I recently acquired a Spanish (Oviedo 1907) small ring mauser rifle with a intermediate length mag box. It is currently chambered in 7X57. The existing barrel doesn't look too good inside or out so I am thinking of having it rebarreled, re-triggered w/safety or have a Buehler safety installed, receiver drilled and tapped AND do away with the cock-on-closing feature.

The action does not look exceptionally strong to me with the deep cut for the bolt lugs in the receiver and and a little research shows that others feel the same way. All have suggested medium pressure loadings or cartridges for small ring mausers. So I have been looking at the 6.5X55 Svede or 6.5X57. (already have 7X57 and 8X57)

Any positives or negatives to either ones mentioned?
Any other cals./carts. that I have overlooked?
Also any barrel, trigger, and safety recommendations?
I would like to find a step-down barrel that won't break the bank.

add the .257 Roberts to your list.

quote:

add the .257 Roberts to your list.

I would have added the 6mm Rem but operating pressures would concern me.

Hmmmmm, yes to suggestions of a 257 Roberts and while I'd like to recommend the 6mm remington, don't think its a good idea. The 250 Savage should be OK to consider, pressure wise.

As to an inexpensive barrel, might want to peruse through Midways A&B barrels that are short chambered and threaded for small ring mausers. But if I remember correctly, the small ring A&B barrel is probably their F14 contour, their thinnest contour. Have a couple of their F54 barrels, the heaviest contour, and I can get 1/2" or so 100 yard groups with them. Walter Lothar does make step barrel replacements for mausers, but will cost more than an A&B.

OK, I'm gonna go out on a limb a bit on the strength of those Spanish Mausers. A couple of years back Kimber took a bunch of them that had been rebarreled to the 7.62 NATO round and that's a 52KPSI cartridge. According to what I read on this, Kimber had the guns pressure tested by the H.P. White Laboratory and they pronounced the guns safe. Now the 93 Mausers don't have that third lug for extra safety and the 95 Muasers have a sort of half ass safety lug but neither have the strength of the 98 Mausers. Now I don't know to what level H.P. White's proof ammo went to regarding the pressure but it has to be a hell of a lot higher than 52KPSI.
I once had a 1916 Oviedo Mauser in 7x57 that had been reworked into one of the lighetst and sweetest sporters you'll ever see. It had been made up in England by some small shop I never heard of and to this day I've been kicking myself for ever selling it.
I've only seen a couple of those 7.62.308 Win. Kimbers but they didn't look aall that bad to me.
The big problem with them as I undestand it is they don't handle escaping gs as well as the 98 Mauser. That can be easily fixed to some degree by drilling hole in the appropriate places. Look and an M98 or Winchester M70 ot other modern gun. There's a hole in the receiver ring and a couple in the botton of the bolt. Unfortunately thee's no flange at the back of the bolt to divert gas and I don't know if you can make one or not? Frankly, I just happened to think about that just this very moment.
Personally, and this it strictly just my opinion, those gun may be better than they have been made out to be.
I don't have much use for a 6MM Rem. but a lightweight .257 Robt. or even another 7x57 would float my boat, especially the 7x57. That and the .35 Whelen are what I've been playing with for the last couple of years.
Anyway, that's my dissenting opinion on the 93/95 Mausers. I'll be honest though, even if I were to use one for a round like the 6MM Rem., I sure wouldn't try to hot rod the round. I'd load to factory level but that's as far as I would go with it.
Paul B.

The M93 maybe safe enough but it is never going to be worth half of what you put in it. There are better ways to spend your time and money.

quote:

Originally posted by SR4759:
The M93 maybe safe enough but it is never going to be worth half of what you put in it. There are better ways to spend your time and money.

I never said it would be worth lot of money or that one would get their money back. The question was about the safety of the conversion and that's what I responded to.
Paul B.

quote:

Originally posted by SR4759:
The M93 maybe safe enough but it is never going to be worth half of what you put in it. There are better ways to spend your time and money.

EXACTLY.....I wouldn't give a dime for a truckload of'93s but that's not the point here.....it's his money and his time and he should spend it his way!

So it sounds like; takes my chances with a A&B barrel, Boyd Al-ready finished stock, a Dayton Traister trigger w/speed-lock kit plus g-smith work to install all and drill/tap receiver.
Guess I'll stay with 6.5 Svedish. Not too much expen$ive there.
The rifle (action...really...as nothing else is really any good) was a give-me so I think I can afford a little investment.
Guess it depends on how you look at it.
Thanks for the replies.

If you chamber for the 6.5 Swede, be careful what ammo you use in it. Domestic ammo is loaded to moderate pressures - 51,000 psi. European ammo is loaded to much higher pressures, as is some domestic load data - 58,000 psi or higher. That won't disassemble an M93, but it won't make it any stronger either. Sounds like a real fun project - all the rationalization the OP needs.


