Anyone had bullets tumble with the Remington 17 caliber.
25 grai Hornady hp molly coated
H 414 = 26.0 grains
fed gold 210 M primers
seat at 2.160"

shot 3 into 1/2 inch then 2 with perfect bullet outline at 10 oclock from the 3 .all in 1 inch group.
Anyone have a cure?

Bullets too long for the twist in your bore?

other causes may be worn rifling (especially w/ .17 - .22 cal), deformed bullets (even slightly), or overloading (even if load is within spec, your rifle may not like it).

I have little experience with .17, but have seen this with .22-250, .220 Swift (especially!), and with .25-06.

I would suspect:

1. Moly coating!!
2. Heavilky fouled bore.

I had this problem a few years ago with sako 17 rem and hornady 25. Serious barrel clean solved the problem. I clean barrel better and more often now, no more keyholes.

Thanks all

Yeah the barrel was a little dirty,gave it a good soak with Sweets,brushed and meney patchs tell no blue.
Have Wipeout on order,hope the stuff works.

This is a used rifle,So it may have some hard use.But it has shot some good groups for me.Hornady has been the best bullet so far,Calhoons not working all that good,will after them oh.
Thanks again.

I would bet a bunch that the good scrubbing will bring it around.

JB Compound.

I can not shoot stick and ball powder without cleaning between them. Also in my Rem. barrel groups can not be mixed between copper jacketed bullets and the silver ? plated Calhoons. That causes tumbling every time in the Rem. Not so with my Douglas barreled Sako. 17s can be touchy.

Hello Pete

You can say again the 17 is picky.

Or that I fouled the barrel real bad.Took 2 days to clean it,but patch comes out white now.Sweets and a lot of brushing,CR 10 and let it soak.JB about a 100 strokes.Then more Sweats.

I did notice things went to hell mixing Calhoons and copper ,begers didn't get to the target or tunmbled.
This barrel really likes Starke bare bullets.will shoot 5 into a dime.

Have backed off on the powder ,lose primers after some hot ones.Also doing best for groups with H-380.
Still fiddling with loads.

Fun rifle ,That is why you want to shoot so much and clean less.

have you used Benchmark powder?20 gr behind 25 gr bullet was good,but can be better.

Had a primer back out,with a smoking bolt.That was scary,that got a lot of brass tossed in the trash can.

Glade you said not to mix long powder with ball.That is some of my next loads.

Take care and good shooting.

I'd like to see some 17 shooters moly coat their own bullets, MINUS
the wax coating, and then see what happens. I have done extensive
testing with my 14/218 with moly after hearing much speculation. If
I can get moly to shoot in a high pressure, ultra velocity 14, and have
little accuracy or cleaning problems, then there must certainly
be something to this.

I really think it is the wax instead of the moly that is "building up"
in barrels. Think about it, what does the inside of your 22 lr look like.
After hearing of the cleaning ordeal you went through to get it out,
I'm even more convinced.

I do see a puff of something about 20 feet from my muzzle when
shooting unwaxed moly coated bullets. Whether it is shucking the
moly or what I don't know. The bullet still makes a dark impression
on the target like moly.

I do know that moly shoots much differently in my 14 than bare
copper. There is about a 4" difference in point of impact, and the
moly will shoot a half inch group all day while I'm doing good to
get 1" with copper. But then, I hear of someone using the same
exact twist barrel, same lot of bullets I shoot (I make them), that
puts them in .3"!

If I can go 50 shots with a 14 without accuracy degradation, like
Walt Berger, then certainly you could do it with a 17. Gotta be the
wax!

I have a friend that shoots a very accurate Mach IV, I'll see if I
can talk him into helping me proove this theory.

BTW, I shoot Benchmark in my 14. More powder weight than bullet
weight!

I'd like to try some Starkes but have never ordered any. Burgers are very accurate in both my 17s. I like the Hornady 20gr. VMax for ground squirrel shooting. I moly coat the bullets and also wax them. The load I shoot in my single shot L46 Sako is:
20gr. V Max
24.5grs of IMR4320
CCI benchrest primers
velocity is 4080fps.
This isn't a hot load but it is averageing 1/2in. for 5 shots out of the #4 Douglas barrel.
I have fired in excess of 50 rounds between cleanings.

I have used 25 gr. Bergers naked and mollied by myself. The velocity dropped just a tad and there is no change in POI or accuracy. The only signifigant change is the cleaning interval. It went from fouled at 6 or 7 shots to a slight degradation at 25 shots. The barrel is a 26" stainless Shilen in 17 Rem. If and when I shoot it out I will put on another Shilen and chamber to 17/222. Much more efficient cartridge.
I coat my bullets in a pill bottle in a Thumler tumbler with #8 shot and no wax. I remove moly from the barrel with elbow grease. I have also used 25 gr. Hornadys with the same results.

Hello small bore shooters.

Would like to know if any of you have used AAMXR 2015 powder
use it yesterday with a load of 22.0 gr behind 20 gr V max.it is fast got readings for 5 shots of a low of 4386 to 4498.a group of 1 1/4 sort of strung to the 2 o clock

I see someone is using Benchmark,would you care to give a starting load for it.?

used a load of BM =22 gr ,7 1/2 and Hornady 25 gr HP #1710 bullets 5 shots ran in the 3620 range on speed.but the groups were .80"
very clean burning.

This gun don't seem to like Berger bullets,or maybe it is the Molly coat.
Also see that puff 30 foot from the barrel.

Starke bullets shoot the best ,they are uncoated.1/2" and at times the way I shoot a nice one hole at 3/8".

Hope there will be some info.Thanks

I have found that with Berger bullets, 25g and 30g, if you push them too fast they have a tendency to come apart. Somewhere around 3600 fps or above. I have used both moly coated and uncoated. If I keep the velocity at or below 3600 fps, I get great accurucy

Big 17

My .17 rem was built on a .223 M700 and would shoot in the .2's with starke 25 gr bullets and 23.1 grs of Varget, but sporatically keyholed 5 shots into a 1 inch group with 25gr Bergers with the same load. 20 gr Bergers worked very well and never keyholed. I went through the whole barrel cleaning /copper fouling cause and effect concept and was unable to improve the situation. I also had consistently center ( only) cratered primers due to the stock .223 fireing pin hole. After talking with Greg Tannel, I bushed the firing pin hole to .062 and turned down the Rem firing pin to fit. Since then, no keyholing with any bullet and no cratered primers.-Rob

most of the solutions listed by these fellows are very sound advice...if you continue having problems with their suggestions being tried consider checking loaded rounds for concenticity (bullets being seated squarely/straight in the case. Those little needles are real easy to start up the die crooked. If that does'nt do it I did'nt notice anybody mention a possible nick or ding in the muzzle...hope the easiest solution works out best...mildot

The 17 I have is a stock Rem 700 BDL.

Have fixed the tumbleing problem.Lots of elbow grease with a brush on the first 12 inch of the barrel ahead of the chamber.Was getting a build up of burnt powder after 15 shots or so.Cleaning between copper,and plated bullets,also ball and large grain powder.If I don't clean from one powder to the next groups open up.

What seems to help is to not trim back to -.010.keeping them just .002 from max length for a better bullet grip.turning necks,and useing a Redding button die.

went to just 20 gr and 25 gr Hornadys but mainly shooting 25 gr Starkes.they still give the smallist group of any.These 2 brands of bullets hold up to 4427 FPS.

7 1/2 or Fed . match primers.

Anyone use Calhoon bullets ?