dilemma, it is the super-tweener. That is what is sooo great about this country. We can have just as full a gun cabinet as we choose to afford.
Personally I think the 25s are perfect for the antelope / deer sized game. A little more reach than the 6mms and less recoil than the bigger bores. I also agree the wssm is fantastic. Very handy and accurate in the A-bolts I have they are a joy to hunt with, but the brass is a serious problem.

olympic mskes a 25 WSSM AR-15 upper....

I simply love the .257 Weatherby. It`s something different. Shot big wild boars, roe and Beceite Ibex in Spain with it. Also took it to Africa up to Eland Cow and Kudu bull. Most animals are hammered on the place. Have no experience with .25/06. I don`t even know somebody who owns one. Mine is a Rem 700.

Just curious. What bullet(s) did you use or the elands and kudus? Thx