.

Thanks for the advise TxNimrod, but I will be reloading for whatever I end up with and will watch closely just the same.

I built a .300 Savage on one out of spare parts and a barrel Vapo. Sold me for $40. I wouldn't do it again, cool little rifle but not worth the money.

How timley!!!I have a very clean low milage action from a 1924 short rifle that didn't appear to have been used at all when I got it...,and am now trying to decide what to build on it...,I want a low pressure medium bore, .35 Rem,9x57,9.3x57,or I may shorten a '06 bbl and cut it to a .300 Savage for an all 'rounder with near ORIGINAL '06 performance.
WHADDA YA THINK?
I once saw a real nice rifle buit on a Spanish SR in 5.56X52R,stocked in the old Oberndorf style that I'd really like to copy.

quote:

Originally posted by Panzerschmied:
How timley!!!I have a very clean low milage action from a 1924 short rifle that didn't appear to have been used at all when I got it...,and am now trying to decide what to build on it...,I want a low pressure medium bore, .35 Rem,9x57,9.3x57,or I may shorten a '06 bbl and cut it to a .300 Savage for an all 'rounder with near ORIGINAL '06 performance.
WHADDA YA THINK?
I once saw a real nice rifle buit on a Spanish SR in 5.56X52R,stocked in the old Oberndorf style that I'd really like to copy.

I have basically all of the above and of them, the 9.3x57 operates at the lowest presures and serves up the biggest whallop.

But my latest was a Brazilian 94 in .300 Savage. Very light and trim despite the 24" barrel.

Hmmmmm, 9X and 9.3X sound very interesting as those
slots are open for me as well as 6.5X.
Good suggestions.
But I think I will stay with a 6.5x probably a 55mm Swede.

quote:

Originally posted by Rae59:
Hmmmmm, 9X and 9.3X sound very interesting as those
slots are open for me as well as 6.5X.
Good suggestions.
But I think I will stay with a 6.5x probably a 55mm Swede.

Next to the 9,3x57, that is my favorite in a SR too.

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

quote:

Originally posted by SR4759:
The M93 maybe safe enough but it is never going to be worth half of what you put in it. There are better ways to spend your time and money.

EXACTLY.....I wouldn't give a dime for a truckload of'93s but that's not the point here.....it's his money and his time and he should spend it his way!

It maybe Vapo but I am not going to encourage him. Most 93's were made in Spain and are rude and crude no matter what you do. If I had a M93 made in Germany that was an action only I would be tempted to play with it in a .257 or 9x57.

If you go 257, be careful with +P loads.

One thing you might consider is to get a M96 barrel in 6.5x55. There still seem to be a few NOS barrels floating around. At one time, I bought a boxfull of the from Numrich for $19.95/ea. They are more than that now, but still cheap when you find one. There were both rifle and carbine barrels. I recently used my last carbine barrel to build a Mannlicher on a small ring, and it shot well. I simply tapered the steps and polished. Head space came out OK with no adjustments.

Rae59, sounds like a nice little rifle in the making. I know I have a small ring Mauser and love it, light, short and handles well. One thing I'd say is stay away from the Dayton Traister Trigger, the Bold is a better trigger, will work with the speed lock conversion, and is a few bucks cheaper. Have fun and let us know how it works out.
http://www.boydsgunstocks.com/...RIGGER-p/100-006.htm

Art, I thought the same thing so I checked with Numrich but no got a takeoff barrel in 6.5. Didn't sound real promising either.
MadJack, I'll check out your trigger suggestion.
Thankyou both. This is the type of information I am looking for.
By the way SR 4759, this particular Spanish action appears to be of pretty
good quality as far as I can tell. Not rough or crude at all.
But thanks for your concerns.

quote:

Originally posted by Rae59:
Hmmmmm, 9X and 9.3X sound very interesting as those
slots are open for me as well as 6.5X.
Good suggestions.
But I think I will stay with a 6.5x probably a 55mm Swede.

If it was mine, and I was just going to depend on handloads instead of having something which could also shoot easily available factory ammo, my choices would be these, in order of preference:


1. 6.5 x57 Mauser
2. 9m/m Mauser
3. .338 Federal

If I was going to shoot factory ammo, my preferences would be, again in order of preference:

1. 7x57 Mauser
2. .257 Roberts
#. .35 Remington

The .35 Remington would take a lot more work and probably substantially more money unless you are building it yourself, so would be a very distant third choice. If you were just going to use U.S. LOADED factory ammo, I'd probably also list the 8m/m Mauser, but because of the availability of HOT European surplus ammo on the market, I didn't list it.

I'd buy a nice pair of shooting glasses and download the 7X57's.

