Gents!
I am now in on my third day of cleaning my rifle and the patches still come out blue and black depending on if I have them wet or dry.
I can also see a black area around 10" inside the barrel where the resistance increases when I push the dewey through.
So far I can see no difference in the barrel regardless of how many patches I put through.
I am using shooters choice extra strength copper remover, and when the patches come out they are dark blue, and that is not from the jag.

How to resolve this and remove the fouling in the middle of the barrel?

sincerely
Daniel

Try pouring a couple of pints of boiling water down the barrel.It's amazing how much crud this will loosen.Try Wipeout cleaner and leave overnight.
rob

Wipeout.

Wipeout or Forrest bore foam will do the trick, just leave it in overnight for the best results.

Tim

Huglu: Wipeout is a foam cleaner that is beyond description in its ability to clean a barrel. It is available from a few places here in the United States, but I rather doubt you will find it in Sweden. If it is not available, maybe you could do a Google search for the product, contact the company and try to set up a distributorship, the stuff is that good. It takes the "chore" out of rifle barrel cleaning. By the way, are you using a brass brush in your cleaning process. I used up damn near a whole bottle of CR-10 from Barnes to remove copper residue until I found out that my using a brass brush between applications was turning my patches blue or green. Good Luck ... Tom Purdom

We have Forrest Bore foam available here in Sweden, no worries.

The best stuff I have used an uses is Robla Sol Mil tec !???

It´s great but it will eat your brushes..

/C

It's SUPPOSED to eat your brushes if they are made from bronze.

Use the bore foam to get to bare metal. Then you can try a "break in" regimen (shoot one, clean, ad nauseam), or you can try a mild abrasive (JB's, Flitz metal polish, Colgate tooth paste) and polish the inside of the barrel. Put the abrasive on a patch on a jag, give it 20 or so strokes where the constriction is, and repeat. 200 or so strokes is not too many. Can't really do any damage in a factory barrel with any of them. HTH, Dutch.

The idea behind using bore foams is that no brushing is required.

Tim

http://www.deerstalker.com/forrest.htm

Daniel
I have a Remington 700, Sendero, 25-06 that was nearly impossible to clean. I used the various cleaners, Montana Extreme proved to be the best. Finely I got a rubber, vinyl stopper from the drug store that fit the muzzle. Filled the bore with Montana and left it over night. While the chemicals worked I loaded up a bunch of scrap brass with 10 grains of 800X and some left over bullets impregnated polishing compound 12 course, 20 medium and 30 fine.
Cleaned out the barrel in the morning took rifle to the range fired the couse, cleaned barrel, fired the medium cleaned the barrel, did the same with the fine.
End of cleaning problem.
Jim

i use a combination of all methods except one to get my bore clean.I will not leave a liquid solvent in the bore overnight.Also,I find that only a brush can get the copper out from under the lands and unless i do that my 300wm won't shoot.

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
i use a combination of all methods except one to get my bore clean.I will not leave a liquid solvent in the bore overnight.Also,I find that only a brush can get the copper out from under the lands and unless i do that my 300wm won't shoot.

Hey you haven't got a leg to stand on.

1. If No.9 is a solvent, my bores are always soaking, unless I'm off shooting.

2. After 4 shots with my .458WM that no one wants to talk about, 20 odd hours over-night
of only No 9 got a fair bit of copper out.

3. A brush will scrape embedded cu out? You could save a lot on solvent costs.

4. If a solvent will work on copper it will work on cu anyware. A TIGHT patch should push the
residue out.
5. Your obviously not leaving the solvent in long enough.

Pirouette on that.

only novices soak their bores

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
only novices soak their bores

Chuckle
I believe that you believe what you are saying.
Jim

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
only novices soak their bores

Well I can't argue about the first bit.
But, "soak" might be a bit misleading.

When I'm nearly clean I just patch some No. 9 in, and put her away muzzle down. Day or a week later, quick patch out and off I go.

When the Mrs. says I'm a lazy lay about, I can claim I'm cleaning my guns .

and leave solvents in them overnight

Shotaway,
Is that a question?
No, I leave Hoppies No. 9 in from overnite to whenever the gun is used again, could be weeks even, to prevent rust while doing a bit more "solving" on the side. Says so on the label, and would they lie?

But sure I wouldn't trust the stuff to prevent rust for long in a bad environment, but would I live in a bad environment?

1) Fill the bore and let soak according to directions ( i let it soak overnight)

2) This is what you see the next morning...


3) The first patch through the bore looks like this...


4) This shows the puddle of copper that dripped out of the barrel and what the fist patch pushed through the bore.


5) This shows the second patch through the bore and the black on the patch is powder fouling. A second (sometimes a thrid is needed) application get's rid of the powder fouling.


