I will soon be able to buy my first rifle in Germany. I prefer a 6.5X57 but wouldn't mind the 7X57 either. I am only interested in the stutzen or full length stock models. So far I have looked at the Sauer S202, Krico 902, Merkel KR1, Steyr Mannlicher classic, Antonio Zoli 1900, and the various CZs. I'm not sure if the Heym SR 21 comes in a stutzen model but I don't like the feel of the SR30.

I have very little knowledge of these rifles. They all seem to be well made. Are there any significant differences in quality or accuracy? Are there any other brands I should be looking at as well?

Well Kodiak,

You've got many choices on your Short List and going through the +/- would take several pages.

If you've got your mind set on a new rifle; great, buy one.

Personally, with your choice of cartridge as either a 6.5x57 or 7x57 in a full length stocked stutzen I'd comb the used gun racks and see what's available on some Estate Sales since you ought to be able to find a really pristine Full-Stocked Mauser 98 Stutzen (most likely with scope/mount) for a whole bunch less than you'll have to lay out for a newly manufactured boomer.

The used gun market here is absolutly saturated with minty pieces like you're looking for - your choice.

Brno 22F would be my choice if you can find one.

Weagle

Stutzen rifles can be less accurate than ordinary rifles, due to the wood touching the barrel up to the muzzle.

I have a Blaser Attache and a Mauser 98 stutzen in 6.5x57 and a Sauer mod90 Stutzen in 308.
I would look at the Sauer model 90 in 6.5x57 or the 7x57.
ozhunter

I'd tend to go with a Sauer....

while I own several 7 x 57s, the 6.5 x 57 is my favorite cartridge...

I only have ONE 6.5 x 57... that one is a rebarreled Model 70 with a heavy magnum contoured barrel, with a 28 inch length... I originally built it for a long range rifle.. for antelope and mule deer at long distances...

It weights 10.5 lbs, but I have still liked it enough to haul deer hunting with it many times...It has accounted for 3 or 4 Oregon Blacktail deer...

I don't know if Sako chambers it, but that would be my first choice if they did!

Enjoy it as I have enjoyed mine!

cheers
seafire

quote:

Originally posted by seafire/B17G:
I'd tend to go with a Sauer....

while I own several 7 x 57s, the 6.5 x 57 is my favorite cartridge...

I only have ONE 6.5 x 57... that one is a rebarreled Model 70 with a heavy magnum contoured barrel, with a 28 inch length... I originally built it for a long range rifle.. for antelope and mule deer at long distances...

It weights 10.5 lbs, but I have still liked it enough to haul deer hunting with it many times...It has accounted for 3 or 4 Oregon Blacktail deer...

I don't know if Sako chambers it, but that would be my first choice if they did!

Enjoy it as I have enjoyed mine!

cheers
seafire

Hey John,

Ever tried the 6.5X65 RWS, you miserable bastard?

How about the quality of the rifles listed? Are there any to avoid? Are they all about the same regardless of price as far as accuracy and function?

I would choose the Sauer and avoid the Zoli

Sauer 202, the only way to go.

I have a 7x57 and 7x57R as well as 6.5x57R. My 7x57 is exactly what your discribing as it is a custom Mauser stutzen.
I try not to get carryed away on this forum pontifacating my opinions as I know that they only best fit my personal circumstances.
Having said that I stongly suggest either the merkle K1 or the Blaser K95. Heres why. Stutzens are a pain in the butt. Yes they are sexy cute little rifles but that is somthing you will have to look out for while your in germany. I brought a sexy cute wife home from Bayern once and she was a pain in my butt also.
I was pritty sure that Germany was going to declare war on the state of Alaska when I sent her back.
The biggest problem with a stutzen is of course the bedding in the barrel. They tend to change P.O.I. on a day by day basis. Many of the problem's with the stutzens are overcome by the split forarm on the single shot's. Also the light weight and compactabilety of the kipplauf systems will aid you while traveling and hunting in the mountains. When hunting with a nice gun like these it's really nice to be able to take them down and carry them in your back pack untill you get to your stand or up on the mountain. My last chamois I took in Bayern and I didn't take the rifle out of my pack untill the forester told me to shoot one.
Caliber is your choice. You will find that the 6.5x57 ammo will be a little more availble in Germany but of course both can be easaly found there. It's when you return to the U.S. that you'll find the 7x57 much more availble especially if you buy the gun in the rimmed vertion. Still I have both and have no problem scrounging up ammo and components.

quote:

Originally posted by wildboar:
Stutzen rifles can be less accurate than ordinary rifles, due to the wood touching the barrel up to the muzzle.

This is absolutely true, but I made two Mann/Schoen. 20" stutzen carbines into 1.25 MOA shooters by free-floating the barrels and reshaping the front sling swivel screw slot in the barrel lug so barrel expansion would not change the pressure on the barrel.

quote:

Hey John,

Ever tried the 6.5X65 RWS, you miserable bastard?



