Started on load development a month or so ago...nothing good was going on...tried bullet weights from 85 to 129 - Horn, Nos, Sierra...etc, all the requisite powders, US869, Retumbo, H1000, Magpro and seating depths out to 0.005" off lands...Nothing was doing doodley....roughly 150 rounds fired and mostly krap.

The brass is made by Norma and is excellent 60 rounds weighing from 221 to 228 gr from 3 boxes of Weatherby brass with each box running only 2-4 gr variation for 2.0...most of which was due to a variation in untrimmed length which was about 0.002"...

A few days ago I threw up my hands as nothing I tried seemed to work and I was getting a bit concerned I would wear out the barrel before I got a load developed.

This has happened to me a few times in the past so it isn't new.

Basically I just started over weight/measure sorting cases, bullets, etc AND went to factory COAL.

Funny thing that...USUALLY the best accuracy comes just off the lands BUT exceptions happen...and this is one of them.

Starting a 3.59" COAL two shot groups were banging all around 1" with the 123 gr ELD's and MOST first shots were one centered and one 1/4" low and 1" LEFT with little variation in groups going from 91 to 93.5 gr US869 and changing COAL'S by 0.005" PER STEP...the only thing changing was impact point....each step moved 2" down....you can see the changes and think I reset the scope by 8 clicks...each group

The velo is on the slow side starting about 3300 fs, ~200 fs slower than factory...and about 0.100" off the lands.

Anyway I continue to learn a lesson a minute and remember that NOTHING IS CAST IN STONE no matter how many times "proven information" happens...there are always worms that get in the soup.

I will keep this load, do a 3 shot group to see if it holds and a 3 shot chrono to see what the numbers are. If it holds I think it will work for most game out well past 500 yds, ~1500 ft-lb energy and half second flight time...whats not to like.

Good Hunting



Good Luck

Nice!

Which Weatherby rifle is this?

Hummm...yes...Weatherby in name and cartridge only...it's actually a Vanguard or Howa 1500, 26" barrel...argumentatively...and a #2 contour to boot, 3 shots and don't touch the barrel for at least 5 minutes.

That last group was seated 0.100" off the lands. Factory ammo is 3.56" COAL and touching with this bullet is 3.71" COAL, 0.150" difference...I have 5 other 6.5's and they ALL do best at 0.005" to 0.015" off as do most of my other various hotties.

I'm not going to waste the barrel or components chasing other bullet weights or powders per se as this load is not much over 52 K with 100% load of US869 at ~3350 fs and has all the whack needed for medium sized game and it will do elk size or possibly larger even when it's frying bacon outside to 700-800 yds or so...not that I would take a shot that long, at that size animal with that small a caliber, but I am going to try Retumbo to see if the seating keeps the group at an additional 200 fs...long shots are all argumentative and contentious to the max anyway. The bullet is a bit controversial as to whether it is a "hunting" or a "target only"...I don't pay much heed to all the "stuff"...too much of it is hearsay or ....

This beast is be-definitely causing a rearrangement of my thought process as to what is and what isn't real and to keep the options open...I haven shot ANY caliber/bullet this far off the lands other than possibly factory ammo which is few and far between...definitely food for thought.

Good Hunting

I got one last week. Mine is the Kuiu camo stocked version. Haven't had a chance to shoot it yet, just got two boxes of ammo yesterday from Midway. What kind of dies are you using?

Was following Hill Country's work with the cartridge. They decided it was too touchy to support.

https://www.hillcountryrifles....6-5x300-wby-testing/

RCBS DIES...seating die run out was only 0.001-0.002"...I was getting ready to setup my Forster and Hornady comp dies but with that small amount I won't bother.

The amount of cycle squish was minimal, ~0.005" length and ~0.0005" dia with second fired cases...New cases were a different story...unfired Wby "Gold box" brass measured 2.395" - 0.017" from unfired to fired, 2.412" fired and 4.407" sized......that's almost outside SAMMI specs except for being belted cases. If this were a varminter shooting lots of rounds a season I would even exchange the shell holder for one about 0.003" thicker so the shoulder wouldn't get worked so much. As is 0.005" or so of shoulder set back is OK for a "hunter".

Hope it won't stay touchy and continue with small groups...it's mostly just finding combo's where the barrel vibes are nulled out for at least one bullet depth/combo then TRY that COAL or ogive point for others first, then go to cussin' if it whizzes backward. Sometimes it works, sometimes not...you know just how cranky ANY caliber can be for those looking for small groups.

Almost all my initial loads were in the >2", but a few went 4"...mostly vertical...experienced taught me that could be powder type, amount or pressure...Always thought that was a bit oxymoronic, WHAT else would be the cause???...and at roughly 3.69" to 3.71", 1 gr powder increments starting 10% down from the top...2 shot groups and one for the chrono...Yeah I know, but I've been doing it this way for a coons age and it usually always works for me.

I think one problem is that whippy barrel, could also be needing a 28-30" #4 contour or heavier...a consistent 1" group isn't bad if your not going after squirrels at long range...most big game have a 12" killing target area so theoretically thats 1200 yds if YOU'RE up to it.

I'm already looking for a better barrel..probably a #4 or 5 contour 30" minimum, straight taper maybe, if this tube doesn't "straighten up and fly right"...maybe do a 6.5 x 300 or maybe a 26 Nosler, they BOTH suffer from the same problems, but the WBY brass is about a dollar apiece cheaper...or not if this one fizzles out...time will tell. I just received the 28 Nosler reamer yesterday and I will do the chamber in a little while...I have everything else all set up ready to do a little testing once I know the finished throat dimensions and can get a COAL point for the 195 Berger's.


