MY buddy has a 1894 CL Marlin chambered in 25-20 made in the early 80's he bought in new condidtion and has been having trouble getting it to shoot. The load he is using is the factory remmington 86 gr jacketed soft point. This gun shoots a shot group at 50 yards with less than a hundred rounds through it.

Can anyone help decifer the problem. So far his theory is that the bullet is too heavy for the rifling twist he believes to be 1-14.

Any light shed on this would be appreciated. Or direction to a formula to help deturmine a good bullet weight for the rifling. They had this formula on a cable shooting show but he was not quick enough to write it down.

Thanks

In factory, might try Winchester. My CL will do just over 1" at 50yd with them and a terribly this post crosshair. Handloading, Speer and Hornady all seem to be good bullets. For cast, my Meister 85gr are beautiful. Custom Cast offers both 65 and 85gr.

Sir: I have one of those 25-20 classics that shoots very well after I learned about it. (1) check the crown first, mine was factory bad, recrown. (2) check the headspace, mine was factory extra long, this means only partial resizing and handloading, or else locking lug, barrel work, or a bushed bolt to fix. I partially resize using a very thick washer to set up the sizing die for consistency. (3) the rifling twist on mine was 1/12 4 groove conventional, that means mine shoots the rem 86 very well, the lyman 257420 gc very well, the 75 speer very well, the 60 hornady I didn't try. Old 75 nosler hp solid bases didn't shoot well. Too long? I found in my 25-20 newby marlin frustration that 15.5 grains of ww748 with a rem 6 1/2 primer will put 8 of 10 in 5/8 at 50 yards. The traditional 296/4227/4198/whatever loads just didn't work for me. Seat your loads as long as will feed through the magazine and yet not jam into the rifling. I did however, file my cartridge lifter to feed 1.648 overall length in trying to make it shoot. Feeding shorter was still ok. I did not chrono this load but the pressure signs are reasonable. I use a lyman "m" die even with jacketed bullets as my rcbs f/l die sizes much too small. Oh, decap separately also. I use no expander in the f/l die. I do not crimp as this is a very slightly compressed load. Just don't "bell the mouth" with the "m" die. Chamfer the mouth nicely. I use AA 1680 and AA2200 with the speer 75. Enough to slightly compress powder at a length that will feed through without jamming into the rifling origin. Except for a not too bad flyer or two per 10 these shoot into 1/2", with no crimp. I believe the flyers come from neck tension problems. AA claims approximately 1950/2150fps. I believe it. These loads are powerful. I started putting the case in the 'M' die 2 or 3 times if it felt real tight the first time and this reduced flyers. I try to get the press handle feel the same, but sometimes you have a loose case also. Use the cartridges that feel odd in the bullet seating process for sighting in or other second class use. I use wheel weight cast lymans with a gas check seated square and with thinned lee alox lube substituted for the speer loads above with the same good results and very nearly the same point of impact. My midwinter shooting experiment this winter is to play with annealing 25-20 cases. I found also that 6 month old ammo doesn't shoot as well as yesterdays production. Neck tension? Hope this helps. The 25-20 is so much gun and fun I wish I had got a 32-20 too. Thanks to the shooters cast bullet people for the lube thinning tip, that really got my cast shooting for 25-20 going. regards, ned

My '94 Marlin 25-20 isn't the new production. It's circa 1906 with the 24" tapered Oct. barrel. When I got it the barrel was terrible, old corrosive ammo evidently. Sent it to a gunsmith to be relinned, and got it back with a 9 1/2" twist tube! Went ahead and tried the lyman 257420 GC bullets and it shoots suprisingly well for that fast of twist rate. I heat treat the bullets out of the mold and load them with 13 gr. of 4198. The Chronograph says 2068 average. I've shot this load for over ten years now and have had very few cases lost through many loadings. The barrel cleans up easily, and the load is pretty hard on small game. I've pulled off some pretty rediculous shots with this gun. Glad Grandpa and his uncle before him decided to keep it in the family.

I have a Winchester Model 53 in 25-20 which was made in 1924. Shoots under 1 inch with iron sights at 50 yards using the Hornady 60 Grain JFP over 11.7 of IMR 4198. It did not shoot factory ammo well at all.
Pete

I have 2 rifles in this caliber--a recent Marlin 1894CL and a much older Marlin M-27S. Both rifles like the Speer 75 grain FN and Hornady 60 grain FN, and don't do quite as well with the 86 grainer until it is kicked well past factory load velocity levels--a place I won't go with the older rifle. Powders have ranged from 2400 to IMR-4198.......that WW-748 trick sounds like it's worth a try.

I'm pleased that some others are jumping in on 25-20. After I posted I felt odd giving the 100$ answer since the originator was only mildly inquiring. But I had such a hassle with that durn marlin to get it going I really wanted to be helpful to anyone reading. By the way, the marlin throat appeared of a normal length, despite excessive headspace so my loaded length comes out at 1.596 for lyman, and 1.648 for speer and remington. I've shot lots of squirrels with the three bullets and the loads mentioned and just can't tell the difference, game wise, so have just about went to cast entirely. Its legal here so still am waiting for that perfect head/neck shot on one of our small deer. Good shooting to all.

Thanks Guys

I posted this friday and back at the office today.

I will certainly relay this information to my friend. He is a competent reloader so I'm sure this information will help.

Although I still havent found any information as to a formula or a information to help deturmine bullet weights/length/twist ratios etc.

Thanks Again
West Creek Charlie

Do a web search on "Greenhill Formula", and you should find an equation that will help figure that matter out. It's not perfect, but will get you pretty close to what you're seeking.