I friend of mine has a Sako 222Rem.

He is thinking to do an upgrade to 222Rem Mag.

What is the difference between these two calibres?

Can he use 222Rem brass to fire form to 222Rem Mag?

Thank you for your info.

Gerhard

quote:

Originally posted by Jakkals:
I friend of mine has a Sako 222Rem.
Thank you for your info.

Gerhard

quote:

He is thinking to do an upgrade to 222Rem Mag.

Don't...the upgrade isn't costly but the loss of the value of the rifle is and the gains are minimal

quote:

What is the difference between these two calibres?

A couple hundred feet/sec.....not enough to be extremely valuable in the field.

quote:

Can he use 222Rem brass to fire form to 222Rem Mag?

No....it's to short.

The sako in 222 is a sweet little varmint rifle. I wouldn't touch it at all.

What would the velocity difference between a 20 inch and a 24 inch barrel be in a 222Rem be?

Thanks

Gerhard

Gerhard,

Good advice from v-d on the .222 Rem., vs. the .222 Rem. Mag. - net, I wouldn't butcher up a nice Sako. If the rifle has a magazine you could end up with catridge length issues. Plus the logisitcal issues on .222 Rem. Mag. brass could be difficult to overcome and .222 Remington's are available just about everywhere. Only thing being made today on the the original .222 Rem. Mag. case today is itself (plus difficult to obtain) and the new .204 Ruger/Hornady.

I've shot a bunch of short barreled .222 Rem. rifles and in the field and under less than sterile conditions there isn't enough noticeable difference in barrel length to make any difference IMO, so I wouldn't worry too much about trying to eak out fps with +/- a couple of inches of barrel in a .222 Rem.

No, you cannot make the correct length .222 Rem. Mag. cases from .222 Remington brass as it is too short.

Hey Gerry,

Good to hear from you again. Hope everything is well in Germany.

The reason I ask about the barrel length is that my friend want to replace the old barrel and now we are uncertain what the benefit of a 24 inch barrel is compared to a 20 inch barrel.

Gerhard

If he is replacing the barrel anyway, then rebarreling with a .222 Magnum chamber is of no consideration as to the value of the gun. I agree with the others that it is a poor practice to rechamber an original Sako barrel.

Assuming that this is a Sako L461 (not the L46 clip-fed model) then the magazine length is the same for both .222 and .222 Magnum, although the Sako box is somewhat crowded with the longer round and very long bullets have to be seated somewhat deeply.

There is not all that much difference in the power and velocity of the two cartridges when loaded to similar pressures. The .222 Magnum is slightly advantageous if you are using heavier bullets for things like small deer. It will typically shoot a bullet 5-7 grains heavier at the same velocity as the .222. In other words, the smaller case will do with a 50 grain bullet what the larger will do with a 55-60 grain bullet. If this is important to you, then go for it. However, the .223 will do essentially the same thing in a much more commonly available case.

Velocity loss with cartridges in this category between a 24 and a 20 inch barrel will be typically less than 100 fps; the more significant issue with the shorter barrel is increased muzzle blast.

If he has the room in the magazine and wants a bit more performance, but doesn't want to have difficult to obtain brass, he might want to consider the 223 ackley improved.

quote:

he might want to consider the 223 ackley improved.

Or the plain old 223 Remington for that matter (and take advantage of standard dies to boot). But I've been told by more than one 'smith that its better to set the barrel back a couple threads so that the 223 chamber cleans up the longer neck of the 222. The only issue after that is the twist. Many 222s came with a 1:14, which may not stabilize heavier bullets if that's what the OP's pal is after.

I considered almost the same thing several years ago when I acquired a used Rem 700 ADL in .222 Rem. I think it was Jack Belk who recommended I stick with the deuce and he sure was right. That thing is a tack-driver and I wouldn't notice the difference in speed next to the 222 Mag or .223 unless I shot it over the chrono. The Coyotes and PDs I've shot with it haven't mentioned noticing any difference.

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I considered almost the same thing several years ago when I acquired a used Rem 700 ADL in .222 Rem. I think it was Jack Belk who recommended I stick with the deuce and he sure was right.