Thanks for the Hill link, I read that short blurb and will go to the main site for the full story to see just what/how they proceeded...maybe cut my process down a bit. I looked high and low for links to 6.5 x 300 information but Hill never appeared.

Whether a cartridge is deemed "touchy" or not depends on a lot of factors and basically means how much trouble it is finding a good load quickly...in that sense every rifle I've ever built or bought could be considered "touchy" or not. I've had/have several 308's and we all know what bullets and powders work best together to produce 1" groups and all of mine would do that very easily...but...not one of them will shoot a specific load that does bugholes in one, across the board for the most part...there is always a wide variation and it always seem to give me the redazzz to try to get two to shoot the same bughole...I gotta futz around and muck about, no different that any other caliber...AND...there are always exceptions and embarrassments.

My Dad's OLD first model Rem 788 would shoot the Sierra 135 gr HPBTM into tiny,TINY groups using the old LEE "Hammer" hand loader using the powder dipper that came with and whatever powder it listed(can't remember which powder)...I've tried to duplicate that load in every 308 I've ever owned or shot...not happening but many close and it's the same bullet I load for my 16" truck gun and one I always try with a new 308 barrel...if it shoots that load, it usually ends up a decent shooter...I used it many times at turkey shoots to bring home the bird before all the *^$(#@ got into the act. Can't understand that either considering the effort I put into producing a "tuned rifle and ammo".

You're right about this thing being what it is, Todd...Hi-Vel is what many of us live for and it's taken the gun makers and public a long to finally realize just how cool velocity is...but slow in coming...right time, right place...can't understand all the negativity surrounding these new cannons, but maybe conservatives are just slow in acceptance.

I think the price of a barrel is chump change compared to the other cost amounts over the useful life of the barrel.

Good Hunting

VERY nice...yeah, the old question..."do I or not"...I would try 3 more with the same 3 cases marked as to shot number to see if it could be case vol, neck tension, neck wall variation etc...might give you some valuable information. In the old days and somewhat even today for target and varmint rifles in small case, small cal platforms that show promise I will fire 50 "prepped" cases and set aside those that don't group within the accuracy parameter I want as part of my "tuning" process. It's a lot of work but still satisfying to have a dozen or so cases/load/bullet combo that just keep putting them in one hole and chrono numbers that don't hardly change from shot to shot.

8133 isn't available in this area off shelf...I can order from a couple shops and get it when they reorder powder and primers...whenever!!!. I just won't pay the freight/UPS/gov ripoff for a few cans. 143 gr is a bit heavy for my taste in this platform...I have many other cals that can handle that weight up into the 3300 fs plus range. In the bad old days when I only had a couple shooters, they did double and triple duty, 2 or 3 different bullet weights but now most rifles are built/bought for specific reasons and bullet weights. I wanted this one for 100-130 gr weights whichever brand/weight ended up most accurate. I'm guessing that extra velo will give me a couple more hundred fs over my 22-243 Midd, 6mm-284 and 6.5-284...hopefully.

I've gone through one box of brass almost twice...11 left to shoot and two of them I neck turned by 0.001 TIR to remove that pesky 0.001-0.0015" fat side.

I will install the MB on my 28 Nosler barrel in a little while and stock/scope it so I might not get back to this one for a few days or at least until I get some ammo built for the 28 and I can shoot both at the same time.

Keep chugging along...

Good Hunting

quote:

Originally posted by NONAGONAGIN:
Hummm...yes...Weatherby in name and cartridge only...it's actually a Vanguard or Howa 1500, 26" barrel...argumentatively...and a #2 contour to boot, 3 shots and don't touch the barrel for at least 5 minutes.

That last group was seated 0.100" off the lands. Factory ammo is 3.56" COAL and touching with this bullet is 3.71" COAL, 0.150" difference...I have 5 other 6.5's and they ALL do best at 0.005" to 0.015" off as do most of my other various hotties.

I'm not going to waste the barrel or components chasing other bullet weights or powders per se as this load is not much over 52 K with 100% load of US869 at ~3350 fs and has all the whack needed for medium sized game and it will do elk size or possibly larger even when it's frying bacon outside to 700-800 yds or so...not that I would take a shot that long, at that size animal with that small a caliber, but I am going to try Retumbo to see if the seating keeps the group at an additional 200 fs...long shots are all argumentative and contentious to the max anyway. The bullet is a bit controversial as to whether it is a "hunting" or a "target only"...I don't pay much heed to all the "stuff"...too much of it is hearsay or ....

This beast is be-definitely causing a rearrangement of my thought process as to what is and what isn't real and to keep the options open...I haven shot ANY caliber/bullet this far off the lands other than possibly factory ammo which is few and far between...definitely food for thought.

Good Hunting

Nothing at all wrong with Weatherby Vanguard or Howa 1500's, as I think your targets prove. Good luck. Sounds like a fun rifle and cartridge.

Absolutely...Howa's are the grease. Two of the most accurate 7 RM's I've had were a Howa 1500 and a Sav 111...had to hock the Howa for a Mommy gift...Mommy gone, Howa gone...totally WRONG (about the Howa )...still have the Sav. Both put the discontinued Nosler 150 SB into one nickle sized hole at 150 yds with a very stout load of 7828 well over SAMMI specs and most of the newer Nosler iterations do almost as well...wish I still had the Howa, tho'...sometimes.

Good Hunting