Cheers,

Blair338/378 WBY

Naw Blair,

That is too odd ball for my tastes...I found the 6.5 bore, is overbore on ANY case bigger than the 6.5 x 55 or 6.5 x 57...

I tested a 6.5 /06 a friend owned, and I got the same velocity in a 6.5 x 57, using a lot less powder overall.. plus I could seat the bullets out longer....which I like to do 'for accuracy'.. at least in my book..

The only down side is that the 6.5/06 can use more plentiful 06 and 270, or 25/06 brass....

For the 6.5 x 57, I use less plentiful 257 Roberts Brass... but I bought 300 cases some years ago, and that has kept me in brass for a long time.. I don't think I have even gone thru and killed the first 100 cases of it yet...

Now as far as "miserable Bastard"????

I may be a bastard, but as far as Miserable..... I got out of being miserable when I got rid of my first wife, way back in 1987.... been pretty happy since then....Minus the government making themselves a dominate part of my life for 17 years, with that little racket they like to call "child support".... but that is another story....

And my opinion of them, and firearms shouldn't be mixed in the same topic of conversation....


HOWEVER,

..... &

ought to give you an idea of my opinion on the subject........

My current and best 6.5x57mm is a Steyr-Mannlicher Model L rifle. It shoots S&B factory ammo into an inch at 100 yards, and I've loaded up on RWS brass as well. I cannot say enough good about the initial field performance, except that it lays them down where they stand.

LLS

quote:

Originally posted by El Deguello:

quote:

Originally posted by wildboar:
Stutzen rifles can be less accurate than ordinary rifles, due to the wood touching the barrel up to the muzzle.

This is absolutely true, but I made two Mann/Schoen. 20" stutzen carbines into 1.25 MOA shooters by free-floating the barrels and reshaping the front sling swivel screw slot in the barrel lug so barrel expansion would not change the pressure on the barrel.

You are right! A good friend of mine has a very nice Mauser 66 stutzen cal. 7x64 that became very accurate, after he did the very same alterations.

There are several tricks to overcome the problems of the stutzen forends. unfortunantly none of this ever comes from the factory that way.

I also had a mod 66 stutzen in 7x64 for a few years and did a lot of hunting with it. I was unhappy with accuracy in the begening but I have to say that I cured all of the problem when I cut the stock down.

quote:

may be a bastard, but as far as Miserable..... I got out of being miserable when I got rid of my first wife, way back in 1987.... been pretty happy since then....Minus the government making themselves a dominate part of my life for 17 years, with that little racket they like to call "child support".... but that is another story....

John,

You should know by now that is just an Ozzie figure of speech

All the best, mate.

Gidday Seafire,

The definition of child support:

The screwing you get for the screwing you got.

I have only two years more of it to go and then I'm free.

Happy Hunting

Hamish

quote:

Originally posted by El Deguello:

quote:

Originally posted by wildboar:
Stutzen rifles can be less accurate than ordinary rifles, due to the wood touching the barrel up to the muzzle.

This is absolutely true, but I made two Mann/Schoen. 20" stutzen carbines into 1.25 MOA shooters by free-floating the barrels and reshaping the front sling swivel screw slot in the barrel lug so barrel expansion would not change the pressure on the barrel.

I made full length stock for my brother's Chilean 1895 7mm with a long 1892 Spanish stock. The stock kept bending over and touching the barrel, and I could not relieve it enough. The desire to have a gun that looks like an African big game movie is there, but not the easy path to accuracy.

I can personaly vouch for the accuracy of Blaser K95s in 6.5x57R having had 2 barrels shoot sub 0.5MOA. I know of others who have stutzen K95s that are extremely accurate.

I should warn you that being a single shot with no action the muzzle is close enough on a 24" that it is quite unpleasant - on a 20" stutzen the muzzle blast will be distinctly unpleasant!

6.5x57 with 26" barrel really sings (140gr 2,850fps - 100gr 3,300fps)

quote:

Originally posted by Blair338/378:

quote:

may be a bastard, but as far as Miserable..... I got out of being miserable when I got rid of my first wife, way back in 1987.... been pretty happy since then....Minus the government making themselves a dominate part of my life for 17 years, with that little racket they like to call "child support".... but that is another story....

John,

You should know by now that is just an Ozzie figure of speech

All the best, mate.

Way ahead of ya Blair...

But I noticed ya changed your Handle.. Blair 338/378... need fuel injected testosterone????

Those Roos starting to shoot back???

quote:

The screwing you get for the screwing you got.

yeah but all of mine wasn't with my ex, and she never knew that,

quote:

Originally posted by Akshooter:
There are several tricks to overcome the problems of the stutzen forends. unfortunantly none of this ever comes from the factory that way.

Yes. I never could understand this. When I lived in Germany, I even knew some German gunsmiths who refused to make Mannlicher-style stocks for this reason - even after I demonstrated the forend treatment that would make them shoot (some of these guys cut the forend separate from the rest of the stock, held to the barrel by a couple of keys through from one side to the other, like a Kentucky rifle.....)