I have noticed that locally, .223 ammo as well as .45 and 9mm is in very short supply. Any idea why?

I think there is a war going on somewhere in the middle east...like Iraq and Afghanistan...?

Rich
DRSS

Have not seen any shortage here around central Georgia, The small police action overseas is hardly enough for a shortage.

are you refering to actually shooting factory ammo? 223's are coming off my dillion at the same rate as always

Rug, you could not be more wrong, the U.S. military is outsourcing ammo from various allied countries due to the fact that we have only one ammo plant left and it cannot produce enough. If it were not for the Israeli's, we would be throwing rocks. In case you have not noticed, bulk and surplus ammo prices have generally doubled in the last year.
Add in the spiralling cost of metals in the last year due to our Chinese "Friends" buying everything available, you will not see low prices again anytime soon. On the reloading front, brass prices are on their way up also. Lee.

No shortage on the shelves here in New York State or at Cabela's or Midway...

quote:

Originally posted by lee440:
Rug, you could not be more wrong, the U.S. military is outsourcing ammo from various allied countries due to the fact that we have only one ammo plant left and it cannot produce enough. If it were not for the Israeli's, we would be throwing rocks. In case you have not noticed, bulk and surplus ammo prices have generally doubled in the last year.
Add in the spiralling cost of metals in the last year due to our Chinese "Friends" buying everything available, you will not see low prices again anytime soon. On the reloading front, brass prices are on their way up also. Lee.

I'd really be surprised if this were true. I was just at the US Army Winter Symposium and didn't hear anything that could corroborate this (ammo shortage). Got Source?

Just got back from the Bass Pro store here in Atlanta and they had plenty of 223 ammo, price is up alittle bit but not too bad.

i buy ammo for a police department from one of the largest federal ammo distributors in the country. he told me that federal and winchester have diverted most 5.56 ammo to the gov. as of the end of last year. large orders for drop shipment to the department now have an eight month to one year lead time. also the price to the department has almost doubled from last year at this time.

There you have it...

Everyone back east is hoarding it, keeping it out of the hands of we radical Americans out west here!

the price is going up and almost daily.

Supplies usually follow....it's simple I think!

Yeah copper prices are up, but not due to ammo. As far as a shortage of 223,9mm,45acp I have seen no such thing. And there are many other producers besides Federal, and Winchester. But I havent seen any sort of a shortage from them (Fed,Win). Check with Midway, Bass pro shops ,Cabelas or even Walmart. Lee I don't shoot or purchase milsurp crap from 3rd world countries as most of it is corrosive, Just the good stuff from good sources. Happy hunting

Prices have certainly jumped up, and supply, at least around southeastern Washington state seem a bit thin. But what is the story on Remington primers? They seem to be unavailable everywhere, especially the 7 1/2's. I bought a brick of CCI-450's today, just in case, as I recall the last big primer shortage, which miraculously ended after prices rose about 50%.

Just got back from a gunshow at the Farm Show Complex in the state capitol. 1200 tables. I never bothered to check the price as I handload my own .223's, but I did see at least 6 guys rolling hand trucks out of the arena with multiple cases of .223's on each of them. One vendor had cases piled up 5' high. The poor old gent doing the piling almost had a coronary. Easily 100 cases. And there were at least 4 or 5 other vendors that had large case lots in front of their tables. No shortage in central PA!!!

