Since the last topic (375 Ruger down to .308) generated so much interest lets try this.
Would it be worth the expense to neck it up instead of staying with a .416 Taylor?

Snowwolfe -- I understand that Ruger will be producing a .416 based on their new .375 Ruger. When it'll see the light of production remains to be seen, but I understand that this is the plan and it is very feasible.

This raises a question I have often wondered about - why not go to a new rifle/caliber with such a creataion? I've thought perhaps a .425 bullet diameter, and to my knowledge we have very few caliber/diameters between the .416 and the .458 with the exception of a handful of .44 calibers and these are generally somewhat less than DGR calibers.
Throw me a bone here and tell me why?

Not to make too small a point or appear to be flaming anyone...but...WHEN is the last time you saw a .425 cal bullet???? I've been around this sport for half a century...never in Africa...and I've never even seen a 425 Westley Richards cartridge much less a rifle chambered for it...although I wanted to build one about 30 years ago...Bullet availability is one GREAT problem.

What bullet maker is going to all the trouble to come up with a good bullet for an odd caliber when the web is full of people screaming about the Nosler BT or the Hornady SP or the Rem Core-Lokt or even the Winchester PP...all of which are good bullets and have been collecting the groceries for longer than I can remember. If I were a bullet maker I wouldn't waste my time coming up with a great bullet only to have the great unwashed masses bitch about it, they are not worth the sweat.

One other problem which I think is more pertainent is the need for a "middle sized" caliber...whatever that is. My mind says "if I want to hunt something my 416 Taylor...or any 416 cal cartridge won't handle, I want something...BIGGER, not something in the middle"...like something in the 600-750 cal...or a 50 BMG minimum.

Probably the third biggest problem is the "perception of need"...not too many gun makers think the American public would go for an oddball...look how hard it is go get us to look at the 8mm cal and it is one of the great calibers. The makers have to go with a name like 325 to get us to even look at one.

You...and I...and maybe a few others...might have a very valid point...but I think we are in the minority and I don't think the rest have earned the right yet to be in the august group.

No flame intended.

'Njoy

Would the 375 Ruger necked up to 416 hold more powder than the 416 Taylor?
How much, if any, speed would be gained?

Dear Snowwolfe:

I cut and reformed some 416 Remington cases into 416 Taylor cases and measured the internal capacity before I made them into dummy rounds for a 416 Taylor project I was working on. Presently, I have dropped that idea, and chose to build a 416 Ruger instead.

So, here are the capacities:

416 Taylor (416 Rem. Mag. Rem-Peters case reformed) - 89.50 grains of water, and

416 Ruger (375 Ruger case necked up) - 100.70 grains of water.

Sincerely,

Chris Bemis

Thats a big increase!
How far along are you with this project?

I think if you do a search, you will find that this subject has been absolutely worn out on the Big Bore forum for months. If I am not mistaken, some reamers have been ordered and maybe one or two chambered, but I may be wrong. I think most people (including me) are waiting for Ruger to be sure the chamber matches the factory round.

I talked with some Hornady folks in their booth at the Dallas Safari Club show last week. The one guy who was most forthcoming runs the brass production line for Hornady. He said Ruger and Hornady R&D has been looking at new cartridges based on the 375 Ruger case. The 416 Ruger is one of those possibilities. He added that Hornady schedules their production runs for a full year in advance and that the 416 Ruger was not in this year's plan.

He did confirm that Hornady will bring out their 404 Jeffery ammo and components in mid-2008.

I could get excited about a 416 Ruger if it ever achieves non-wildcat status.

quote:

Originally posted by FOOBAR:
Not to make too small a point or appear to be flaming anyone...but...WHEN is the last time you saw a .425 cal bullet???? I've been around this sport for half a century...never in Africa...and I've never even seen a 425 Westley Richards cartridge much less a rifle chambered for it
'Njoy

FOOBAR,
Heaps of "425" projectiles about, they're actually 0.423" but the 425Express that Savage briefly chambered for has added to the confusion regarding true size of projectile. The 425WR actually ran a 0.435" projectile.
Cheers...
Con

Dear Snowwolfe:

I'm about 1/3rd of the way on the 416 Ruger project. The rail work is done and the bolt face is opened up. My biggest issue centers around modifying the original 1908 Brazilian magazine box to correctly feed the 416 Ruger cartridges.

I'm buying a lathe later this year to finish it all by myself. Also, I'll be using a #4 416 Lilja SS barrel with a walnut stock and cross bolts.

I'm still betting on 416 Ruger factory cases by the end of this year.

Sincerely,

Chris Bemis

Sorry, Con...I was talking about my side of the Big Water, not Australia or the European continent.

The argument still holds true...very few available in my catalogues...except for special runs or custom made bullets...Woodleigh, Barnes and A-Square mostly. Of course, those are all the ones I would use.

My point was and still is...availability and choice is very limited, and the perceived need is almost zip to nil...not withstanding the fact that the cartridge is and has been excellent for it's use. I had the same problem years ago when I wanted to build one...component availability...which is why I didn't continue the project. Now there is no need for me to do one.

I think I need to stop the tongue-in-cheek/eye-wink, slightly sardonic way of posting...seems to be quite a few with lowered levels of humor receptivity. There are times to get totally serious, but for the most part if we can't snicker at ourselve a bit it gets to be a very dull world.

quote:

Originally posted by FOOBAR:
Sorry, Con...I was talking about my side of the Big Water, not Australia or the European continent.

FOOBAR,
Ah yes ... the less cultured "we invented them all" side of the pond ... I understand now. Its true that "0.425" projectiles are harder to source and definately with less variety. Same reason's kept me out of a 0.411" bore though I'd love to have one ... just to be different.
Cheers...
Con