Terry

A.c., Thank you for your suggestions. I have always found your posts to be very sound and level headed.
As I stated earlier, I already have a 7X57 and 8x57. I also have a 250-3000 which covers me in the 25 cal. category for the time being. I do not have anything in the 6.5 slot nor any 9mm/9.3.
I also felt it (my new chambering) should stay in a cartridge accustomed to the Mauser name if you know what I mean. A 9X57 might be in the futue but a 6.5 something would serve me better for my current needs/wants.

A.C. I am curious as to why a 6.5X55 Swede wasn't on your suggestion list?
Factory ammo as well as reloading components seem readily available for the Swede.
I seriously thought about a 6.5x57 but I figured finding someone with a reamer would be a pain and/or more costly. Could be wrong on that one though. Anyway the wheels have been in motion for a week now and the 6.5X55 chambered barrel is already in the smith's hands.

I also have been thinking really hard about a 6.5-06 for a long-action donor I have.

Hi, Rae -

I just like the 6.5x57 better because it is closer to the length and shape cartridge the Model '93 Spanish Mauser was originally designed for.

As you no doubt recall, all the Mausers had magazine boxes/followers built specifically for the cartridge they were chambered in. That doesn't mean they won't function without any major glitches using many other cartridges, though.

Just means that for me, they always seem to do their very best with cartridges closest in size and shape to the ones they were built for originally. I like my rifles to not only feed reliably, but as "slickly" as possible, so I try to match original magazine-to-cartridge specs if I can.

(I am not saying that is a "must-do rule" or anything like that...just that generally that is the way it has worked out for me for very top functioning. I am sure other folks have had varying experiences.)

Another reason I like the 6.5x57 is that it is a very early, very original Mauser chambering for the 6.5 bore. A "classic", as it were.

And it is every bit as effective as the 6.5x55 which came along a couple of years later, possibly even more effective if one were prone to counting the number of angels dancing on the head of a pin..

You may also recall that almost every major country or bloc of countries in those days adopted a slightly different cartridge in "their" Mauser. I suspect that wasn't because the variation they chose was any better, but because it denied their neighbors (and maybe future oponents) the chance of using the same rifle and/or ammo against them during time of war.

It was also a morale booster for their troops to have their own "better" cartridge...and of course the "home" one is always better. Just ask the Drill Instructor, Gyrene!

So, being a bit of a traditionalist stick-in-the-mud, I like to go with original designs as long as it doesn't cost any meaningful performance in the field.

I do admire the 6.5x55 too. Had it been a M'94 Swede carbine (one of my all-time favourites for deer) or a M'96 up through M'38 rifle from Scandehoovia that you are contemplating barreling, the 6.5x55 would have been on my list.

Thanks for the response A.C.

I have built several rifles on SR Mauser actions, but have never been impressed with those made in Spain. IMO, the greatest weakness of the pre-1898 style SR Mausers is their lack of a large gas shield. Brownells and MidwayUSA sell commercial style bolt shrouds with a larger gas shield, but you'll need a Bold or Timney trigger with a safety.

Whenever I build on a SR Mauser action, all Swedish and mostly Husqvarnas built during the early 1940s, I replace the bolt shrouds with a commercial style shroud, install a Dayton-Traister cock-on-opening kit, and a Bold or Timney trigger with a safety. The hardest part to find on a SR Mauser build is a good stock at a reasonable price. The best option that I've found are Boyds', but they require a bit of inletting and the laminated stocks are kind of heavy.

Good luck with your build.

Jeff

260remguy,
I think I might be having trouble finding a stock also. My smith measured the screw centers at 7-3/4".
Boyds shows only 7-5/8" or 7-7/8" centers for Mauser actions. I'm not sure if either can made be to fit.
Have you encountered the same thing?

quote:

Originally posted by Rae59:
260remguy,
I think I might be having trouble finding a stock also. My smith measured the screw centers at 7-3/4".
Boyds shows only 7-5/8" or 7-7/8" centers for Mauser actions. I'm not sure if either can made be to fit.
Have you encountered the same thing?

Would it not be possible to move one side of the action bolt holes forward or backward as required (making the holes into "slots"), then install pillars in beds of epoxy in those slots, maintaining the correct distances between their centers? I have done that a couple of times about 35 years ago using Bisonite, and it worked okay for me. It's not what I would prefer to do, but it was invisible when the guns were all assembled, and worked fine in the field.

RAE,
I think your gunsmith missed on his number.

Mauser DATA

A.C.
I thought about that also but since I don't have neither action nor the stock in front of me, I am not sure how the the mag. well and original bottom metal, etc. would work out. I have a friend who is a retired stock maker who I am going to ask to fit it all together for me. He said he was not that familiar with the Boyd stocks but I am sure he can come up with something and have it look nice. He is also a pretty knowledgable Mauser man.

SR4759,
I have read that stuff too and as you said I am hoping my smith missed the numbers on this particular action but I kind of doubt it. He is pretty sharp with things and seems to really know his way around Mausers.
I am sure something can be made to work and look descent too.