Yeah, that's what one of the 'smiths recommended. My rifle was one of the walking varminters H&R built on the Sako short action using a buggywhip barrel and a Weatherby/California style stock. It just wouldn't settle down so I rebarreled to 223 1:9 and have no complaints. Still, the Deuce was a seriously handy little rifle.

WWWWWWWWWWWWWaaaaaay back in 1970 I bought a Sako L-461 action for $90...it was beastly expeensive!!

I attached and chambered for 222 a Star barrel I bought from Herters and milled it to octagon/ round with an integral full length vent rib.....a helluva thing!!!!!

I cut it to 16 1/4" to be legal.....everyone said it wouldn't shoot......

That thing still to this day holds my prairiedog shooting record at 39 consecutive hits!!! (stopped only by hitting a barbed wire fence)

I speak from experience when I say that a shortbarreled 222 is a fine varmint rifle.

Time passed and I attached a winchester take off barrel with a 1-14 twist (formerly a 22-250) and added a pretty classic Claro stock and rechambered to 223.....this is a keeper as well!!!

Jakkals: Here in the states I have been subjected to this "222 Mag brass is drying up" rumor every so often - for at least 25 years now! In the first decade or two every time I heard this rumor I went out and bought some more 222 Remington Magnum brass!
I now have a "3 lifetimes" supply of 222 Remington Magnum brass! It takes up one whole drawer in my loading room!
And being a "worry wart" (one who enjoys worrying!) every time I go to a Gunshop I look to see if they have 222 Remington Magnum brass in stock - very often they do!
My favorite Gunshop has it by the thousands - ALWAYS!
DO NOT stay away from building and enjoying a 222 Magnum Rifle in this splendid cartridge because of worries about brass.
I also use the Remington 222 Remington Magnum brass for my 6x47 Remington 40XB-BRKS! Now there is a shooting machine!
Personally I think you loose "more" with the smallish barrels (shorter) in steady holding ability afield, than the less important F.P.S. loss! I GREATLY prefer long, heavy barrels for their increased accuracy under field conditions - over the shorter lighter barrels. Plus... YES, the longer barrels give you "free" velocity. This free velocity makes for slightly flatter trajectories and this, as we all know, gives a higher percentage of hits out in the field!
Steadier "holds" in the field (more hits!), free velocity (means flatter trajectories = more hits!) yeah go with the longer barrel length.
Best of luck to you and your friend on the new project Rifle!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Thank you for all the advice guys.

He will probably stay with the 222Rem due to the problem of getting brass in South Africa for the 22Rem Mag and because he all ready has a lot of brass for the deuce.

He will also probably go with a 20 inch barrel because he thinks a 24 inch barrel with a silencer is just to cumbersome.

I disagree with him my 22K Hornet has a 26 inch barrel and with a silencer it’s really long but it doesn’t bother me but that’s just personal preference.

Enjoy the day.

Gerhard

Wow!
You want an answer to your question, post it on the AR board!
Thanx Jakkals for asking intelligent questions on behalf of your dumb buddy!
Thanx guys for all these pro answers - I need to sleep on the issue of barrel length but read the demonized firearms act today regarding caliber changes and our law. This might require someone to bake me a cake with a file.
Lochi.

Stay with the 222Rem. As for barrel length a 20 is fine. My Rem 40xBR with a heavy 20" barrel with easily do 40 gr BT @ 3700 fps. I would shoot the current barrel until it goes south then rebarrel to a length that is ideal for the field condition it will be used.

Mike

I really like the duece!

Best local load I know:

Moly'd 52gr Sierra BTHP Match, 23.5gr S321, a Speer CCI small rifle primer, Sako Cases, seat the bullet on the lands if you can. 3200fps out my Sako Vixen and sticks 'em all in a R2 coin at 200m.

Murder on dassies!

I'm a .222 Rem Mag feaque, but given the choice of a straight .222, or a .222 Rem mag, stick with the .222 ! Reason? The cases for the Mag are just becoming too hard to find. Sure, I have an arsenal worth of the proper brass, but that does not help a newbie!!!