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I have noted that the 375 Taylor is showing up on a number of forums lately, and after working with this round in a ballistics lab for the past 2 months I find it quite curious that this cartridge is not part of the commercial market. This wildcat can be formed simply by stuffing and boat tailed 375 cal bullet into a 338 win mag case. Of course, you can use an expander ball and fully resize 338 brass if you want to, but it's not necessary. The resulting loaded round looks very similar to the 338 Win Mag, but is very, very different in the field. The only round that comes to mind that is similar is the 9.3X64, but the 375 cal bullets available to the handloader make this a stretch. The 358 Norma is also close, but again the 35-cal bullet selection for medium and heavy game pales by comparison. The subtle thing that happens when the 338 is necked up to 375 is that the internal ballistics of the 308 Win are created, but on a larger scale. In barrels of equal length, expansion ratio, and suitable powders are identical. This means that the 375 Taylor is very efficient, and in spite od having 10% less case capacity than the 357 H&H, the Taylor easily duplicates and in some cases exceeds the H&H velocities and effectiveness with the same 375 cal bullets. On top of this we have the long standing debate about the 338 Win vs the 375 H&H for big and dangerous game, and as the "one gun" that can be used to hunt anything anywhere". What the Heck is wrong with a single round with the best characteristics of BOTH? Now we have stumbled on a technique in the lab that provides the Hornady Heavy Mag and Federal High Energy load technology to the 375 Taylor. This allows the Taylor to launch 300 gr bullets at 2750 fps - quite close to factory 375 RUM loads and a tad quicker than the 375 H&H High Energy loads. Traditional handloads will launch a 225 gr Hornady at 3000 fps, 250 grainers a 2875, and 270s at 2750 fps. 300 gr flat based RNs easily do 2600 fps and the low drag boat tails 2550 fps. If you opt for a 1 in 10 inch twist, a 350 gr Woodleigh at 2400 fps makes more sense than a 416 anything in the US. | ||
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Quote: This is great news. Could you PM me the loading technique? MtnHtr | |||
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Quote: I can,,, it's called "load development"... the 375x338 is KNOWN to match the 375, and can do these things.,... it's a bit bigger than the 376 steyr, which i reload pretty extensively, and, well, start there and find your gun load... pretty basic stuff... jeffe | |||
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I don't mind telling everyone the general idea, as long as folks wait for us to do more testing...we need pressue equipment to do it right (safely). One of the advantages of the 375 Taylor is that you can theoretically pull a bullet from a 338 Win Mag factory round and seat a 375 caliber bullet of equal or lesser weight and shoot that round. Well, this in fact does work, and pressures drop while energy and velocity remains close. IN THE LAB, we have increased bullet weight to increase pressure and energy with this technique. Hornady Heavy mag and Federal High Energy factory loads in the 338 win Mag add 150 fps or so to the 338 while decreasing pressure, and they APPEAR to work the same way necked up to 375. Note that this approach is radical and unsafe since we have no control over charge weight: we are just adding heavier 375 bullets and examining the primers and brass. The sear is released remotely and the firearm is bagged and restrained. Actually the 375 taylor generates so much power this "Heavy Mag" experimenting is just out of curiosity anyway. Its not really needed unless you wanted some 2550 fps 350 gr loads for Africa or something. There are some good loads for the 375 Taylor associated with this web site at "Forums and Talk" then 416 Taylor Web page and finally under "loads". You will note the prominence of IMR 4064 and R15 for those that are both accurate and high velocity. We have found this to be the case as well. Some of those loads that go over 4700 fpe are not free lunches, however, and do have more recoil than the 375 H&H. If you back off on the R15 or 4064 with a 270 gr Hornady to get 2700 fps, you will have a nice, easy to shoot 375 H&H duplication load in an '06 length action. Back off a bit more to launch 225 and 235 gr bullets at 2600 fps, and you will have a 35 Whelen duplication load with a decent trajectory and moderate recoil. | |||
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Quote:Quote: Sabot wrote in response to loading technique: "Note that this approach is radical and unsafe since we have no control over charge weight: we are just adding heavier 375 bullets and examining the primers and brass. The sear is released remotely and the firearm is bagged and restrained" So Jeffe? Pretty basic stuff huh? Like building a WSM DGR?  MtnHtr | |||
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Mtnhtr, it appears you have some pretty set views on the world, and no amount of information will help you change them. Here's your pretty basic stuff http://www.geocities.com/bw_99835/375Taylor.htm And "heavy mag" load dev is just that, as the fella says, it's a lab excerise. Now, let's talk about "safety"... As you seem to think a wsm based round cant be made to feed, BUT you want to go 150fps faster than the load can (normally) be safely loaded. Hmmm, (assuming you are correct on the wsm) which is MORE dangerous? a round that EVERY TIME you pull the trigger could be over pressure, or a round that MIGHT (because your gunsmith didn't do his job) not feed? Here's a better question, since WSM's are .308 and DOWN, and anything above that is a wildcat, who would be willing to break the laws in ALL african countries were DGR's are used? next, MtnHtr, the wsm is based off the highly regarded 404 jeffery, for it's wonderful feeding... BUT, MtnHtr, having a smith that can MAKE a 404, and make it feed properly is ALSO a trick. A trick of experience. So, in short, if you FAR FAR FAR exceed known loads (oh, say more than 2-3%), you have ether stubbled upon a miracle, or are loading at higher pressures. And, loading a 375/338 to 65000PSI "only" results in 2690 ish fps... where the far safer 55000 psi "only" results in loosing 95 fps.. I don't expect you to understant the reply i have given you above, but I do ask you to back off, just a tad. jeffe | |||
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Quote: jeffe, The above quote says it all, you make many assumptions on what I posted earlier(and you are way off as anyone can read). I also think you misunderstood my posts as I was refering to the 375/300WSM wildcat instead of the 30cal on down WSMs. But you know that and would like to twist the subject angle. Yea, I'll back off out of respect for the forum as it's obvious you bit off more than you can chew. MtnHtr | |||
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fair enough.. perhaps we'll agree on more in the future' jeffe | |||
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YIPES!! What just happend to this thread???? WHO is loading the 375 Taylor to 65,000 psi? The Heavy Mag rounds probably don't even make 60,000. | |||
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WTF??!!! Belted mags typically are loaded to 64 kpsi. Some are loaded to the SAAMI spec of 65 kpsi. What's new here? Here's another method that was proscribed by my gunsmith - just fire you .338 round in the .375 bore. He claims he did it all the time. The bullet just rattles down the bore. The cases form fine. He claims it did no harm to the bore, but I could never get myself to do it. 15.0 gr of Unique, with a TP wad + Cream of Wheat + a beeswax plug works also for 338 cases. Better yet - just take a 458 Win case and run it thru your FL sizer for minimum headspace. It really impresses the guys around the campfire when you show them the 458 Win headstamp on your "mystery" wildcat ammo. | |||
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No kidding, you really can just seat a boat tail 375 in any 338 Win Mag case. No fireforming required. | |||
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The .375 Taylor always seemed to me to be a very common-sense wildcat. I suppose no big company ever domesticated it due to the .375H&H being entrenched in the minds of hunters. I look forward to more posts on this subject. Ignore the dueling flamethrowers in the topic. That was a urinatin' contest overflowing from another thread. Cheers, all. BigIron | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Wildcats And Their Development 375 Taylor: Best all around
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