That's why the guys that use Wipe Out reccomend it so much to the guys that don't.

One soaking, one patch and the copper is gone.

PS - no ammonia.

Gents

Thanks for all the replies, it makes it easier to try to get the barrel clean. So far I have managed to get rid of around 50% of the visible copper residues in the barrel. I allowed the copper remover to work a bit longer than the 10 minutes it were supposed to work and then I got the exact same colour as in the pictures out from the barrel and then half of the black stuff was gone. Going at it again now, and if it is not gone now, I will let it soak overnight with forrest milfoam.

I have ordered some JB bore paste and I also wonder about the KG12 stuff. What is that and is it good?

quote:

KG-12 was developed to clean the copper fouling from large bore military weapons. KG-12 will provide shooters with a product which will remove the toughest of copper fouling without harming any other metal. Unlike other etching, ammonia based cleaners, KG-12 will not hurt the metal of the bore. There is no need to "neutralize" KG-12 like you do with other Ammonia based products and no need to "get it out quick" like ammonia based enchants. KG-12 contains no ammonia . KG-12 is water based . KG-12 will remove the worst of copper fouling, and it will do it fast. KG-12 contains no synthetics. KG-12 was field tested on howitzers (One Million Dollars each) and other large bore guns with outstanding results.When used in conjunction with KG-2, KG-3 and KG-4 you will find no better cleaning system on the market. In general you can call KG-12 the Million Dollar Gun Cleaner!

quote:

Sounds like a all promising unique advertising thing to me, but if it would work half as good as it sounds, then it would still be very good.

/Daniel

Daniel,

Milfoam is the maker of Forrest Bore Foam, a similar product to WipeOut, works just as well as far as I can tell. Milfoam's Swedish dealer is Normark, perhaps you can contact them.

http://www.milfoam.fi/flash/index.html

NORMARK SKANDINAVIA AB
Box 74
Torsgärdet
782 22 Malung
Sweden

Tel: +46 (0) 280 125 65
Fax: +46 (0) 280 714 00
Email: info@normark.se
http://www.normark.se

Wrongtarget
Thanks for the suggestion, I have one can of forrest Milfoam that I have used to soak the barrel overnight with cleaning the following day. So far it have been held in 2 nights, and the fluid is just as blue in the pics above, but there is still the same visible black stuff on the rifling half way in the barrel. It gets a little less every time but it is still there...
For the moment I use the extra strength copper remover and allow it to work on the fouling a little longer than those 10 minutes suggested on the box.
How long can the shooters choice copper remover stuff be left in the barrel without damaging it?
I have given up the attempts on physically abrading it since it gives no results whatsoever, apart from bruising the dewey rod when it touches the extractor pin.

I shall now have a cup of coffee with my brother as the solvent eats copper and then I will give it another attempt to see how much copper is removed this time.

/Daniel

The nice thing about the foam products is they won't harm the unfouled part of the bore, that can't be said of some ammonia based products, but I think I would rather use the foam and take longer than to risk damaging the unfouled bore since it's impossible to use it on the fouled portion only.

The foam has a tendency to settle in the bottom of the bore when the rifle is horizontal, for heavy fouling I lay the rifle on its side for half the soak period, say 10-12hrs or so, then turn it on the other side for the for the remainder of the time.

Either that, or just reapply the foam after 12 hours and lay it on the opposite side as some foam will run out one end or the other if you don't plug the bore.

I am now on the ?? day of cleaning the damn barrel. The bright side of it is that I get less and less visible fouling in the barrel, the bad side is that it will cost me a lot in solvents to get this thing clean. With any luck at the current pace it will be clean in a week or so. By then I will have used more than one can of milfoam on the barrel. Hopefully it will shoot better when it is clean. I doubt that the previous owner cleaned it at all, and now when I got some decent cleaning stuff I can give it a go to make it clean and see how it works then. What shall I use to plug the bore with and how do I make sure that the barrel is filled when I soak it? I have tried the EAR yellow standard foam plugs and they slow the fluid migration down but does not halt it.
The foam disintegrates after a while and leaves a lot less volume as compared to the filling.

I have some old military gun grease that I consider using in this gun. It is prohibited today due to causing cancer with skin exposure, and if it is left on a copper wite it will eat it completely in a week or so. The bad side is that it will be extremely hard to get all of the grease out since it is resistant to most solvents.

The battle goes on...

/Daniel

Daniel,

Try a piece of latex or nitrile from a pair of disposable gloves as a seal and the foam ear plug to hold it in place. I don't think the bore cleaner would attack it.

Another thing to try to get a full bore of the cleaner, would be to spray the foam in a container, let it liquify, then pour the bore full and plug it, leave it for a couple days!

Tim