Rug, prices on all metals have been skyrocketing over the last 18 mo. Just ask any scrap dealer. Here in Houston, one of my good friends works closely with most of the scrap dealers and everything they can get their hands on is going in containers to China. As far as Federal, they are operating, under contract to the Govt. to operate the only Arsenal we have left to produce small arms ammo and they are maxed out and have been. Winchester? Guess what, they have been outsourcing 5.56 from IMI(Israel) for years, white box Q3131a is IMI. Whether you shoot surplus or not, It has almost completely dried up and the prices have over doubled, what that means to you the shooter is less supply- more demand= higher prices on the way. I buy lots of ammo in case lots, and have to assume that you really are not aware of the quality stuff that is definetly NOT corrosive and is not crap! Australian, Portugese, Austrian, S. African 7.62 is top quality and accurate. Israeli and S.A 5.56 was great too, everything has about dried up though, just call some of the major ammo dealers and see what they have actually in stock. Ammo being sold at Cabelas, etc. is only a tiny fraction of what is sold nationwide, no surprise they are not out, in the scheme of things they are a minor player, plus, their stuff was ordered a year ago. Pay attention to what Max just told you, Police departments, which have a high priority, are on a year waiting list, where do you think your local sporting goods retailer is at on the list?
Collins, what the Army did not inform you would fill books. They probably neglected to explain the reason for lack of armor for Humvees and other light vehicle is due to the fact that we have only one plant left in the U.S. that produces armor plate, they have been going full bore for 2 years and will never catch up to the demand by the military. Everything else has gone off-shore and that precludes it from being used by the govt having Buy American in their contracts which creates a hell of a catch-22 for our soldiers. Folks better realize that we have exported much of our production off-shore and in time of war, we will be screwed. As for sources, try reading the paper, U.S. News and World Report, the Wall Street Journal, Metal Trades Journal, and, believe it or not, for some of the most accurate reporting on military issues/equipment, Soldier of Fortune Mag. I don't care if YOU believe me or not, you are singularly uninformed about issues that can and will affect your life. The far reaching effects of the "police action" in the sandbox are just starting to be felt here, and will show up for a long time to come.

quote:

Originally posted by lee440:
The far reaching effects of the "police action" in the sandbox are just starting to be felt here, and will show up for a long time to come.

Amen, brother. We've had the meat. Thanks George.roger

Total annual US military consumption of 5.56 ammunition is 1.4 billion rounds. Lake City Army ammunition plant (run by ATK) is only producing .8 billion, IIRC. The military is buying every single 5.56 round our US commercial producers can make. That gets us up to 1.1 billion. That is where IMI comes in with their annual .3 billion contribution.

Why does the US military call for 1.4 billion rounds a year? Because that is all that is available.

Many of the specialty rounds such as the M 262 Mod 1 are outsourced to smaller producers such as Black Hills.

The US M118 LR .308 sniper round (175 grain Sierra HPBT over some RL-15) is in CHRONICALLY short supply. Marine Corps and Army snipers routinely go on missions with one box of the good stuff. Black Hills is trying to fill that gap with their (more accurate) version (Same bullet, Winchester brass and TAC powder).

TAC powder comes from Belgium, RL-15 comes from Sweden, and IMR 4895 comes from Canada.

I believe this is called a "Peace Dividend."

LD

quote:

Originally posted by lawndart:
I believe this is called a "Peace Dividend."LD

Thanks for the eye opening info,Lawndart.Personally I think it is called " Ecconomic and greed" roger

Many types of brass are out of stock at websites that usually have plenty.

The gun stores are me have bare shelves.

It might be that at the wholesale level, the increase in brass price needs to make some shortages before the demand accepts the new price at the old volumes.

Round here things have gone well beyond a .223 shortage. I most cases the ammunition has simply became unavalible at the retail level. For months now wally World has only had the cheap Remington stuff, NO WWB to be seen. Academy hasn't had anything in their 223 slot on the shelf since opening

Remington 71/2 primers

Just recieved a brick of them.first in 8 monthes, ThEY HAVE RUN OUT AGAIN>
Billr

There is a price hike and run on all ammo right now. Blame it on the Chinese running up material costs (priced concrete lately?), hoarding, greed, military orders, ....whatever. Bottom line is prices are up.

Five weeks ago I walked into a local Gander Mountain and bought a flat of Federal shotshells for trap shooting and it was $3.99 a box. Today it was on sale for $4.99 a box. That is a 25% increase in five weeks.

Even .22 rimfire is up. I was buying cartons of .22 ammo for 10.99 at Wal-Mart in December. Today the best price I could find was $13.99.

Check out the prices on ammo at the big mail-order places; AIM, Ammunitionstore.com, Dan's, ammostore.com, etc. Everything is up.

Any of yall know the powder used in the 5.56 Mk262 Mod 0 round. The bullet is a sierra 77gr bthp.

Perry

the way i get around the shortage is keeping my dilion fed with brass i pick up from ranges and other areas i go to shoot.my plinking loads stay cheaper then buying wolf. if those of you buying ammo, try reloading, i take the bad weather days that i cant go out shooting and load up a buch of plinking rounds and i use any reloadable case. just a thought

years ago, the guard and reserve units in Boise used to sell their brass as scrap to a local dealer I knew. I used to buy it cheap, like $10 per thousand. Then, over the winter prep it by hand with the Dillon tools, then hand prime with the Lee unit. He told me about six years ago that they were going to stop selling it locally and have to return it, case for case, to receive new stuff credit for the next year. I bought 15,000 cases, and have seen NO more since then.

