I'm trying to load the 80 grain Speer Deep Curl in my 6X47 Rem Stevens 200 that I built. This bullet and pretty much any other bullet heaver than 70 grains gives me a bit of a fit. I've found the speed I want from the bullet and have been chasing seating depth trying to get better groups.
Posted in the picture are two three shot groups from the same rifle on the same day. The 70 grain Nosler BT group is a little better than average than my normal three shot group out of it as it usually hovers under a .5" at 100. Day in and out it is a consistent .5 MOA rifle for three shots at 100 and 300 yards after three the groups open up as the lighter contour barrel heats up. One of these days I'll get around to a better than factory stock on the rifle.
The 80 grain DC load has been driving me nuts. I've got the speed that I want and I'd be happy with a consistent .75-1" group but it just shoots all over the place. I'll have one load that shows promise but go back and shoot it another day and will be someplace different or just open up.
I'd hoped to use the Deep Curl bullet for an up coming deer hunt so I wouldn't have to be as picky about shot placement. However, looks like I'll be hunting again with my 70 grain NBT load. I haven't used it on white tail deer but, it has quite handily dispatched pronghorn out to 300+ yards.
Originally posted by graybird: I'd scoot the scope over about 1 click to the right, grab the Nosler BTs and go kill a deer!!!
One click right, and I'm thinking six to seven up that will put me at 3.25" high at 100. That will give me a MPBR of 330 yards on a 8" diameter target. That is where I usually run it anyway. I've just been cranking on the adjustments trying to get it dialed in for the 80 grain bullets.
Some rifles just don't "like" some bullets. And some bullets which have performed flawlessly in one rifle will refuse to perform in another rifle which has proven equally accurate on average.
You can chase accuracy with a particular bullet endlessly by varying powder charges, changing powders, changing primers, monkeying with seating depth, ad nauseum. When one doesn't respond to a couple of different efforts I'd advise to save your time and money and simply move on to another bullet.
Posts: 13265 | Location: Henly, TX, USA | Registered: 04 April 2001
over the years i've had more trouble getting speers to shoot than all others combined. when they do they do beautifully, but the rest of the time its chit
I'll probably try a different powder and maybe primer. This rifle has been so easy to load for as long as I stay light and push fast, I've just been spoiled. I'm not giving up on the DC bullet yet as I do want a little tougher bullet if my Daughter has to use it to hunt Colorado in a couple of years.
If you know someone with a bullet spinner then go spin a few of the DC bullets to see just how badly they are made. I suspect they just don't spin out well because of the jackets they use.
Originally posted by Pegleg: If you know someone with a bullet spinner then go spin a few of the DC bullets to see just how badly they are made. I suspect they just don't spin out well because of the jackets they use.
What is the barrel twist? My experience is that a longer (usually heavier except in all copper or powdered copper core bullets i.e. Varmint Grenades) require a faster twist. I had the same problem with the 6mm Barnes 62 grain varmint Grenade that wouldn't hit the target backer at 100 yards in a 6mm PPC Sako, and when it did the bullets were going sideways. The 1:14" twist wouldn't stabilize the longer bullet (0.975"). Tried a 1:10" twist in a Savage action, better but no cigar, then went to a 1:8" twist and groups shrank to bug holes. If the twist is too slow that bullet will never be accurate. Measure one with a dial caliper and plug the numbers in here to determine the minimum twist rate: http://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmstab-5.1.cgi
Originally posted by Wrangler John: What is the barrel twist?
1:12 twist, the Deep Curl is a protected point flat base bullet that is shorter than the 70 grain Nosler BT's. The do have a longer bearing surface but that shouldn't make a whole lot of difference. The Nosler BT is listed as a .910" OAL and the Deep Curl measures .885" in my calipers. Both bullets should be stable as they show up green in the JBM calculator. The ballistic tip is more stable though once you put in the .160" for the plastic tip, if you don't then this bullet falls in the marginal category.
If it was me, I would try a slightly slower powder, just for grins. In most of my rifles, a heavier bullet MAY respond better with a slightly slower powder. If not that, then drop back and punt. (as Stoney said)
Larry
"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading" -- Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 3942 | Location: Kansas USA | Registered: 04 February 2002
Originally posted by larrys: If it was me, I would try a slightly slower powder, just for grins. In most of my rifles, a heavier bullet MAY respond better with a slightly slower powder. If not that, then drop back and punt. (as Stoney said)
I chose 8208 XBR because it was close to TAC in burn which is a pretty slow powder for small cases. I guess I may have to drop to something between it and RL15. I have a little H380 and some Varget I guess I could try.
Try different charges to see if you can move the pressure node to gain smaller groups or go to a different powder and work up from scratch.
I tend to use one of the three powders that give the highest velocity and work up to find the most accurate load. Sometimes you find an accurate load close to the starting load and another at about 95-98% of maximum. Some rare occasions a powder won't produce accuracy until you are at or even slightly above maximum. I tend to stay away from those powders because I don't like running maximum or higher pressures in my guns. Just personal preference.
Speer, Sierra, Lyman, Hornady, Hodgdon have reliable reloading data. You won't find it on so and so's web page.
Posts: 639 | Location: SE WA. | Registered: 05 February 2004
Well even thought I said I wouldn't use the bullet, I did. I took a small whitetail doe at about 175 yards with the 80 grain deep curl. I was basically shooting off hand so I didn't make the best shot, I hit her in the hip knocking her down. I then finished her off by stealing my daughters shooting tripod and using it as a monopod to put the finishing shot in her brisket.
Hitting the bone caused massive damage with these bullets. The entrance wounds in both areas were about softball size, but that's what I get for hitting bone. I'm still not sold on this bullet if I can't get it to shoot any better than I have.
Triangles wanna be closer to the lands. Two in, one out further. Back the powder off a tad, kiss the lands, increase powder until you find pressure and see what happens.....
Originally posted by 16Bore: Triangles wanna be closer to the lands. Two in, one out further. Back the powder off a tad, kiss the lands, increase powder until you find pressure and see what happens.....
I can't get any closer to the lands than .050" and feed from the magazine. The barrel was throated a little long. I'll probably be replacing tbe barrel as well in the near future to one with a faster twist and I'll be working up some dummy rounds to send along to the smith.
I've got a 6x45 twisted 1:9 and am getting ready to try 95 Berger Classic Hunters. If no luck, I'll give 85 Partitions a run. Dunno if you can modify your magbox or not. I took the spacer out (Rem 700) and replaced it with 1/4" aluminum and it grants about 2.60 room to play.
That's from when it was a 223AI. Believe that round is 2.450 with a 75 Amax. Damn fun caliber to shoot, but rebuilt it to accommodate 6mm deer restrictions. Sad thing is the 223AI smokes 6x45. Love how laws are written.
I could modify my magazine box, but I'm not going to. I'll throw a new barrel on first, as opening the magazine would only cure that one little problem. Once I get into most 85 grain bullets they aren't stable. So I'm not going to go to the trouble of modifying a magazine box without going to a faster twist barrel.
Like I said I still killed a deer with that load so I know it works well enough. However, I'll go back to the 70's just because they shoot so well with little fuss. I don't have any real problems using the 70's on pronghorn and smaller which is 90% of what I use the rifle for.
