With my Hi-Point FUBAR'd and my SKS currently holding a POI big enough to drive my metro through, I'm in the market for a new semi-auto. Caliber will be .223 because I plan on an Elk hunt later this year and I hear they hold still while you reload.
(just kidding)

My choices are:
Ruger Mini-14 (Durable yes, but its bad rep for accuracy excites me about as much as kissing my cousin... which isn't exciting... or so I hear)

Kel-Tec SU-16 (looks great on paper and I do have a thing for plastic, but are they any more accurate than the Mini?)

CA-Compliant AR (Have seen some of these freaky-deeky fixed magazine versions, and even a single shot of the AR-15... are they worth dishing out $900?)

So far I am strongly leaning for the SU-16B(bravo version) for a lightweight, but the Carbon-15 flattop looks sexy enough to sweet talk me into it's $1050 pricetag.

Who has first hand experience with these types of guns? Convince me!

If you care to take time and do an accuracy fix on the Mini14, they are excellent toys. Try looking here for info and tips.

http://perfectunion.com/vb/showthread.php?t=47444

http://www.accu-strut.com/
I have both, 14 and 30. Even with the reduced accuracy, I enjoy them both over my Colt AR15.

Not intended as a flame. But you say you will be getting a 223 cal rifle because you plan an elk hunt.Elk are rather large animals. The 223 cartridge is more a varmint round than medium to large game cartridge. If you are going to hunt game you need to insure as humane a harvest as possible.

muck

Errrrrrr, Elk with a .223? Reminds me of a friend years ago that took an Elk with a .243 BAR, came back from Colorado praising the .243 as the greatest Elk cartridge ever. He emptied that BAR at Elk for the next two years and came home empty handed every time, including having punctured a few probably pissed off Elk. I'd suggest that you forget shooting a barrage of 64-74 grain slugs at the distant Wapiti and invest in a more powerful rifle, like a 7mm Rem Mag or even a (bless me) .30-06.

LLS
Mannlicher Collector

In all honestly I do not condone the use of anything .22 cal on Elk, just my bad sense of humor and a couple Sierra Nevada Summerfests Should I ever get the opportunity, I agree with you sierra2, a 7mm Mag would be ideal.

I just want something that can quickly and consistently create empty brass in an affordable to feed caliber. My standard game are fruit, carbonated beverages and the ever elusive 500 yard gong.

A good friend from out of town owns an SU-16A type rifle, and I managed to handle said rifle this morning. His only complaint is the fron sight seems to wander some with a hot barrel(it is the larger plastic gaudy looking version). It feels great to handle and quick to point. He also has a KMini-14 and an M-1 Carbine (an option I forgot). Will be checking prices locally today to see what the competition looks like.

BP: If your wanting accuracy and cheap your not going to find it, even the accuratized Mini 14's won't run with the AR's. I've had extensive experience with both, 2 mini's and 4-5 AR's. The mini's shoot more what I would call a pattern rather than a group. I have no experience with the Kel-Tec so I'm of no help on that one.

My latest project was a AR in 204 R. I built the lower out of Rock River/JP enterprises parts and bought a Accuracy Systems complete upper, the upper carried a .5 MOA guarantee and it surpasses it easily, .25" 5 shot @ 100 or better are common, but it comes at a price. You would be out $1300-$1500 before optics for a setup like this. I also think if your wanting to stay with the 223 an off the shelf Rock River would probably be as good as you could get. Hope that helps some.

I recognized the humor in your post about elk hunting with the 223.

Previous experience with other people's Mini 14s and Mini 30s have kept me away from them, also.

I have a CA compliant AR type rifle, min'es with the fixed magazine but my next one will probably be with a Monster Man grip (no pistol grip) and detachable magazine.

My first AR type rifle ran me about $800 last year built from a kit.

You can put a nice AR together from parts for $650 to $700. That is what I did.

Another option if you can find one is the (Heckler Koch) HK 630. They have 10 rd. magazine and the barrel has the polygon rifling, they are extremely accurate for a semi-auto rifle. However instead of the black rifle look they have a wood stock.
Also don't think about reloading your spent brass as it will throw them into the next county (just kidding), but you will a spotter to find them.

quote:

Originally posted by David Craig:
Another option if you can find one is the (Heckler Koch) HK 630. They have 10 rd. magazine and the barrel has the polygon rifling, they are extremely accurate for a semi-auto rifle.

I'll second that. Not only are they very accurate they are completely - and I mean utterly - reliable. If you can find an SL6 it might even be better, what with its plain wood stock, HK91 style sights, and no flash hider (why the walnut stocked sporter had a flash hider we'll probably never know). About the only downside is the goofy safety location on the left side of the stock just forward of and above the trigger. Both of these fine rifles, their factory scope mount, and magazines (five ot ten rounders) are all pretty spendy these days though. There are days I wish I hadn't sold my 630.

If you don't plan to reload the HK is alright. The brass looks like it was crunched by Visegrips and hit with a ball peen hammer. I sold mine.
The Mini 30 is inherantly more accurate than the 223. It has to do with barrel heat and powder used. That being said I sold mine there too. A good Arsenal AK is a better choice.
The Rock River Arms is excellent and Armalite makes 243 uppers for the AR-10

If you aren't poking holes in paper as much as rabbits and coyotes the mini-14 would be fine and no hassles from the nazis.

I have an older 181 series that shoot as good as the picture of the mini "with" this stiffening device. Tune the trigger and check the gas block and most will be minute of rabbit. They don't cost as much, and some real bargains can be had.

I bought one and cleaned it, removed, cleaned, reinstalled the gas block, worked the trigger over and took it out shooting. The guy at the range that day offered me 2x as much as I'd payed. I owned it all of a few days. It was shooting 2" groups with no bench bags, a low power scope, and white box ammo.

I will say this though, if you want precision, build a Kalifornia AR. Nate

Go with the AR-15. This is one to those things where you get what you pay for. The mini 14 doesnt even compaer in my opion.