Without taking sides, it does seem, well...odd, that the old tax and spend demos under Bill Clinton had a zero deficit budget and the "cut taxes and government growth" republicans under Bushie have undone all that. Add NAFTA, and the push to move all manufacturing off-shore; and we have set the table to serve up the USA as a consumer and service-sector economy down the road. The govt reports all Social Security $$$ coming in as income, and removes the monthly checks as a debit. According to Forbes Magazine, we are over seven-trillion dollars (!) in debt.
That's a stack of $100 bills that will go to the moon and back a couple laps. Buy assault rifles and ammunition for them, and batten down the hatches...somewhere in the next ten years the ride is going to get a little bumpy.
I'll be here at the ranch if you need me!

Rich
DRSS

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Buy assault rifles and ammunition for them, and batten down the hatches...somewhere in the next ten years the ride is going to get a little bumpy.
I'll be here at the ranch if you need me!Rich
DRSS

Bumpy may be an understatement. We've been had ole buddy! roger

I hadn't noticed any shortage of .223 or .308 until I went looking . Surprise Surprise Sgt. .
The last Gun Show in my area about a month ago . I bought a box of 500 .308 & 500 .223 L C head stamp 96 - 99 for $ 5.00 best deal of the day . In the bottom of the .223 box were Appx. #300 9mm and #250 .45 . The guy said he was lazy and didn't want to separate them . OK by me . Now I'm kind of glad I picked them up .

quote:

Any of yall know the powder used in the 5.56 Mk262 Mod 0 round. The bullet is a sierra 77gr bthp.

Ramshot TAC

The surplus stuff is problematic right now, but the higher end brass is available.

When I make some bulk purchases later this year, I'll let you guys piggy back on it if you wish. For a reasonable price, I like Winchester .308 brass, and primed Remington brass for the .223.

For high end accuracy I use Lapua for the .308, and worked over Lake City for the .223/5.56.

You can get good service out of most brands of .223, you just have to invest a fair amount of time in brass prep. It pays off though. Sell off all your plinkers, and build one high end AR. You will be a lot happier in the end.

LD

I agree with Lawn Dart with the exception of Win brass !. I've had better luck with other brands if it's L C military then I'll use it after working it over . AR is fun as well as accurate .
I like my Bush Masters !. My Colt Commemorative is nice to look at .

Watch out for shooting Stars , if they ever get the dam things sighted in that is ...

50 cal BMG has dried up!

Remember a Number of Years ago we had the Primer scare.. Well it past in a few months.. This will pass too.. This is not a crisis unless you want Wolf Ammo..
AK

quote:

Originally posted by gas57:
50 cal BMG has dried up!

All the components are readily available and every flavor Cabela's and MidwayUSA offers are in stock. I'm just not seeing this huge ammo supply shortage.

I haven't noticed an ammo shortage here in the southeast yet. I have observed a ridiculous increase in ammo prices, however. I went to Sportsman's Warehouse yesterday to pick up a box of Speer 40 S&W 165 gr GDHP's. I did a double take when I saw $17.99 on the box. That's the same price as the corbon's. I paid $11.99 for the last box a few years ago. Just wondering if the rest of you have experienced such a dramatic increase in your area?

I have seen a $2 per box increase in .45 and 9mm ammo in just 3 months.

Maybe were gett'in ready for Something BIG.. The Mother of all Surges..
AK

Funny how the shortage of almost anything is cured by money !.
Primer scare ?. I've never been afraid of primers in my life . Only the cost of them !.Same with projectiles or brass cases it's all about more money . The faster I go the behinder I become !.

A good Ole Boy down Florida once told me this and I've never forgotten it .

When your up too your ass in Alligators , it's hard to remember your there to drain the swamp !.

Just got My Midway ..Seems we have plenty of Wolf for sale..
AK

Black Hills just suspended civilian .223 sales to make its entire production available to fill its military obligations.

According to the Winchester portion of the Olin annual report, they are feeling it too.

Seems the problem is not the price of copper, but the continuing almost daily increase in the price of lead! I guess we might want to ask ourselves, how much (if any) of a role is the ongoing U.S. government campaign against the use of lead in danged near everything affecting this?